Strike? Now?

[Boomer]

All good points Bob, but still nothing I'm going to strike over right now. I don't think anyone will argue your points about money, but to suggest that the unions should go on strike now, at time when our power is at an all time low is just wrong. Especialy for the F/A's who could be replaced very easily. I don't mean to sound like I'm disrespecting the F/A's, but how much F/A experiance did all the senior ones have when they hired on, mechs needed 3 years when I started, pilots i believe was 2500 hours, a F/A needed to be 21 with a high school education. Not saying that they are not a well educated group of people, but a masters degree isn't needed to be a F/A. They need to be realistic, how many F/A's are on a leave now, how many just drop all their trips, how many are on the sick list at any one time(about 1500 if it's not a holiday about 2500 if a holiday).

As an AMT, I just want to see the justifications you make when the TWU is eventually cornered into self-help and we still have X percentage of non-certificated workers on the floor with the company demanding that fully half of those in overhaul and 1/3 of those on the line are equally uncertificated.

LINK PROVIDED: First they came for...

 

[Bob Owens]

All good points Bob, but still nothing I'm going to strike over right now. I don't think anyone will argue your points about money, but to suggest that the unions should go on strike now, at time when our power is at an all time low is just wrong. Especialy for the F/A's who could be replaced very easily. I don't mean to sound like I'm disrespecting the F/A's, but how much F/A experiance did all the senior ones have when they hired on, mechs needed 3 years when I started, pilots i believe was 2500 hours, a F/A needed to be 21 with a high school education. Not saying that they are not a well educated group of people, but a masters degree isn't needed to be a F/A. They need to be realistic, how many F/A's are on a leave now, how many just drop all their trips, how many are on the sick list at any one time(about 1500 if it's not a holiday about 2500 if a holiday).

Unlike mechanics, where one can sign for the work of others each FA must be trained and qualified. Do you really think they could get thousands of FAS trained overnight? I dont, and like Boomer alluded to we will have to support them as well.

I doubt the airline could take on the APFA, I know they couldnt take on the APFA, TWU and APA all at once.

 

[Maark767]

All good points Bob, but still nothing I'm going to strike over right now. I don't think anyone will argue your points about money, but to suggest that the unions should go on strike now, at time when our power is at an all time low is just wrong. Especialy for the F/A's who could be replaced very easily. I don't mean to sound like I'm disrespecting the F/A's, but how much F/A experiance did all the senior ones have when they hired on, mechs needed 3 years when I started, pilots i believe was 2500 hours, a F/A needed to be 21 with a high school education. Not saying that they are not a well educated group of people, but a masters degree isn't needed to be a F/A. They need to be realistic, how many F/A's are on a leave now, how many just drop all their trips, how many are on the sick list at any one time(about 1500 if it's not a holiday about 2500 if a holiday).

It may only be a one day strike. I think the APFA is well aware of whats going on in the world. In 1993 , they called an eleven day stirke and we were back to work in 5 days. The strike worked and we achieved a much better contract than what was on the table before the strike.
Dont be afraid of management, thats what they thrive off of .....
Stay true to the union and be proud. Being in a union works...
PS What ever you do, dont cross... you'll never forgive yourself for doing that... I saw it happen in 1993 and til this day I still hold back from talking to the scabs.

 

[MERV]

Unlike mechanics, where one can sign for the work of others each FA must be trained and qualified. Do you really think they could get thousands of FAS trained overnight? I dont, and like Boomer alluded to we will have to support them as well.

I doubt the airline could take on the APFA, I know they couldnt take on the APFA, TWU and APA all at once.

I agree with you if they strike all once it will be hard to replace so many employees. That will send a message to Sr. management. They'll be ready for that type of strike by getting court injunction to stop the strike or the President might step in.

 

[DallasConehead]

I agree with you if they strike all once it will be hard to replace so many employees. That will send a message to Sr. management. They'll be ready for that type of strike by getting court injunction to stop the strike or the President might step in.

The company can't get a "court injunction" to stop a strike once the cooling off period has expired.

 

[aamechntx]

Bet the prez sets up a PEB, which would allow any strike to last about two seconds.

 

[Duke787]

As an AMT, I just want to see the justifications you make when the TWU is eventually cornered into self-help and we still have X percentage of non-certificated workers on the floor with the company demanding that fully half of those in overhaul and 1/3 of those on the line are equally uncertificated.

LINK PROVIDED: First they came for....

That's a good point, if we're at that point, but we're talking F/A, I don't see the company putting F/A helpers on the flights, I don't see the company going after F/A's schedule like they did in 93 (a good reason to strike). What I do see is the company not giving us as much money as we deserve, well most of us, this is a union.

 

[Duke787]

The company can't get a "court injunction" to stop a strike once the cooling off period has expired.

You guys need to remember history, AMFA went on strike, but weren't all let go into their 30 cooling off period until NWA was ready with scabs. TWA F/A thought they couldn't be replaced, but they were, read the articles from the beginning of this thread.

 

[Hopeful]

I may sound like a broken record, but there will be no strikes allowed in the airline industry due to economic conditions.
Just not going to happen. Stay on the job and show the company exactly how you feel.

I just do not see it happening under the RLA.

 

[Duke787]

Unlike mechanics, where one can sign for the work of others each FA must be trained and qualified. Do you really think they could get thousands of FAS trained overnight? I dont, and like Boomer alluded to we will have to support them as well.

I doubt the airline could take on the APFA, I know they couldnt take on the APFA, TWU and APA all at once.

Bob, they don't need to train thousands of F/A overnight, they'll have plenty of time train scabs while NMB doesn't release the union until the company is ready then add another 30 days on top of that, just like what happen at NWA, when they replaced mechanics.

What makes you think the 3 unions will stick together, the flight crews have free flight privledges on other airlines and jumpseat privelidges for themselves, the pilots keep tring to get the higher catagory of non-reving for them and their family. It's a good theory thinking that all three unions will stick together and the NMB will release us all at the same time and the company hasn't learned that the F/A's are a force to be reckoned with. I think the company will be ready and they will be able to get any contract they want with the scabs just like what TWA, and NWA did to their workers who went on strike.

Bob you also said AMFA was the way to go and I believed you, but after what happened at NWA and UAL with AMFA, it seems like AMFA was just a great idea, but not a practical solution. I will no longer go by theory I'll just look at it from practical stand point.

 

[lineguy43]

You guys need to remember history, AMFA went on strike, but weren't all let go into their 30 cooling off period until NWA was ready with scabs. TWA F/A thought they couldn't be replaced, but they were, read the articles from the beginning of this thread.

Well during our first contract negotiations at NW under AMFA in 2001 pre 9/11 it took forever to get a release and then when we did get released Bush stepped in with a PEB. But you have to remember we did most of our work in house at that time much like AA does. After that NW pretty much made up their minds they were not going to be put over a barrel again and spent the next few years recruiting scabs as well as farming out most of the work (that is another major screw up AMFA let happen) by the time our contract came up for amendment the framework was already in place and we actually got released from the NMB in record time because NW wanted a strike. They were having to pay the scabs and pay us too. AMFA's big mistake was calling a traditional strike when all they would have had to do was to have us come to work. NW would have been forced to lock us out. That would have allowed unemployment to be collected in all the states and we more than likely would not have had as many people crossover as we did.

 

[DallasConehead]

To all the NWA strike fear mongerers. Where is NWA now? In the scrap heap of airlines that are gone, thats where.

You guys need to remember history, AMFA went on strike, but weren't all let go into their 30 cooling off period until NWA was ready with scabs. TWA F/A thought they couldn't be replaced, but they were, read the articles from the beginning of this thread.

I agree with you if they strike all once it will be hard to replace so many employees. That will send a message to Sr. management. They'll be ready for that type of strike by getting court injunction to stop the strike or the President might step in.

My point was that there is no such thing as a court injunction as Merv posted.

 

[Ifly2]

Reading about the strikes at TWA and NWA, they were not succesful. They also happened when times were good compared to today's economic enviroment. I have no doubt that AA could replace the pilots, mechs and F/A's. It would be painful for AA to replace the mechs and pilots just because of the vast amount of experiance it takes to be proficient in our careers. But for a F/A it would not be that hard to. Not to make lite of a F/A job, to do safety checks and be nice to the pax it doesn't require a whole lot of experiance. If the F/A job was so horriable why is there so little turn over with the personal? Below are links to articles about the strikes.

Just to be clear, I believe all the airline employees deserve a raise, but to go on strike now is a mistake for any work group.

http://www.cpcs.umb.edu/labor_notes/files/08905.pdf

http://www.usatoday.com/travel/news/2005-1...st-strike_x.htm

http://books.google.com/books?id=EY2WGe62K...FFA&f=false

Now? Yeah! Definitely!

Kick 'em while they're down... that is the only time they have any incentive to really negotiate...

Lesson from lang ago, reinforced by Arpey and his "leadership" "team".

And, Yeah, I am serious... as the proverbial heart attack.

See ya' on the line

 

[Large Grey]

Reading about the strikes at TWA and NWA, they were not succesful. They also happened when times were good compared to today's economic enviroment. I have no doubt that AA could replace the pilots, mechs and F/A's. It would be painful for AA to replace the mechs and pilots just because of the vast amount of experiance it takes to be proficient in our careers. But for a F/A it would not be that hard to. Not to make lite of a F/A job, to do safety checks and be nice to the pax it doesn't require a whole lot of experiance. If the F/A job was so horriable why is there so little turn over with the personal? Below are links to articles about the strikes.

Just to be clear, I believe all the airline employees deserve a raise, but to go on strike now is a mistake for any work group.

http://www.cpcs.umb.edu/labor_notes/files/08905.pdf

http://www.usatoday.com/travel/news/2005-1...st-strike_x.htm

http://books.google.com/books?id=EY2WGe62K...FFA&f=false

TWU won't do it. The F/As will.

 

[BoeingBoy]

My point was that there is no such thing as a court injunction as Merv posted.

A Federal Court issued an injunction preventing NW FA's from striking (CHAOS was the plan, I believe). But that was when NW was in bankruptcy and the judge said that NW made a "persuasive case" that the strike might be illegal.

Article

Jim