RJ 900's for PSA-- REJECTED!

[gabby]

Baloney. The EMB-190 is NOT an ERJ. The EMB-170-190 platform is a full-sized medium jet with comfortable, mainline-sized 2x2 seating, large overhead bins, a full stand-up cabin (not "stand up if you're a munchkin") and big, eye-level windows. It's a great airplane.

The CRJ-900, on the other hand, is a CRJ-200 stuck in a taffy puller with the attendant abysmal ergonomics and gate-check hassles.

The CR9 sucks, full-stop. The EMB-190 is a 747-400 by comparison.

I am sorry, we should get paid by how big the windows are! What was i thinking!

 

[smfav8r]

I am sorry, we should get paid by how big the windows are! What was i thinking!

Travis does have a point, they are completely different machines when it comes to passenger comfort.

But that being said, they hold the same amount of passengers.

All of the pilots at regionals have been grossly underpaid for years. The equipment keeps getting bigger, but the wages stay the same.

By comparison, the 700 is a F28 and the 900 is the F100. (amount of seats give or take a few)

I would have to dig out an old U contract, but if I recall correctly, the top of scale on the F100 (5 years ago) was about $160 per hour.

Maybe the MEC needs to put the old F100 rates on the table and start from there. If Duane Worth (less) is serious about getting the wages up on these airplanes, that would be a good place to start.

 

[supercruiser]

I would have to dig out an old U contract, but if I recall correctly, the top of scale on the F100 (5 years ago) was about $160 per hour.

The Capt rate on the F-100 the last year US flew it was $189. That was a pretty fair penny flying a 98 seat plane from the hubs to mainly smaller cities. I'd love to see those days again. (I know it's fantasizing)

 

[flyin4peanuts]

Hey again Bluestreak,

I really hope you are accurate in your assumptions about PSA and the current 900 situation! It sounds like you have aquired hard facts which will benefit PSA in the end. I am very close with many in the training department and am hoping they hire another ground instructor or two or three VERY SOON....they are being outrageously overworked and are being pushed to the limit. Training upwards of two crews a day is absolutely ridiculous and utterly inefficient. WE are in desperate need of another GI.

Another valid point: if management knew the RJ-900s were on their way for sure (which I don't know is true or not), the training department should be preparing accordingly. Why hasn't "this hiring process" occurred yet?

Other than that, I am pleased with the progress the company has made with management in the pursuit of the CRJ-900s. I think both parties are acting in the best interest of the company and this pilot group. PSA needs to begin preparing for this onrush of hiring immediately. Please update us if any other hiring information becomes available! Until then, take care Bluestreak and always fly safe

Any further news other than the MEC announcement on Tuesday night? Has the three days of dialogue led to any kind of successful outcome? WTF! Is this ever going to end :angry:

 

[flyin4peanuts]

Any further news other than the MEC announcement on Tuesday night? Has the three days of dialogue led to any kind of successful outcome? WTF! Is this ever going to end :angry:

Another day in the dark... :down:

 

[Furloughedagain]

Another day in the dark... :down:

You've been in the dark for a lot longer than a day.

 

[Bluestreak]

Another day in the dark... :down:

There is no news until an agreement is reached. An agreement has not been reached yet. What do you want to hear from your MEC? Your negotiating committee is in on going talks with management. That's all there is to say. If you can't take being in the dark for two months regarding the 900s; you're going to have a hard time waiting through contract negotiations. Contract negotiations can drag out for years and there is no news reported until a TA is reached.

I know it's tough waiting when you are an FO. These new jets mean the difference between reserve and line holding, FO or captain, and most importantly poverty and middle class. You're stuck trusting a bunch of people you don't even know with the fate of your career (or so it feels when you're an FO). We have all been in your shoes. It sucks, but you're going to have to wait. Any info released by the MEC weakens our negotiating position. Please trust your elected officers. Mark Stanley, your MEC is one of the most intelligent and politically savvy pilots at PSA. You can trust that this guy is looking out for you.

 

[supercruiser]

I know it's tough waiting when you are an FO. These new jets mean the difference between reserve and line holding, FO or captain, and most importantly poverty and middle class.

Particlularly the former mainline pilots (almost 2000 of them) that are furloughed so other airlines could fly their passengers on their former routes with 70, 90, or more seat jets. Sorry if I don't feel your pain.

 

[mullet]

Particlularly the former mainline pilots

They we all offered Captain positons at most of these regional carriers, unlike DAL,UAL, NWA. Stop your whining.

 

[fr8tmastr]

Particlularly the former mainline pilots (almost 2000 of them) that are furloughed so other airlines could fly their passengers on their former routes with 70, 90, or more seat jets. Sorry if I don't feel your pain.

Amen!

 

[flynomore]

They we all offered Captain positons at most of these regional carriers, unlike DAL,UAL, NWA. Stop your whining.

===============================================

Since less than 200 are still at J4J I do believe that statement is incorrect. AAA ALPA has some issues with the lack of back filling of vacacies.

In any case, if you compared your trips to what formerly was flown by AAA pilots on 737-200, DC9, F100 and F28 aircraft you would see what exactly animates those 1988-1990 hires.

Then think about how your groups posturing sounds now after you all undercut the rest.

When we had strong scope, you all complained that it hurt your advancement. Now we have no scope and you complain that it hurts your advancement.

I gotta laugh.

 

[mullet]

In any case, if you compared your trips to what formerly was flown by AAA pilots on 737-200, DC9, F100 and F28 aircraft you would see what exactly animates those 1988-1990 hires.

Not here to debate. Compare those trips to what your doing at mainline now??? Unfortunately those schedules and pay no longer exist within the US Airways Group. Your company, not some F/O at a sh1ttly little regional change that.

 

[Nebucanezzar]

Supercruiser has a good point.

Mullet has a good point.

My point:

Bickering amongst ourselves does little to solve the problem and only serves to strengthen those who would pit us against each other.

 

[Crzipilot]

Interesting comment by Parker in the crew news on the hub. He was talking about the 50 seaters, and to paraphrase, He says, Ok let me talk frank here. Those 50 seaters, they had a purpose. You see, you legacy guys were getting too much money, and well the main reason everyone wanted the 50 seaters was because the pilot pay was so much less at the regionals than the ML's. I.E. OUTSOURCE. but alas he says, now that the legacy pay rate has come down, well the extra expense it is to operate these 50 seaters, they need to get rid of them......I.E. they were for one reason, ...to lower mainline pay rates...

BTW, let me add....it's all frigin intertwined, "the faults" It's not one singular event or person etc. The sh888ty regional is at fault. The Mainline is at fault, ALPA is at fault, and certainly the pilots that choose to continue to fly at rates we feel are less than what they should be, (which I fathom to think, includes about all of us....)....

So wasn't trying to point fingers, just interesting how frank Douggie was...

 

[aquagreen73s]

Interesting comment by Parker in the crew news on the hub. He was talking about the 50 seaters, and to paraphrase, He says, Ok let me talk frank here. Those 50 seaters, they had a purpose. You see, you legacy guys were getting too much money, and well the main reason everyone wanted the 50 seaters was because the pilot pay was so much less at the regionals than the ML's. I.E. OUTSOURCE. but alas he says, now that the legacy pay rate has come down, well the extra expense it is to operate these 50 seaters, they need to get rid of them......I.E. they were for one reason, ...to lower mainline pay rates...

BTW, let me add....it's all frigin intertwined, "the faults" It's not one singular event or person etc. The sh888ty regional is at fault. The Mainline is at fault, ALPA is at fault, and certainly the pilots that choose to continue to fly at rates we feel are less than what they should be, (which I fathom to think, includes about all of us....)....

So wasn't trying to point fingers, just interesting how frank Douggie was...

Crzpilot, I looked on the hub but couldn't find that quote. Was this a recent quote by Parker?

For the life of me I cannot understand how mainline's legal bargaining agent, ALPA, could get away with never questioning RJ economics. I can't understand why the membership never held Herndon's feet to the fire on that one. Whatever pay scale savings existed were more than offset by the significantly higher CASM of 50 seat RJs.