Nov/Dec 2013 Fleet Service Discussion

[Harry Callahan]

What did the pilots get? Was it triggered by yesterday?

Pilots got 35 %

Harry

 

[Harry Callahan]

Day shift did really well, I think maybe one or two from what I heard and seen. PM shift, unfortunately quite a few drank the kool aid and ate the food. But in respect to them, our own union IMO from the grand lodge on down should have made yesterday a much bigger deal than we did. I was more disappointed with that.

CB
I'm shocked..........not
Harry

 

[necigrad]

Well, I don't have respect for them. If you can't have solidarity to stave off a pizza buyout then how would you ever achieve enough people for a work action.

I don't condone what they did, but we need to look at the situation.  NOTHING (that I'm aware of) was shared to the membership as a whole about a boycott until the day of.  I fully support the plan to boycott those parties, but the union should have stepped up and spread it around to the membership in advance.  They KNEW this was coming, they should have made the plans known.  It's not a job action so it's perfectly legal for the union to ask the members not to participate in protest.  Had plans of a boycott been well publicized I'd have a different opinion.

 

[robbedagain]

Ill be the first to admit I did not attend the party... in part was not at work but even if I were given the distance btwn our area and aa (where the party was) i still wldnt of gone to it anyways contracts now lock n loaded

 

[rockit2]

When will it end, spread the wealth but if you pay dues to the IAM, you get fu&%ed. Work action now. Bill Genovese called it gorilla warfare.
It all starts on the tarmac. When the public cries, management listens.

 

[cltrat]

the public couldn't give a damn less about what we're paid, in fact they probably think we're overpaid as it is.
someone needs to be smart enough to appeal to the public about their bag getting there then you might have something otherwise you're peeing into the wind.

 

[robbedagain]

Workin by the exact rules and if the planes take delays too bad then that ought to get attention too

 

[Jimmy Neutron]

IAM Skips 'New' American Airlines' Debut
 
http://www.4-traders.com/news/IAM-Skips-New-American-Airlines-Debut--17588657/
 
IMO the IAM completely missed the boat being that Monday was maybe the biggest media day possibly in the history of the airline industry since the days of the decease of Eastern and Pan Am  and TWA!!! At the very least, these kinds of articles along with the naming of names (AL Hemmingway) and the negotiating tactics they use should have been plastered over EVERY single newspaper/media source and The Upper Echelon Leaders of the IAM Intl. should have been on every TV/News/ Public conduit with facts and figures about how this Management team has absolutely battered and continue to beat the backs of their own workers who were the ONLY one's who made this day possible!!!!!!!!! All that's been really put out there is little articles like this one which most of the world will never see !!!
 
Sad, as this days been coming for some 12+ months---so there was PLENTY of time to prepare for it !!!!!! VERY DISAPPOINTING !!!!!!!!  

 

[mike33]

Workin by the exact rules and if the planes take delays too bad then that ought to get attention too

How about reporting all the nets that are broken. That is a simple one as its a big company issue. There are a few more items that can be addressed later. Its really not that hard!! I'm sure if you had a check list that there would be a lot of looking on every flight. A little wallet size card that fit in your wallet. 

 

[ograc]

The IAM's potential ability, of at least delaying the filing for SCS, should be reason enough for the company to start negotiating in good faith. You would think the company's reasoning would be offer meaningful contracts under Section 6 to the US MTC. & Related and Fleet in an effort to promote labor peace. Subsequently, this would expedite the forecasted synergies of the merger through mutual transition agreements. Historically though, both US and AA have grown accustomed to negotiating labor agreements under the protection of bankruptcy; which is equivalent to forcible rape. With that being said; the leverage of filing for SCS is important when negotiating with such a foe. The next couple of negotiating sessions will be quite telling of what to expect from both parties. 

 

[robbedagain]

Mike your absolutely right bro... it will be quite interesting to see how the clowns from tempe respond to the iam comprehensive package from the last round of talks....

 

[Tim Nelson]

AH main wants either now or joint talks
1. Job cuts
a. Lose more scope
b lose clp catering tower

2. Lose part time caps
3. Raise health care cost
4. Eliminate 69 seat language when determining status of station.

We have seen how our chief negotiator betrayed united members and supported management and more dues for the union so we should be cautious when he flips in the last hour like he did at united and hawaiian after all the bs talk.

We cant allow our union to push a ta with a pay raise paid with the blood of full time jobs and no increase in scope.

Im led to believe that at least a couple (two that i know of) and perhaps more of our nc has pledged not to support such a deal if the intl (i think Tommy) and delaney try to be persuasive. I may be naive in thinking this but at this point i dont think Tommy would flip real bad. Just my opinion but the point is that these are not cost neutral negotiations.
In bankruptcy our members gave. In record profits we should only take.

And i realize some would rather have all or any gains in the wage but what good is a wage gain if you lose your jobor your station gets contracted out or you have to go part time?

Not even clt is safe as we simply dont know which hubs will stay past the next few years.

 

[Tim Nelson]

Another thing to keep current on is cross fleeting. For instance, it isnt too hard to imagine some island flights from clt going to mia instead. Mixing and matching will be high on the company list so it will want a fence agreement. Our chief negotiator can sign a fence agreement to help management and he would say he is doing it in the best interest of the membership. It would circumvent the nc just like at united. Let us guard against any sorta cross fleeting agreement. The mx afa and alpa wont do it and so shouldnt the iam141.

Hopefully i have a wrong feeling about this but the repetative action by our chief negotiator persuades me to be caustious about these things.

 

[rockit2]

AH main wants either now or joint talks
1. Job cuts
a. Lose more scope
b lose clp catering tower

2. Lose part time caps
3. Raise health care cost
4. Eliminate 69 seat language when determining status of station.

We have seen how our chief negotiator betrayed united members and supported management and more dues for the union so we should be cautious when he flips in the last hour like he did at united and hawaiian after all the bs talk.

We cant allow our union to push a ta with a pay raise paid with the blood of full time jobs and no increase in scope.

Im led to believe that at least a couple (two that i know of) and perhaps more of our nc has pledged not to support such a deal if the intl (i think Tommy) and delaney try to be persuasive. I may be naive in thinking this but at this point i dont think Tommy would flip real bad. Just my opinion but the point is that these are not cost neutral negotiations.
In bankruptcy our members gave. In record profits we should only take.

And i realize some would rather have all or any gains in the wage but what good is a wage gain if you lose your jobor your station gets contracted out or you have to go part time?

Not even clt is safe as we simply dont know which hubs will stay past the next few years.

Tim,
Let them want, we don't have to give. Let's give them the treatment they've given us.
Let's walk away from the table and tell them, when they decide to get serious then we will come back. Why does the NC act as if they are a 16 year old girl getting asked to the prom. It's been two years, now it's time to tell AH NO!  NC TEAM .... GROW A SET.
Pass the proposal and walk out.

 

[Tim Nelson]

Tim,
Let them want, we don't have to give. Let's give them the treatment they've given us.
Let's walk away from the table and tell them, when they decide to get serious then we will come back. Why does the NC act as if they are a 16 year old girl getting asked to the prom. It's been two years, now it's time to tell AH NO!  NC TEAM .... GROW A SET.
Pass the proposal and walk out.

My assumption is that the NC has represented our interest thus far and has said no to entertaining any of the givebacks that AH has asked for. Actually, my immediate concern is the possible circumventing of the NC by Delaney as he did constantly at United. Also, Delaney may put pressure on the NC, during his prescribed time, and manufacture a pseudo belief that givebacks have to happen or that  "This contract is great" mentality.  Such beliefs prey on ignorance of procedures and negotiation strategies.  The triggering of such foolishness by Delaney usually starts off with the words, 'The reality of the situation".  
 
 Make no mistake, the pressure may be something like, "We must take this contract because otherwise single carrier will screw us",  or the famous,  "The NMB will never agree to this sorta negotiation".  The path of least resistance was followed at United, and the IAM 141 chose not to fight certain negotiation strategies but instead put dues over the members.   Same could happen with the IAMPF. The IAM has a lot to gain to sign a mini contract and then jump into joint talks to gain the IAMPF per the association agreement.  
 
Do I sound skeptical?  Yes, and plenty of it, due to the actions of this eboard as they have betrayed Hawaiian, and now United.
 
At any rate, the ORD local 1487 booted out all Local officers not on the opposition ticket, last week. Those getting the boot were those who stood down and supported Delaney and the District eboard. Hopefully something was learned.