BLACKSUNSHINE
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Pilot Bid for Nov/Dec
- Thread starter BoeingBoy
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150 letters went out, still going through them to get the 15 recalls.... we shall see...
BoeingBoy
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Though I wasn't involved in the letter sending part, that's my understanding also - 10 furloughed folks get a letter for each available recall slot, of 150 letters for this recall of 15. The betting is that it'll take going down the list a lot further than that to fill these slots, but as alqflyr said, "We'll see."
The committee chairman and I had a couple of discussions over beer at the hotel the two nights we were in PIT - one over some way to streamline the process of filling these slots and the other over the potential problem (real this time) of furloughed folks having only the E-190 F/O available to them (with the associated 18 month equipment freeze) while pilots junior to them that accepted recall earlier have other (better) positions potentially available.
On the first issue, we talked about some sort of email system where the furloughees could say in advance of the bid closing which positions they'd accept recall to, meaning they'd have to "phantom bid" in the blind so-to-speak (active pilots pretty much bid in the blind too - they don't know what they get till the results are posted).
For the second, I proposed just letting the furloughed pilots take part in the bid - just like the active pilots. That would solve the whole problem. I've got a feeling that this won't fly though - there was resistance to the idea and it would take some software changes as well as a work-around of furloughed folks not having access to put their bids in electronically.
Anyway, this was my last bid closing but hopefully a better system will get worked out.
Jim
The committee chairman and I had a couple of discussions over beer at the hotel the two nights we were in PIT - one over some way to streamline the process of filling these slots and the other over the potential problem (real this time) of furloughed folks having only the E-190 F/O available to them (with the associated 18 month equipment freeze) while pilots junior to them that accepted recall earlier have other (better) positions potentially available.
On the first issue, we talked about some sort of email system where the furloughees could say in advance of the bid closing which positions they'd accept recall to, meaning they'd have to "phantom bid" in the blind so-to-speak (active pilots pretty much bid in the blind too - they don't know what they get till the results are posted).
For the second, I proposed just letting the furloughed pilots take part in the bid - just like the active pilots. That would solve the whole problem. I've got a feeling that this won't fly though - there was resistance to the idea and it would take some software changes as well as a work-around of furloughed folks not having access to put their bids in electronically.
Anyway, this was my last bid closing but hopefully a better system will get worked out.
Jim
Jim,
I agree, thanks for all your hard work and keeping everyone in the loop.
The next million dollar question is, how deep will the recalls need to go to obtain 15 F/O positions on the 190?
The pay rates are pretty bad. That being said, it might help to be active vs furloughed when the west and east seniority lists merge.
I imagine it will be a difficult choice for all when the letter arrives.
I agree, thanks for all your hard work and keeping everyone in the loop.
The next million dollar question is, how deep will the recalls need to go to obtain 15 F/O positions on the 190?
The pay rates are pretty bad. That being said, it might help to be active vs furloughed when the west and east seniority lists merge.
I imagine it will be a difficult choice for all when the letter arrives.
Thanks for all your help Jim and good luck in your retirement.
Is it true that on each bid, recalls start over again with #1 on the APL? This means folks further down the list have to wait even longer. It seems to me ask someone once going down the list and again when going back up the list. That way everyone has a much smaller time frame to expect a recall. Some folks have NO JOB and need to get back to work! <_<
BoeingBoy
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chevyman,
That's my understanding and it tracks with the contract language - each person can pass recall without losing their shot at a future recall (with some limitations), meaning that those higher up the list get called each time before those further down.
I realize that this process can be disappointing to those further down the list who may not only want, but need to get back to US, but that's what the contract specifies.
On another note - I forgot about it in last night's post - they're hoping to start the first E-190 class about September 18th. Supposedly 4 Capt & 4 F/O.
Jim
That's my understanding and it tracks with the contract language - each person can pass recall without losing their shot at a future recall (with some limitations), meaning that those higher up the list get called each time before those further down.
I realize that this process can be disappointing to those further down the list who may not only want, but need to get back to US, but that's what the contract specifies.
On another note - I forgot about it in last night's post - they're hoping to start the first E-190 class about September 18th. Supposedly 4 Capt & 4 F/O.
Jim
Yea, seems kind of silly to keep sending letters to the same 150 pilots each time and then wait for them to reply. If they didn't want to come back to the 757, I seriously doubt they would come back to an E190 F/O slot.
Crzipilot
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Ah yes, great planning by US again it seems. If I remember correctly....Once you get the certified letter you have 7 days to respond. From that date of response, you have another 14 days to report for duty. If you include time for delivery, say best case 2 days. 7+2+14=23 days. That's not to mention the J4J's that might take those positions, which I would imagine need to give the respective carrier notice, and on top of that can be held for 9 months or so, at that carrier. I think the Sep 18 class is a crap shoot for any f/o's. Maybe hold some capt's as f/o's and pay protect them until they can get whomever back off furlough.
Simply amazing, they are going to have to send out a couple of hundred letters, and wait for responses, I.E. guys on the road that won't actually get the letter etc etc..... One would think they need to plan a little more effectively.
Also thrown into that mix, is the recent J4J class at PSA, LOA 91 says, once they commence training on a SJ they are subject to a 12 month freeze. Is that something Group will enoforce or will it be up to PSA whether they keep them held here or not??? As well as as the others holding J4J positions, we can be held for 9 months, but who makes that decision if we are held or not???
BoeingBoy
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I can't provide any input into the freezes in the J4J positions, but as far as the letters they went out a while back. I talked to one furloughee that received his on the 16th - 7 days before the bid was closed and the available vacancies were known.
Like I said earlier, I wasn't involved in the recall process back in the spring but understand that once the available vacancies were known the furloughees were called to get their answer starting at the top of the APL list. Presumably, that's how it will work this time.
I agree on the timing of the first class, though. Getting F/O's in a class on or near the 18th will be rushing it.
Jim
Like I said earlier, I wasn't involved in the recall process back in the spring but understand that once the available vacancies were known the furloughees were called to get their answer starting at the top of the APL list. Presumably, that's how it will work this time.
I agree on the timing of the first class, though. Getting F/O's in a class on or near the 18th will be rushing it.
Jim
BoeingBoy
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No I haven't. After finishing the bid closing, the committee chairman & I (we were the only two from the ALPA side there) headed home (I flew out/into CLT since we don't have non-stop service to GSO-PIT any longer, so got home sometime about 9 PM). From what the chairman said, the recall centers around Charlene's (sp?) office but he was actively involved - said the spring process took about 3 weeks which is probably pretty reasonable considering that the furloughees have things to do besides sit by the phone waiting for a call.
You guys & gals that are directly affected can tell me what you think of the idea I gave to the chairman. In the letters, include all the bidding codes for the different bases/equipment and have the furloughees send back of list of jobs they'll accept recall to - sort of a "phantom bid" as I mentioned earlier. Then use these "phantom bids" to award the available vacancies. It'd sure make the process go faster. What do you think?
Jim
You guys & gals that are directly affected can tell me what you think of the idea I gave to the chairman. In the letters, include all the bidding codes for the different bases/equipment and have the furloughees send back of list of jobs they'll accept recall to - sort of a "phantom bid" as I mentioned earlier. Then use these "phantom bids" to award the available vacancies. It'd sure make the process go faster. What do you think?
Jim
I think that would be a good idea, sorta like a standing bid. If a pilot later decides to accept the 190 FO, he can just put in a new bid. That way nobody can say they were by-passed for a recall they decided they now want. If you change your mind, you need to update your bid. Of course, this would involve getting good information out to ALL furloughees, which is something the company doesn't seem to be very good at doing...
Yes, basically they could at least do an updated APL preference form to include 190 FO and as many additional statuses as they want. Then just mail to those who indicate a willingness to return to those positions. They would need to do a better job of informing us of the goings-on though to give us time to evaluate and update our preferences.
BTW Jim, you are not allowed to retire. You seem to be the only source of info for many of us. Thank you and enjoy your retirement!
