Is USAirways hostile takeover Of AA for Real?

[jimntx]

What is good for the two airlines is of no consequence. The issue is what is good for the executives. Luvthe9, you're just not seeing the big picture.

 

[texasreb]

Lets work together to stop this merger this will not be good for either airline. Mergers suck.

Bingo.

 

[texasreb]

Lets work together to stop this merger this will not be good for either airline. Mergers suck.

Bingo.

 

[N288AA]

For the last ten years we have heard there is no capacity restraint or pricing controll in the industry. We gave billions in 2003 and it was sqaundered by executives taking bonuses. Now we are expected to give again to one who participated in this fiasco and by the way upon exiting BK will add 20% capacity from the Tomb Stone Markets. What will happen to revenue when we do this! I want to see AA survive but if anyone in mamagement participated in this fiasco my concession stand is closed to them. Look at the "Brat Pack", the five aho worked under Crandall and tell me who are considered successfull and who aren't. It would seem that the ones who left the nest and went to other airlines have done alot better than the ones who stayed at AA. This would include both Arpey now gone and Horton who we now have.

 

[FWAAA]

For the last ten years we have heard there is no capacity restraint or pricing controll in the industry. We gave billions in 2003 and it was sqaundered by executives taking bonuses.

That's certainly an interesting fictional summary of AA's history over the past decade. As eolesen posted in another thread, the level of denial among some employees is staggering. In 2003, you gave wage and benefit concessions of about a billion dollars per year (the rest of the $1.8 billion was job losses - they had 100% paycuts) and thus gave back about $9 billion so far, which AA "squandered" on fuel that has cost, so far, in the aggregate, more than $30 billion extra than it would have cost at 2002 prices.

Executives took none of the concessions, as bonuses or otherwise. Their hated PUP/PSP variable comp was taken in the form of stock, most of which is now worthless. The total value of the PUP/PSP variable comp for the four years was about $350 million. You guys should be applauding - their variable compensation worked exactly as it should: failure was rewarded with stock that's now worthless.

Now we are expected to give again to one who participated in this fiasco and by the way upon exiting BK will add 20% capacity from the Tomb Stone Markets. What will happen to revenue when we do this!

For years, posters on this website have said that they prefer organic growth to growth acquired by merger or acquisition. Problem has been that AA was the high-cost provider even after the 2003 concessions and other airlines added capacity. Low cost providers grow, while high cost providers (like AA) shrink.

CO added lots of capacity over the past decade. WN and B6 grew and chiseled away at AA's markets. Since bankruptcy, UA and DL have added capacity on markets where AA used to be strong (particularly, NYC). Now, with AA on the verge of becoming a lower cost provider than it was in the past decade, it is poised to grow. What will happen to revenue when AA adds 20% over five years (the plan is to add the 20% by 2017)? Presumably, it suffers at DL and UA, the way revenue suffered at AA as everyone else grew at AA's expense.

I want to see AA survive but if anyone in mamagement participated in this fiasco my concession stand is closed to them. Look at the "Brat Pack", the five aho worked under Crandall and tell me who are considered successfull and who aren't. It would seem that the ones who left the nest and went to other airlines have done alot better than the ones who stayed at AA. This would include both Arpey now gone and Horton who we now have.

Your "concession stand is closed" mantra is common among airline employees but in Ch 11, it's give concessions or have them imposed, and barring a last-minute vote, abrogation occurs this Friday. Parker left the nest and eventually landed at HP, where he inherited bankruptcy-imposed low wages. He married HP to US, where others had taken US to bankruptcy twice thru three rounds of concessions. Since the merger, US has shown an aggregate net loss. If that's "success," I'd hate to see how you define "failure."

As eolesen posted in that other thread, Horton is the only remaining member of senior management from the hated Carty/Arpey era of 10 years ago.

 

[signals]

Too many people aren't only in denial, they are also blinded by hate.

 

[Flying low]

AMFA's view, meaning that of its membership, should be rather evident, ergo, there is no AMFA membership at AA or US - just yellow cards.

My personal take is it appears Dougie and Tommy intend to make things really screwed up and file bankruptcy AGAIN to clean up the mess left by the merger that hasn't a prayer of being resolved without legal action and decimating both airlines' workers in the process for a fat executive bonus for both of them.

Yes, Frank I realize that. I just wonder IF AMFA were our representative, would AMFA have been so quick to come to an agreement like the TWU did. After all we still don't know what was agreed to except for a 2 year job guarantee in Tulsa...

 

[DCAJet]

• @ Pitbull - you got caught with your hand in the jar and you know it. that's why they removed you from president position. and your friends in philly made all that happen. so you are hardly credible in talking about negotiations when you gave us concession after concession and then bargained a deal with the devil. shame on you.

 

[700UW]

Wrong,

She was the only labor leader who stood up to the company and Glass was afraid of her, and Perry Hayes was the MEC President during Chapter 11 part one, not Teddy!

 

[DCAJet]

I can see the results of her "standing up for the company", wow, made a great impact. she negotiated with glass to get a secret deal -- was he really afraid of her. last time i noticed, he's working for american trying to destroy their contracts. does he sound afraid? lots of rhetoric which leads to nothing. did her standing up change anything, except that what she can claim some type of superiority cuz she said something...even though it changed nothing. just pyscho babble. save it for oprah.

the truth is she got caught trying to negotiate a deal with the company to leave the ranks and was removed as MEC president. that's the truth. so for her to act like an expert on us negotiations is laughable. everyone in pit and phl and dca and clt knows about it.

 

[PITbull]

Hey idiot, I didn't get removed from any position. There was no buyout or deal negotiated as you proport.


I am still involved with AFA and the leadership, and the f/as.

Nice try, take your blathering and stick it up AA's azzes.
your still a snake trying to convince the f/as at AA to trust USAirways managment, just like you did with us.

You will lose.

Come from behind your curtain, newbie coward.

 

[DCAJet]

You got removed for trying to sneak a deal with usair management for a early out program you were not entitled to. you took another plan instead. once your fellow union officers got wind of your sneak-fest they ousted you. i got the skinny right from peeps in phl and pit. im not trying to convince fa's of anything, just to make it clear you are not a credible source on usair. you say one thing, but you behind your own members back you tried to sneak a deal with management and then you come on this board and bad mouth the very management you tried to get a special deal from. you still talk to us union leaders? really? you are making decisions for them? i think the members need to know this. I'm copying your post and sending it out.

 

[700UW]

Still bitter huh Jerry?

She beat you and you still cant get over it, I remember the day at CCY when you were in a panic cause she went to the media and threatened a strike and the GECAS got scared as well as the ATSB.

 

[john john]

Still bitter huh Jerry?

She beat you and you still cant get over it, I remember the day at CCY when you were in a panic cause she went to the media and threatened a strike and the GECAS got scared as well as the ATSB.

Good move on her part CWA agents did the same with a vote and result

 

[frontline]

I think ol' Doug Parker is serious as a heart attack about this merger. He wants to be a BMOC (big man on campus) in the airline industry.

But that does NOT mean it would be good for us, despite his false promises!