Dog Wonder
Veteran
If the employees would work for free it would offset rising fuel costs for a while.
Ideas on what we can do to cut costs at US airways …or generate revenue 2
- Thread starter freedom
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I am going to show you one example of why US is losing money. Show me the logic in this... This is the flight I take all the time...
AVP (Scranton) to PBI (West Palm Beach) on Tuesday June 3- 3901/1937 connects in PHL $118.00
Lets just assume I drive to PHL (90 miles) and I fly 1937 without the AVP connection... $135.00
US Airways is paying me to take the AVP connection. Why? Wouldn't it make more sense to charge me maybe $175?
Your pricing model is BROKEN!!!
AVP (Scranton) to PBI (West Palm Beach) on Tuesday June 3- 3901/1937 connects in PHL $118.00
Lets just assume I drive to PHL (90 miles) and I fly 1937 without the AVP connection... $135.00
US Airways is paying me to take the AVP connection. Why? Wouldn't it make more sense to charge me maybe $175?
Your pricing model is BROKEN!!!
OP
freedom
Veteran
- Feb 15, 2006
- 3,244
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- Thread Starter
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- #153
This thread should be closed , please close it moderator …
But in the meantime ..
Raise the rates many of you say !
I agree raise the rates , but HOW can we do that and still survive as a company ?
Well we COULD actively violate the law and seek to collude , but I doubt our management and the management of the other airlines would go along with that …
Then again we could unilaterally raise our rates to the level we need to turn a profit … but if our competitors don’t follow suit , we’d be flying around empty planes … and that’s not good for business …
If options one and two aren’t open to us , then it looks like we have only one other choice … we need to take out the competition , as in take them out of the game FOR GOOD … I think this is what’s going on in the industry right now , although no one’s really going after anyone one else .. We’re just having a wait off to see who dies first …
Now I’ve paid attention to a lot of what DP has said in his town halls and press briefings etc , and it’s echoed by many in the industry , one thing that’s good about DP is he makes what he’s trying to tell you easy to understand , that’s part of the reason I’ve got such a firm grasp on this over capacity problem ..I believe he said something to the extent of “if we charge 5 dollars more than the other guy , they go with the other guy ..†Are people that cheap ? I know people who will drive two or three more blocks to save a penny or two on their gas …
So simply SAYING raise the rates WILL NOT solve the problem … that’s like me buying a goose and shaking it yelling “lay a golden egg!!!†just because we want it to be so , doesn’t mean it will be …
O-man I am NOT insane , I’m just very flexible in my thought process .. I believe in helping the company when we can , and fighting them when we must .. Am I the STRONGEST union member you will ever meet in your life ? No I’m not , but I’m a heck of a lot stronger than what’s out there today (remember when I accused the east fleet of being inactive )..I find it quite sad that so many of those in unions on this property STILL don’t have a new contract after all of these years …. Your leadership has failed you completely , and you have failed them as well with your inaction …
I mention this because not having had a new contract , your still STUCK in the role of the victim , I suppose it would hurt your position if you showed weakness by agreeing to do ANYTHING to help the company , not to mention that emotionally it’s probably not possible for you to feel anything but bitterness toward your job … I was there , I know what it was like … it must also be a scary thing for a baggage handler to bring up the “charge the non rev idea†, we all know how little we ramp rats make … I’m not a company SUCK UP , I just intend to keep it alive, whatever it takes short of givebacks (give backs that MATTER , like pay , vacation , sick time etc )
People like shark tooth think I’m naïve , that I don’t have seniority memory , I find that notion amusing ….sure the company has tactics that it will employ , but do you honestly believe that this company is manipulating the price of oil itself? That our company is secretly behind the losses of the other airlines and WE are responsible for shutting down some of the smaller ones? Nope…. We’re simply being AFFECTED by what’s happening to us ..
Another poster mentioned that if we WERE to start this policy it would be almost impossible to reverse , and I concede that it WOULD be very difficult to undo it once done .. But not impossible … it’s all about how badly you want it … (we might have to get radical as a whole someday , some sort of company wide sick out )
Still OTHER posters go off about our management and how they simply CANNOT manage this company … well for starters without our “idiot†management AWA would almost SURELY be gone , and with the price of oil the way it is these days , perhaps US airways as well … I’ve got to give credit where credit is due , I think we’re one UNRULY work group , and I’d say the head guys have done a pretty good job of managing us (side tracking , distracting etc ).. Not to mention we’ve been number one now in on-time stats for how many months so far this year ? And bag chucker is right , our on-time arrivals have almost nothing to do with the 50 dollar incentive , I don’t bust my butt an ounce harder cause of that .but back to management , we have SUPBURB management , I mean just super STUNNA … just LOOK at how they’ve kept labor costs in check ! By that I mean look at yourselves eh…. Heck even we in fleet didn’t make the kinds of gains many would have liked too with the new contract , and you can thank this company for making our contract election so close …but that’s their JOB and they do it well….
So the next time you DIS management remember that they HAVE done many things right … face it ,the average worker is just pissed because management has beaten them time and time again(or in the case of the awa pilots they’ve been beaten by the east pilots ) … if many of you without new contracts had aimed for more realistic goals , perhaps you wouldn’t be so bitter and hard-up ..if you had fought HARDER? but I don’t know your stories so I can’t point a finger at you …
I’m not crazy , I’m simply cold and logical … the employees WILL give .. They WILL back down if a non rev charge is instituted , but ONLY if it’s explained to them logically ….our people , thank goodness are logical , they CAN understand what’s going on out there … it will just take someone better and more people friendly than I to convince them that this cost saving/revenue generating measure is necessary so that we can WIN the waiting game …
Many of you on here will cry out “NO we won’t “ but it’s already been proven that this board does not reflect the general population of workers …
1 . Ten dollars going , ten dollars getting back .
2. Commuters going to and from work are not to be charged .
Come to the dark side….
h34r:
But in the meantime ..
Raise the rates many of you say !
I agree raise the rates , but HOW can we do that and still survive as a company ?
Well we COULD actively violate the law and seek to collude , but I doubt our management and the management of the other airlines would go along with that …
Then again we could unilaterally raise our rates to the level we need to turn a profit … but if our competitors don’t follow suit , we’d be flying around empty planes … and that’s not good for business …
If options one and two aren’t open to us , then it looks like we have only one other choice … we need to take out the competition , as in take them out of the game FOR GOOD … I think this is what’s going on in the industry right now , although no one’s really going after anyone one else .. We’re just having a wait off to see who dies first …
Now I’ve paid attention to a lot of what DP has said in his town halls and press briefings etc , and it’s echoed by many in the industry , one thing that’s good about DP is he makes what he’s trying to tell you easy to understand , that’s part of the reason I’ve got such a firm grasp on this over capacity problem ..I believe he said something to the extent of “if we charge 5 dollars more than the other guy , they go with the other guy ..†Are people that cheap ? I know people who will drive two or three more blocks to save a penny or two on their gas …
So simply SAYING raise the rates WILL NOT solve the problem … that’s like me buying a goose and shaking it yelling “lay a golden egg!!!†just because we want it to be so , doesn’t mean it will be …
O-man I am NOT insane , I’m just very flexible in my thought process .. I believe in helping the company when we can , and fighting them when we must .. Am I the STRONGEST union member you will ever meet in your life ? No I’m not , but I’m a heck of a lot stronger than what’s out there today (remember when I accused the east fleet of being inactive )..I find it quite sad that so many of those in unions on this property STILL don’t have a new contract after all of these years …. Your leadership has failed you completely , and you have failed them as well with your inaction …
I mention this because not having had a new contract , your still STUCK in the role of the victim , I suppose it would hurt your position if you showed weakness by agreeing to do ANYTHING to help the company , not to mention that emotionally it’s probably not possible for you to feel anything but bitterness toward your job … I was there , I know what it was like … it must also be a scary thing for a baggage handler to bring up the “charge the non rev idea†, we all know how little we ramp rats make … I’m not a company SUCK UP , I just intend to keep it alive, whatever it takes short of givebacks (give backs that MATTER , like pay , vacation , sick time etc )
People like shark tooth think I’m naïve , that I don’t have seniority memory , I find that notion amusing ….sure the company has tactics that it will employ , but do you honestly believe that this company is manipulating the price of oil itself? That our company is secretly behind the losses of the other airlines and WE are responsible for shutting down some of the smaller ones? Nope…. We’re simply being AFFECTED by what’s happening to us ..
Another poster mentioned that if we WERE to start this policy it would be almost impossible to reverse , and I concede that it WOULD be very difficult to undo it once done .. But not impossible … it’s all about how badly you want it … (we might have to get radical as a whole someday , some sort of company wide sick out )
Still OTHER posters go off about our management and how they simply CANNOT manage this company … well for starters without our “idiot†management AWA would almost SURELY be gone , and with the price of oil the way it is these days , perhaps US airways as well … I’ve got to give credit where credit is due , I think we’re one UNRULY work group , and I’d say the head guys have done a pretty good job of managing us (side tracking , distracting etc ).. Not to mention we’ve been number one now in on-time stats for how many months so far this year ? And bag chucker is right , our on-time arrivals have almost nothing to do with the 50 dollar incentive , I don’t bust my butt an ounce harder cause of that .but back to management , we have SUPBURB management , I mean just super STUNNA … just LOOK at how they’ve kept labor costs in check ! By that I mean look at yourselves eh…. Heck even we in fleet didn’t make the kinds of gains many would have liked too with the new contract , and you can thank this company for making our contract election so close …but that’s their JOB and they do it well….
So the next time you DIS management remember that they HAVE done many things right … face it ,the average worker is just pissed because management has beaten them time and time again(or in the case of the awa pilots they’ve been beaten by the east pilots ) … if many of you without new contracts had aimed for more realistic goals , perhaps you wouldn’t be so bitter and hard-up ..if you had fought HARDER? but I don’t know your stories so I can’t point a finger at you …
I’m not crazy , I’m simply cold and logical … the employees WILL give .. They WILL back down if a non rev charge is instituted , but ONLY if it’s explained to them logically ….our people , thank goodness are logical , they CAN understand what’s going on out there … it will just take someone better and more people friendly than I to convince them that this cost saving/revenue generating measure is necessary so that we can WIN the waiting game …
Many of you on here will cry out “NO we won’t “ but it’s already been proven that this board does not reflect the general population of workers …
1 . Ten dollars going , ten dollars getting back .
2. Commuters going to and from work are not to be charged .
Come to the dark side….
h34r:Go get 'em, Tiger!
hp-csr-phx
Senior
Black Magic
Veteran
- Jan 4, 2008
- 938
- 552
Yes US matched the price hikes of the other carriers..This is a good thing. Now if they can all stay together and keep the price up thats the way to survive.
Flying non-rev doesn't cost the company any money so it should remain free. Dougie even said so himself.
Freedom why don't you go and work for free for the company and save them some money if it makes you feel better.
Flying non-rev doesn't cost the company any money so it should remain free. Dougie even said so himself.
Freedom why don't you go and work for free for the company and save them some money if it makes you feel better.
I’m not a company SUCK UP , I just intend to keep it alive, whatever it takes short of givebacks (give backs that MATTER , like pay , vacation , sick time etc )
your out of your mind. we gave way to much, they can take away all the pretzels they want but employee givebacks..........i don't think so. you need to take some medication. i am very diplomatic on my posts but there is no way that the us employees should give back . no way ..no how. freedom,i respect yor way of thinking. trust me i do. but you need to really do some research on what the old usairways employees sacrificed to keep this company afloat.
your out of your mind. we gave way to much, they can take away all the pretzels they want but employee givebacks..........i don't think so. you need to take some medication. i am very diplomatic on my posts but there is no way that the us employees should give back . no way ..no how. freedom,i respect yor way of thinking. trust me i do. but you need to really do some research on what the old usairways employees sacrificed to keep this company afloat.
Piedmont1984
Veteran
- Jan 12, 2004
- 1,737
- 897
Industry load factors are at historic highs. Airlines are not adding capacity. The argument I keep hearing is that if we raise fares in any significant way - enough to substantially offset the increase in oil price - and other carriers (read Southwest) do not follow suit, then our airplanes will be empty.
Where will these passengers go? Unless Southwest and Delta start converting lavatories into passenger seats in response to our fare hike, travellers will either pony up or choose not to travel.
Should not our management at least try? See how future bookings respond? They could always announce a sale and drop prices if necessary. It's called rational pricing.
Someone splain it to me.
Where will these passengers go? Unless Southwest and Delta start converting lavatories into passenger seats in response to our fare hike, travellers will either pony up or choose not to travel.
Should not our management at least try? See how future bookings respond? They could always announce a sale and drop prices if necessary. It's called rational pricing.
Someone splain it to me.
sharktooth
Veteran
- Jan 27, 2006
- 1,846
- 0
Not the point. Try again.
autofixer
Veteran
- Aug 20, 2002
- 1,804
- 241
757 Rough APU fuel burn number..about 60 Gallons Per Hour. I have arrived at my aircraft in PHL for the morning push where the APU had run all night. 400 + Gallons down the drain on just one aircraft for the night!
Let's see, that's a little over $1,200. Wouldn't it be cheaper to buy a room at the Marriott for the night shift to nap in? How about renting some GPUs, they have to be cheaper than $1,200 per day.
http://www.cumminspower.com/rental/ ,that was tough, maybe I should be awarded an MBA from Harvard Yard.
Let's see, that's a little over $1,200. Wouldn't it be cheaper to buy a room at the Marriott for the night shift to nap in? How about renting some GPUs, they have to be cheaper than $1,200 per day.
http://www.cumminspower.com/rental/ ,that was tough, maybe I should be awarded an MBA from Harvard Yard.
Iheartflying
Advanced
- Jan 25, 2008
- 241
- 8
I've given up trying to reason with Freedom. I think I'll just keep my mouth shut because I really don't like corn or fields.
Stop asking employees to give back more to company and have management figure out a way to generate cash for the company. That's what THEY are paid the big bucks to do.
Stop asking employees to give back more to company and have management figure out a way to generate cash for the company. That's what THEY are paid the big bucks to do.
One thing is for sure - regardless if you agree or disagree with Freedom, he loves the company he works for and he loves what he does and that is really commendable. If each and every one of US Airways 30,000 + employees had the attitude of Freedom, I would bet my life that US Airways would be 5% more efficient in everything it does, right off the bat. I would love to have him working for my company, and I would hire him in a heartbeat.
I think the most important things US Airways could do are...
Look guys, we all talk about how people wont fly when raising the fares. Of course that is true if the fares are rediculous, but look at the example I posted. US is charging me $20 LESS to fly from a regional airport. I was playing with different destinations and I found one that would BLOW your mind... What do you think about this one? ONE WAY...
AVP to SFO 2523/965 $438 through PHL
Eliminate AVP to PHL and 965 costs $897
So I'd save $400 to fly from AVP. WOW, honestly, if I lived in PHL, I would DRIVE TO ABE or AVP to save $400. Something about this pricing does not make sense. It isn't just AVP, US prices all regionals like this... (AVP is intl, but thats another story - its really a regional as far as we're concerned)...
I love my airport, it is one of the most beautiful airports in America, but we can afford to pay a little more... We have to. It HAS to be the EXPRESS system that is bleeding US dry... Not the mainline.
Secondly - US needs to invest more in their people. They need to set some money aside to let the employees know that they care. They need to have some regional parties, gatherings, maybe put together some events for their employees. Maybe a pizza friday here or there? Empower their management to do good things to reward their employees. It could be as simple as telling each middle manager that they have $100 a month to reward their top performers.
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