IBT No Show Forum

[dc9fxer]

Hello,
comming in late to the show...
I have been reading this forum for a while now. I am an actual airtran mech with 15 + years and I do not work in ATL..
Someone posted a comment about how we would handle buying an airline 1/4 our size.. well that actually happened
way back when ......
Valujet bought a small airline in fla called airtran..almost 1/4 our size... guess what we Dovetailed our mechs 1 for 1...
but their senority was only good for bidding in MCO if they moved they went DOH.. That way neither of us got screwed on our days off.......
worked out great back then......

 

[WNMECH]

Did they get a 35% pay increase ?
And I am talking about an increase of about 20-25 thousand dollars a year in pay and benefits.
And that amount is increased dramatically with overtime.

No.
I guess not huh.

 

[WNMECH]

We are not going to let a group come in here and be unjustly enriched from our hard work without giving something up.
Our pilots didn't.
Our flight attendants didn't
And we won't either.

 

[dc9fxer]

Hello.
Actually they did get a raise ...don't quite remember what it was..
and i would take the same deal as the fa's got in a heartbeat!!! 2.5 yrs no problem!!!!

 

[WNMECH]

Hello.
Actually they did get a raise ...don't quite remember what it was..
and i would take the same deal as the fa's got in a heartbeat!!! 2.5 yrs no problem!!!!

Great.
Now that we agree you will take a hit in senority in exchange for our hard fought for payrates and benefits,
we can haggle the numbers.

but since the bottom number for our negotiating committee appears to be 4 years, you aint gonna get it to 2.5 years.

By the way, our flight attendants do not have anywhere near the job protections in their contact that we do in ours.
You will get these same protections when you join us on our contract when this is resolved.
If you want to be a flight attendant at SWA then go for it and maybe they will let you join them on their contract with a loss of only 2.5 years.
Also your pilots gave up an average of 3 to 3.5 years to join the SWA pilots. Maybe they will cut you a deal to get on their contract.

But not on ours.

 

[swamt]

Hello.
Actually they did get a raise ...don't quite remember what it was..
and i would take the same deal as the fa's got in a heartbeat!!! 2.5 yrs no problem!!!!

It was no where near the the raise you AT guys are going to recieve. It was no where near the benifits that you AT guys are going to recieve. It was no where near the quality of life increases that you AT guys will recieve. Trust me, we know. Of course you would take the 2.5 yrs the F/A's agreed on. Who wouldn't?? The SWA membership will not go any lower than the current offer of 4 years. Period. End of story. Let me rephrase that, the "majority" of the SWA membership will not go any lower than the current 4 years being offered. In my personal opinion, I will not vote for anything less than the 4 yrs currently being offered. These are "my" numbers that I would settle for. Nothing less. As you guys at AT have your minimums as well. AMFA's formal offer is in route to you all, in writing. Look it over, look at all the benefits and future bennies that will in fact effect us all, as one group.
We all have our final numbers guys. When you all get the offer, look it over, discuss it all, and make your own decision if this is what is acceptable for you all. If not, then vote no, if yes then vote yes. It's that simple. As we have all stated, none of us are scared of arbitration, and this is a good thing for our two groups. It's really only going to bother the company than either one of us. The company is the ones that really want this done in a huge hurry...

 

[Dove Tail :)]

Hello,
comming in late to the show...
I have been reading this forum for a while now. I am an actual airtran mech with 15 + years and I do not work in ATL..
Someone posted a comment about how we would handle buying an airline 1/4 our size.. well that actually happened
way back when ......
Valujet bought a small airline in fla called airtran..almost 1/4 our size... guess what we Dovetailed our mechs 1 for 1...
but their senority was only good for bidding in MCO if they moved they went DOH.. That way neither of us got screwed on our days off.......
worked out great back then......

 

[Dove Tail :)]

Amen Brother that makes the most sense and there would be an even playing field. Also if Southwest accquires another airline AT mechanics wouldn't have to worry about that group Dovetailing and take another hit to our seniority. Time is way more valuable than money.

 

[Flman]

Other than seniority what does this offer contain? What other items are you guys waiting for from the company to send the offer?

 

[Flman]

Other than seniority what does this offer contain? What other items are you guys waiting for from the company to send the offer?

 

[WNMECH]

Time is way more valuable than money.

True.
The problem for you is time in on our side.
We got all the tme in the world and won't be voting in a joint CBA if we get an arbitrated ruling we don't like.
Lets see if you can take some time to the bank and pay your bills with it.

 

[WNMECH]

Other than seniority what does this offer contain? What other items are you guys waiting for from the company to send the offer?

Not sure, but it is probably the complete transition agreement between AMFA and SWA with items like the 401k match, Denver Maintenance and maybe something on the 4th line.
I heard on the last "it's your call" meeting, that the company is working on a process agreement to submit to both sides.
If they sent us a process agreement that says we will except an arbitrators decision as binding, then that crap will be voted down by close to 100%.
We are in for the long haul.

 

[SWA.TECH]

Hello,
comming in late to the show...
I have been reading this forum for a while now. I am an actual airtran mech with 15 + years and I do not work in ATL..
Someone posted a comment about how we would handle buying an airline 1/4 our size.. well that actually happened
way back when ......
Valujet bought a small airline in fla called airtran..almost 1/4 our size... guess what we Dovetailed our mechs 1 for 1...
but their senority was only good for bidding in MCO if they moved they went DOH.. That way neither of us got screwed on our days off.......
worked out great back then......

This is laughable at best, the VJ aquisition of AT is so far away from SWA aquiring AT its not even the same sport. First of all VJ was looking to change it name after a certain everglade incident, at least 2 to 3 times. It was a necessary move. Second the economic package comparison is non existant when you factor in the 35% CASH raise, the 401k , the profit sharing , and the benefits savings, it works out closer to 45% or more.. Keep grasping. The deal is on the table and if you guys want to wait , so be it. You can wait till the cows come home to get on our CBA for all we care, we'd love to see this done and have been flexible to the IBT's BS. By the way dont expect any retro, GK is not gonna be receptive about that at all, he is getting ticked off at ALL MX and both unions.

 

[swamt]

Other than seniority what does this offer contain? What other items are you guys waiting for from the company to send the offer?

Just the usual that we have been discussing here.
4 yr boost, SLI/Trans agreement will be voted on as one, some head protections for MCO and BWI, no femces and both LOA's would go away. The company is working out some final language in the trans agreement. This language has to do with the 401K 2% increase to 9.3%, Starting Denver maint, and "rumored" to possibly have some language about the 4th line of maint. I say rumored since that part has not been confirmed. WN mentioned about the "it's your call" I read all 20 pages. There is a small blip in there from the company saying they are going forward next month with hiring the mechanics for the 4th line of maint. There maybe other verbage or language to work out, but this is all I can remember. You guys, AMFA has to be carefull with this language stuff. You guys have already seen the company backpedal from what they have promiced. I mean look at the 4th line they are trying to get relief from. I am sure AMFA is going to make sure there are no grey areas.
Some of this language will be benifiting both the AT guys and the SWA guys.
BTW: I think it has been sent, you guys need to start hammering the union to see it. We have union meetings all day today, if I hear anything more or different after the meetings I will post.

 

[WNMECH]

WN mentioned about the "it's your call" I read all 20 pages. There is a small blip in there from the company saying they are going forward next month with hiring the mechanics for the 4th line of maint. There maybe other verbage or language to work out, but this is all I can remember.

Read the "Its your call" transcript again. This is the part I was refering to:

A brief update on seniority integration, I think everybody's well aware that the first SLI proposal was voted down and we have quickly regrouped with both unions and have put forth a proposed process agreement that both unions are evaluating right now. And then in a parallel path we are working on a revised SLI proposal; I should say we are simply facilitating, the unions are working on a revised SLI proposal, and we hope to have some progress on that shortly.


That is from Brian Hirshman's mouth. (bottom of page 3,top of 4)
It says a process agreement.
Maybe he means a transition agreement, or a process agreement for the transition.
But in the pilots case thier "process agreement" spelled out how the whole negotiation process would go, upto and including binding arbitration.
If this is similar to that, then I don't see us agreeing to anything that says we will accept an arbitrators ruling as final.

I am probably just reading to much into his words "process agreement".
But maybe not. The company doesn't want this to go on too long.
They want to see the end game.
Their problem is the same as Airtran's.
If we don't like it, we won't vote for it and it will take a long time.