I've been here all along. Go back and read my post a little slower. You probablly read like you spell. Be done with these clowns. They won't be happy with anything less than everything. Let's take this to arbitration. I have seen Seeham in action. He is like a goddam attack dog. I came away both entertained and impressed.
IBT No Show Forum
- Thread starter swamt
- Start date
I've been here all along. Go back and read my post a little slower. You probablly read like you spell. Be done with these clowns. They won't be happy with anything less than everything. Let's take this to arbitration. I have seen Seeham in action. He is like a goddam attack dog. I came away both entertained and impressed.
AvTech04
Senior
I hate to say it, especially coming from the guy who posted this, but he's right. We need to shut our mouths and let the process commence. If its something I don't agree with, then I'll vote the way I need to vote and vise versa. We need to stop with this forum for now. We've, especially me, already said too much. Just make sure to email, call, write, do whatever you have to do to get your voice heard by the teamsters about what you want, and if we end up in another voting situation, then please vote.
The Arbitrator has the authority to interpret our contract, not change it. The LOA's are a part of our contract, added to it by mutual agreement between the company and the union.
Now this is the teamsters that we know.
They say sit down and shut up.
The ibt will just tell you what is best for you.
Just remember that they are ready to dump you and leave you with the consequences.
Hey Hoffa, why don't you shut up and stop posting.
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I know your not brother. I too want to get it done. I just want everybody to understand what can happen. Please look into this. We have. Only a "Federal Judge" can do anything with that LOA we are discussing, not an arbitrator, an arbitrator does not have the lagal authority to do so but a Federal Judge does. The teamsters already know this, which is why they have stated "if this goes to abitration we will file suit against AMFA and Southwest Airlines to address the LOA" They know they have to do this to go thru a federal judge cuz an arbitrator cannot. If an arbitrator had the power to do so then the teamsters wouldn't have to file suit. See what I mean. I just want everyone to know what will happen. This suit will have to be resolved prior to the arbitrators ruling can be enforced as it has a direct relation to the integration. Now can you see why AMFA's attorney's have stated this will go on for years and years. Again (I have to post this) I am not saying arbitration will take years and years, it's the suit that will take forever to settle, and the teamsters know this, that's they have not rushed into arbitration.
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- #622
THIS INCLUDES YOU SIR!! FOLLOW WHAT YOU POST, AND QUIT YELLING AT ALL OF US.
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- #623
Relax man. I was trying to make it funny. I agree with your statement, except I really don't want to rush off to arbitration. I would rather have a nego agreement. However, I am not afraid of arbitration, Seham has already briefed us on what will really take place. I know you've been here, I'll quit jackin with you...
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- #624
AvTech, are you back from vac? Or have you not left yet? I forgot when you said you were going.
Cmon, you guys know you can't resist this stuff. Not only is it interesting, it kills time and it's fun..
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Thx for your honest opinion. As you have stated, this is only my opinion and no I am not a member of the nego team. My reasoning behind my numbers are for the mere fact this was the minimum already voted in by the AT guys 80% or greater. Now they are getting our LOA which staples AT guys under all SWA guys, regardless off senority, in the event of a catastrophic event, or a major RIF. This LOA is going to cost alot out of the AT guys. To me (in my mind) it was worth it to trade the LOA for the fences coming down as long as AT senority was addressed (boost or reduction). As all you AT guys know I was a hard proponet of the % system, now the yearly system is on the table, I have to consider it. Better than arbitration. See we can all agree to disagree, we all have our own numbers, that will never change. By all means bring it to the table.
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- #626
WOW! Your easy. Just because I don't want to play nice huh? Been here since Oct 2010. Not going any where. Sorry you didn't like or believe what I have said about LOA and arbitration. The reason I get upset is when people like you come into this discussion very late in the game and spout out rumors, false info ect... By all means go talk to a certified arbitrator, ask a federal judge, ask your legal representational group of attorneys (sorry bout that one, forgot you got the teamsters and you can't directly talk to your attorney's). Get all the infomation before you vote. I don't care how any of you vote, I am not telling any of you how to vote, I really don't care if we do end up in arbitration but I do prefer a nego greement. And if we can protect our junior guys then we are protected as well. Hell if the AT guys get DOH only about maybe a dozen guys will have me, and they more than likely won't go anywhere, now on the flip side I'll get well over 300 mechanics below me with or without any senority adjustment. This membership really is trying to do the best for thr junior guys, and, I think this is the reasoning behind the yrs and not %.
BTW; You haven't seen me not playing nice yet. That bull dog comes out if the IBT starts their games and really starts to screw you guys down. Sir, we in fact do have pawns up our sleeves, and I honestly hope we do not have to use them. A nego agreement is best for all of us, including the company... 2nd BTW; When it comes to senority it's hard to play nice, and that's just how it is, it's senority.
So as far as I can tell from the previous posts, the current deal is 4 years, no fences, no loa. Is there any dates set for future meetings or to discuss if this gets put out for a vote or some modification? Any word on if the company might add something to sweeten the pot for the entire group to get it done?
swamt
By the way I was replying to your statement "quit trying to negotiate numbers,not your reply to the LOA.Glad I got you hot. You don't know me and I could care less how long your claws or nails are. The problem is I doubt very strongly you personally have talked a arbitrator or judge,I have. I don't care what Seham says, a arbitrator can rule on a LOA which was made prior to negotiations and it directly effects seniority and when the third party was not present. The arbitrator gave a good point. Suppose the LOA stated that AMFA if merged with any airline'.their seniority would always be higher than the merged or purchased airline or the purchased airline mechanics would by the language in the LOA be stapled to the bottom. This is not enforceable and the arbitrator can rule to remove the LOA because it does effect seniority. If you have been there since 2010 then your not even wet behind the years. I was probably in this business before you were born. You have not a clue what you are talking about. Do your home work and making false and misleading commits.The IBT atry,s told Seham they could win it in arbitration or take it to federal court and win not just Federal court. Let's get this done and stop talking about a LOA that are going away anyway, by the way that should tell you something. Got to go to sleep and dream, it is going to be very cold up here when I get up and might even be snowing. SWAMT you need to loosen up a little,your live longer,I,m serious--don't get so crazy on us.
By the way I was replying to your statement "quit trying to negotiate numbers,not your reply to the LOA.Glad I got you hot. You don't know me and I could care less how long your claws or nails are. The problem is I doubt very strongly you personally have talked a arbitrator or judge,I have. I don't care what Seham says, a arbitrator can rule on a LOA which was made prior to negotiations and it directly effects seniority and when the third party was not present. The arbitrator gave a good point. Suppose the LOA stated that AMFA if merged with any airline'.their seniority would always be higher than the merged or purchased airline or the purchased airline mechanics would by the language in the LOA be stapled to the bottom. This is not enforceable and the arbitrator can rule to remove the LOA because it does effect seniority. If you have been there since 2010 then your not even wet behind the years. I was probably in this business before you were born. You have not a clue what you are talking about. Do your home work and making false and misleading commits.The IBT atry,s told Seham they could win it in arbitration or take it to federal court and win not just Federal court. Let's get this done and stop talking about a LOA that are going away anyway, by the way that should tell you something. Got to go to sleep and dream, it is going to be very cold up here when I get up and might even be snowing. SWAMT you need to loosen up a little,your live longer,I,m serious--don't get so crazy on us.
Personally, I don't want to find out who is right about how long it takes to litagate the LOA or if an arbitrator can throw it out.
Because to find out means that we have not reached an agreement and a senority war has broken out
The LOA was never meant to be used that way when it was signed but we believed a meaningful increase in AT pay would be exchaged for a meaninful senority sacrifice.
Southwest Airlines belives this also. The proof of that is in the pilots deal. Also the flight attendance deal.
If a compromise is not reached, we will find out which lawyer is right but long term damage is sure to follow.
Because to find out means that we have not reached an agreement and a senority war has broken out
The LOA was never meant to be used that way when it was signed but we believed a meaningful increase in AT pay would be exchaged for a meaninful senority sacrifice.
Southwest Airlines belives this also. The proof of that is in the pilots deal. Also the flight attendance deal.
If a compromise is not reached, we will find out which lawyer is right but long term damage is sure to follow.
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