IBEW update: November 6th-

[The Bagfather]

Do you really think changing unions will change the company's position on negotiations?

Look at UA, NW and WN, nothing changed when they changed unions, in fact if you look at NW, AMFA got their rear ends handed to them on a silver platter and took tremendous concessions and loss of jobs.

The IBEW will not be able to accomplish anything differant than any other union in the airline industry.

700: No one is supposing the company's position is going to change.
The point is that most of us believe that we have a much better chance
with the IBEW, The general view, I believe is that the IAM is a mediocre
or average union but the DL141 is for all of the reason's posted above
over the last year a very poor choice to represent us.
Perhaps UA NW WN and NW made the wrong move. Is that what
your saying? I think we'd have to ask them. Were they sorry
they made the shift? Would the old union have done the same thing.
Whoever was representing TWA who really "lost their rear ends" were they
a bad union?
This move can be supported on a whole variety of ways but the
bottom line for me I have no faith in the IAM. What am I to assume?
That they knew the TA wasn't going to pass and that they have some
grand plan which will suddenly appear and prove them right? I tried
that idea but it gradually got erroded away.
To a certain degree 141`was in a very difficult situation. But so was
142. Why was 141 so willing to give up the COC while 142 wasn't?
I think part of it was 141 couldn't figure out how to be fair to the
west with the east being way senior to them. My feeling is that
could have been solved first negotiating the amendable TWU
contract. But here my lack of knowledge betrays me. What do you
think? I dont think they wanted to risk it but they've ended up
risking their represtation. Like I say they were in a difficult
situation.
141 put out a letter warning us of certain "opportunistic individuals"
who were trying to take advantage of the situation for their own good.
That may be true to some degree but they certainly provided a very
rich opportunity.
I think you or someone else has made the point that a union is
only as strong as its membership. Very true. Take PHX for instance
less than 50% voted with the polls at the airport. At my station
most did not vote. We have, especially in the west, a lot of people
who do not believe their vote counts. This drive is getting them
involved and thinking . If that was the only reason it would be worth
it.
OK now I'll get off the soapbox. Thanks BF

"Don't let your facts get in the way of reason
and good judgement" BF 2007(Nov 7 to be exact)

 

[Labor Dawg]

Bag This is exactly what I'm talking about. Its pretty funny it was important for us to give up the COC but I never heard one thing being suggesting the Mechanics should give it up. Just the fact that those airline employees felt that they had to do something to change the way they were being treated by the IAM has to speak volumes! I wiil tell you that if anyone wants to call me oppertunistic I can live with that. Here is why. Never have we had an oppertunity to get rid of a sh*t Union and get a fresh start with a very profitable company. The reason they are saying this stuff is because they really fear that if the IBEW gets on the property they will have one more fish in the fish bowl and they will continue to loose ground in an industry that they have had a weak presence in for years! Notice they never come around unless they are trying to push the company issues, or they come around when they feel threatened. Of course they don't come around when you feel threatened or are about to be fleeced by the company [UNLESS THEY PROMOTED THE FLEECING]. How is it that a guy that once worked right beside you can all of a sudden start pushing the IAM agenda and within a few months to a year is given a paid position for them? Could it be because he is a yes man? Could it be he is someone who would sell his soul to make money on the very backs of the ones he is supposed to represent? I'm sorry, but I kinda get upset when I see my family get the screws put to them by the very people[ that are paid by us ] who are supposed to protect them. With people like them who needs enemies! The good thing is we do have the ability to change this through the Information we can research. Thanks for trying to find out about your situation and not sitting back and thinking that the IAM will keep you informed! GET THOSE CARDS SIGNED AND PROMOTE CHANGE!!!!!!!

 

[mike33]

Phx (ramp)

I cant believe you let the oppresion continue. You have been in the backseat of this ride and it's time to move to the front seat so you can get a better view. Leadership is built on honesty. Its time for a leader to step fwd and get this done. DP needs this work unit no matter what anyone believes. We hold some of the ACES in this deck. The job and responsibility of the union is to listen to its membership. The TA was voted down. Don't you think 2 mos since the vote is enough time to at least bring some additions to the bargaining table? I don't want to here that they might be in the process of doing that. After 2 mos it only shows that, 1. They had no intention of doing that, 2. They were not prepared, or 3. They don't care what you think. You don't have a true link to ur union " NOW " because they have elected to appoint someone who doesn't know you. Roll down the window and take a breath of fresh air. You will like it. Its what UNIONISM is all about......YOU still get to vote for ur union of choice even if you sine a card!!



sunofsamsonite

 

[mike33]

Freedom,

I don't pretend to be in ur shoes but Remember, " The Whole is the Sum of its parts " I think we can be WHOLE again if we move fwd.

SYNONYM-WHOLE - entire, total, all mean including everything or everyone without exception. whole implies that nothing has been omitted, ignored, abated, or (taken away)



sunofsamsonite

 

[mike33]

IBEW

 

[Tim Nelson]

700: No one is supposing the company's position is going to change.
The point is that most of us believe that we have a much better chance
with the IBEW, The general view, I believe is that the IAM is a mediocre
or average union but the DL141 is for all of the reason's posted above
over the last year a very poor choice to represent us.
Perhaps UA NW WN and NW made the wrong move. Is that what
your saying? I think we'd have to ask them. Were they sorry
they made the shift? Would the old union have done the same thing.
Whoever was representing TWA who really "lost their rear ends" were they
a bad union?
This move can be supported on a whole variety of ways but the
bottom line for me I have no faith in the IAM. What am I to assume?
That they knew the TA wasn't going to pass and that they have some
grand plan which will suddenly appear and prove them right? I tried
that idea but it gradually got erroded away.
To a certain degree 141`was in a very difficult situation. But so was
142. Why was 141 so willing to give up the COC while 142 wasn't?
I think part of it was 141 couldn't figure out how to be fair to the
west with the east being way senior to them. My feeling is that
could have been solved first negotiating the amendable TWU
contract. But here my lack of knowledge betrays me. What do you
think? I dont think they wanted to risk it but they've ended up
risking their represtation. Like I say they were in a difficult
situation.
141 put out a letter warning us of certain "opportunistic individuals"
who were trying to take advantage of the situation for their own good.
That may be true to some degree but they certainly provided a very
rich opportunity.
I think you or someone else has made the point that a union is
only as strong as its membership. Very true. Take PHX for instance
less than 50% voted with the polls at the airport. At my station
most did not vote. We have, especially in the west, a lot of people
who do not believe their vote counts. This drive is getting them
involved and thinking . If that was the only reason it would be worth
it.
OK now I'll get off the soapbox. Thanks BF

"Don't let your facts get in the way of reason
and good judgement" BF 2007(Nov 7 to be exact)

The problem is that the IAM 141 and the company are tighter than two coats of paint, that's why the masses don't have squat and that's why nothing is currently being negotiated. Just look at Brickner's comments about the oil. They been saying the oil is going to bring concessions since it hit $65 a barrel. The company isn't having any problems with high oil cost as it continues to make money, so why is Brickner so concerned unless he's trying to talk down to fleet service and grease fleet service up with another jar piss clam oil.

Further, NW, UA, made a decision to throw the IAM out so they could start controlling their own union. Last I checked, nobody's calling the IAM to come back to represent them. Some UA mechanics have contacted the IBT but the interest level isn't sufficient. I know all the guys in ORD and I can tell you that none of the NW folks here or the UA folks EVER want the IAM back.

IAM/Company = tighter than two coats of paint

regards,

 

[Tim Nelson]

It's worth mentioning

Item 1: COC grievance and the westies

I know the IAM is blowing alot of smoke up your ### but do you really believe the east side will allow a new contract to be agreed to that gives up any COC award and back pay?

If you believe what the IAM is telling you that any COC award will allow negotiations then you are fooling yourself. There won't be any ratification where east siders will give up to $26hr. You already saw that the east siders have no interest in giving up the COC before an award, let alone after an award.
This was a merger and the IAM east contract was the surviving contract. In mergers, each employee group comes under the surviving contract. If the company refuses to do this, or as the PHX chair sez, "elects" not to do this, then the process is clear, force negotiations throught the law and then force a cooling off. It's the legal process that will secure the west under the east contract. But until the westies stop screwing around believing IAM lies, and NOT holding the IAM accountable by forcing them to the negotiations table, then the westies will continue to experience great pain.
The bottom line is that negotiations should have already been going on for 2 years, if so then the IAM would have ALREADY been in position to ask for a cooling off period. You folks havn't even started negotiations because you are buying the IAM Kool aid. Until PHX wakes up, the IAM will continue to stall and continue to have east siders represent you. Not even one West sider is on the District level even though the West makes up 37%. Doesn't that speak volumes as to why the west isn't negotiating?????? It's not all about the east and it's COC, don't you guys know it's about you too?

regards,

 

[mike33]

Tim

How can the IAM negotiate for the west. The people who would sit at the table don't wear the shoes of the west nor do they know what size to wear. They"ve lost contact w/west reality. IBEW

 

[mike33]

TWU Merger Faqs-May 2005

Q: What took place at the meeting between the company and the Union on Friday May 20th?
A: The Company explained the merger per the press release. Your Union asked the company which contract would be used, TWU or IAM. They were unable to give any answers to that question or a multitude of others that were asked. Currently US Air hub employees top out at $17.35 and non-hub employees top out at $15.60 and the contract goes through the end of 2009. Our contract becomes AMENDABLE June 12, 2005 and we are scheduled to begin negotiations June 15, 2005.

Q: What does the Contract say about mergers?
A: In section 1.C.(B) it says that if the company is not the surviving carrier, the company will make reasonable efforts to have the surviving carrier integrate the ramp employees per the Allegheny-Mohawk Labor Protection Provisions.
Rest assured your Union is working diligently to protect your rights if and when the merger is approved. We are continuing to prepare and finalize proposals for negotiations that are scheduled to begin June 15, 2005 for a new agreement for the Members of Local 580.(TWU)


HEADLINES - April, 2005
NEGOTIATION DATES ARE HERE
JUNE 15, 16, 29 & 30
JULY 12, 13, 14, 26, 27 & 28
AUGUST 9, 10, 11, 23, 24, & 25

Dear Brother and Sisters,

Do you hear that? That's the sound of a rank-and-file dedicated to making significant changes in the way America West treats fleet service agents. Members of Local 580 responded resoundingly to the negotiating committee's request to fill out a survey in late December, despite some glitches in its administration. The committee says, "Much thanks for your participation!"

Unless you bare the mark of recent hire, there's no need to remind our members that this is the year of the contract. Finally, after five years, our contract becomes amendable on June 12, 2005. The ten-member negotiating committee responsible for drawing up the next contract has been meeting for some time. Individually, we bring a host of different experiences to the table: part-time and full-time, both genders, LAS/PHX hubs, cargo, field stations (LAX/LGB, MCI, IND, MKE) and a range of seniority, from a few years to fifteen years.

With respect to the survey, we have amassed both quantitative data and comments. This information helps us prioritize issues and recognize what our members think we should fight for. A sample of the issues include: wages, overtime, working conditions, oal contracts, geographical difference and managerial authoritarianism (sick policy, mandatory overtime, discipline and "operational need"). For these issues and more, the negotiating committee is listening. We agree with Burbank that "America West ramp workers should not have to carry the burden of poor management skills in the form of low pay and benefits." Phoenix has it right: "the negotiation committee needs to be tough." We welcome any comments and letters. Please contact the local.

Our members make us strong. Remember "UNITED WE BARGAIN DIVIDED WE BEG!!"

In Solidarity,
TWU Local 580 Negotiations Committee
to be continued.......

 

[Labor Dawg]

Mike33 I agree with you and so do the IBEW people! We think it's a stupid call for the IAM again promoting a USAirways east guy to supervise your contract. This is a huge reason why we must get rid of the IAM they never listen or learn from their mistakes. They without a doubt should have at least three guys that were working with your TWU contract! They should administer it until you can have an election. Then you can change them once we become a whole or the section six is done. Then there should be an election to fill those positions by who ever the westies deem responsible enough! The whole issue is that the IAM has not shown the respect to the easties or the westies. They do what they want and not what the membership wants. Some of these guys would have you believe that the IBEW is trying to devide this group . Nothing could be farther from the truth! If that were the case then we would not be trying to get the west to raise hell with the IAM about the non-west AGC! Their answer will be he is from the west coast. That has nothing to do with the TWU represented USAirways employees. Wake up guys and don't buy the Kool-aid the IAM is selling it has poison in it! SIGN THE IBEW CARDS FOR A CHANGE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

[mike33]

....continued

IAM, TWU Reach US Airways Representation Accord

WASHINGTON, May 9 /PRNewswire/ -- The Transport Workers Union of
America (TWU), AFL-CIO, and the International Association of Machinists and
Aerospace Workers (IAM), AFL-CIO, today reached an agreement over the
future representation rights for the close to 8,000 active and furloughed
fleet service workers at the merged US Airways and America West Airlines.

A major part of this process will be negotiating a transition
agreement with US Airways that covers all Fleet Service workers," said
Roach. "Current TWU Local 580 representatives from the former America West
will participate in the transition negotiations alongside IAM District 141
representatives. The TWU representatives' knowledge and experience will be
invaluable."

SO I ask all of you.....If you already had negotiations in hand for the West and those same individuals were suppose to be working in concert for the betterment of ALLLLLLL.......WHAT HAPPENED TO SECTIN 6 MR C..........You came to the poker game with 50 bucks in a $100 buy-in when you had $1000 handed to you for free. Who the hell has my back.............

 

[The Bagfather]

Phx (ramp)

I cant believe you let the oppresion continue. You have been in the backseat of this ride and it's time to move to the front seat so you can get a better view. Leadership is built on honesty. Its time for a leader to step fwd and get this done. DP needs this work unit no matter what anyone believes. We hold some of the ACES in this deck. The job and responsibility of the union is to listen to its membership. The TA was voted down. Don't you think 2 mos since the vote is enough time to at least bring some additions to the bargaining table? I don't want to here that they might be in the process of doing that. After 2 mos it only shows that, 1. They had no intention of doing that, 2. They were not prepared, or 3. They don't care what you think. You don't have a true link to ur union " NOW " because they have elected to appoint someone who doesn't know you. Roll down the window and take a breath of fresh air. You will like it. Its what UNIONISM is all about......YOU still get to vote for ur union of choice even if you sine a card!!
sunofsamsonite

Mike; Allright! The heavy hitters have arrived. I can feel a power surge from the west
coast..Thanks Mike...BF

 

[perserverance]

Mechanic and Related halting talks had NOTHING to do with Fleet voting down their T/A, read below:
Talks were stopped on September 7, Fleet voted down their T/A 10 days later on the 17th.

By the way there are more non-maintenance airline workers in the Air Transport Division of the IAM than Mechanics.

Don't let the facts get in your way.

''September 5, 2007
US Airways Membership Chooses Change of Control Arbitration''

September 5th.....not the 17th.........FACT....M&R ceased talks' after the fleet
service (scabs) voted down the TA..........

A letter was put out in Phl this week and I'd like to post it for the board.....
He really likes writing letters.

''Dear Brothers and Sisters,
I am writing this letter to apologize for how I handled the
Transition Agreement.In hindsight, I realize that I should have just explained the agreement
and answered questions. Then I should have just let each one of you make up your own minds
without interference from me. I can assure you that will never happen again. I think the underlying
problem is that I have been to consumed by trying to help our group an I want what is best for all
of us. Once I had in my mind what I thought was best for us, I didn't stop to consider other opinions
and for that I feel horribly. I have known most of you for a long time and I would never want to do
or say anything to hurt your feelings. I did not know how badly the disconnect was until I talked to
the Committee late Sunday night. I have learned alot from this mistake and I will work very hard to
regain the trust of the group. I would like to finish what we have started but that will not be possible
without your support. I will be talking with the Committee over the next couple of weeks to determine
how we should go forward. Please accept my apology and know that I will never make that mistake
again.''
Thanks,
Jeff



Well, before we judge this or critic' it. I think everyone should know the Committee no
longer follows Jeff and the nominations to replace Jeff are next week. He had made the
remark he will be ''chair'' again because no one can run against him, but has since learned
that to be false....There are people who will be nominated to run against him....hence a letter
has shown up.

Thanks

 

[Tim Nelson]

....continued

IAM, TWU Reach US Airways Representation Accord

WASHINGTON, May 9 /PRNewswire/ -- The Transport Workers Union of
America (TWU), AFL-CIO, and the International Association of Machinists and
Aerospace Workers (IAM), AFL-CIO, today reached an agreement over the
future representation rights for the close to 8,000 active and furloughed
fleet service workers at the merged US Airways and America West Airlines.

A major part of this process will be negotiating a transition
agreement with US Airways that covers all Fleet Service workers," said
Roach. "Current TWU Local 580 representatives from the former America West
will participate in the transition negotiations alongside IAM District 141
representatives. The TWU representatives' knowledge and experience will be
invaluable."

SO I ask all of you.....If you already had negotiations in hand for the West and those same individuals were suppose to be working in concert for the betterment of ALLLLLLL.......WHAT HAPPENED TO SECTIN 6 MR C..........You came to the poker game with 50 bucks in a $100 buy-in when you had $1000 handed to you for free. Who the hell has my back.............

From the mailbag:

Very odd what I heard today. A PHX ramper said they do have a west sider that represents them since he's from the west coast. To be clear, when I say west siders need someone from their camp representing them, that doesn't mean an east sider from california. If having a east sider to represent the west is good enough for PHX then case closed, enjoy! The west represents 37% of the craft and NOT ONE west sider is on the district team. Mind boggling that PHX and 2800 workers and their leadership could accept this! The reward for such is already known. More importantly, there is a very good reason why Boss Canale decided to appoint 3 east siders and continue to keep west siders from having representation at the district level. One needs to only look up at the scoreboard to see why.

To PHX ONLY

Regards,

 

[mike33]

Mike; Allright! The heavy hitters have arrived. I can feel a power surge from the west
coast..Thanks Mike...BF

Hey BF

What puzzles me is that LA only has 3 cards. I'm Shocked that they have no one to lead. Thats a rlatively good sized station. Maybe CTC is possible. I'll check it out.

sunofsamsonite