Feb / Mar 2013 US Pilots Labor Discussion

[end_of_alpa]

Too late, and too stilted of a statment, why would you even say it that way? I simply know otherwise, but could really care less. Go in peace.

Greeter

He's not JS. Not by a long shot.

 

[traderjake]

Agreed. We will NOT be limiting our argument to DOH in the arbitration. We made tat mistake with the West. We can be integrated with BETTER than DOH over the APA pilots. The gloves come off and APA pilots should go beneath US Airways pilots.

Looking forward to the arbitration.

LIke I said, we're going to get our clocks cleaned again.

 

[Beancounter]

Flame bait? I'm simply stating the obvious. APA doesn't value DOH and neither did the West pilots. Why should we therefore tie our own hands in negotiations? In fact, let me re-quote Wilson's main point.


Why should we be reasonable if APA is already staking out their territory?

So, since APA isn't keen on you jumping ahead of their pilots, with your usual DOH merger dream, they're being unreasonable? Where have I heard this gimme, gimme, attitude before? Unfriggin' believable.

Bean

 

[end_of_alpa]

LIke I said, we're going to get our clocks cleaned again.

Huh?

I simply was quoting Wilson. So, you imply we just bow to APA and give them whatever they want so we DON'T go to arbitration. This arbitration will not be the same as the one arbitrator we had last.

But hey, believe what you want.

 

[traderjake]

I'm saying that unlike the America West SLI, we should make an argument based on reality instead of demagoguery.

You believe whatever you want though.

 

[Walmartgreeter]

What? No answer? Typical.

I will get down off my high horse and apologize for the ass remark. Sorry.

It is not my job or right to police the board or your thoughts, but I threw up in my mouth just a little when I saw the same rhetoric (who saved who, who brought more) starting in relation to the AMR merger. That is stuff for behind closed doors, and I do not mean in any clandestine way. It will just keep us all better neighbors going forward.

Greeter

 

[Beancounter]

In fact, lets just state the obvious based on Wilson's statement:



US Airways equities:

637 mil. 2012 profit
Superior management team (according to APA)
ACTUAL Airbus deliveries (not new orders made in BK like AMR)
Strong hubs in CLT and PHL
No REAL furloughs (west yes, but they could have come east)
High attrition due to retirements

AMR equities:

BANKRUPTCY!
Poor management
1,500 REAL furloughs
10 years of losses
Numerous market pullbacks

And that's the short list....in OUR FAVOR.

So who has the better argument in arbitration based on Wilson's statement?

Any AMR pilots want to chime in?

Oh no, someone's been reading, "Negotiating for Retards." The same dream team that brought us; LOA93, the Nic, an injunction, and parked. Looks like safety's off, time to go full retard. Yeehaaaaw!

Bean

 

[Beancounter]

Oh, I dunno. Wake might after a round of golf with some AOL weenies.

Hey, this weenie doesn't like golf, tennis yes.

Bean

 

[Beancounter]

I don't see how the reality of the current situation could be stated any more clearly. Not that it will matter to the "give me the NIC or give me death" crowd!


seajay

Slight correction:

West jihadist - Nic or nothing
East jihadist - DOH or death

Bean

 

[nycbusdriver]

Hey, this weenie doesn't like golf, tennis yes.

Bean

Does Wake play tennis with AOL weenies, too?

 

[N924PS]

Too late, and too stilted of a statment, why would you even say it that way? I simply know otherwise, but could really care less. Go in peace.

Greeter

Your are wrong about me being JS. Could you be wrong about anything else?

 

[cleardirect]

APA can "insist" on whatever they want, but it will only be concerning THEIR own list. The Company will insist nothing. Read the MOU, they are neutral.

But of course APA and Parker can go to the BK judge, Horton, the AMR employees, and the UCC and say "Never mind. Give Parker and Kirby 6 months to negotiate a JNC with the East and West that includes the NIC, and have it voted on and approved. We will get back to you and the stockholders on our plan for creating the largest airline in the world, and finally paying you all.”

Really? The NIC is not part of a completed JNC process. It cannot be "imposed."

Guess you did not learn too much in your one day of USAPA membership. Nice record going out the door.

Greeter

I suggest that you read the letter from the company to the NMB.

Then understand that nothing the west is doing is designed or intended to stop the merger. So your false statement about the stockholders having to wait is just wrong.

Seniority has nothing to do with the merger process.

Yes the company may be neutral on seniority but they are not neutral on getting sued or delaying combining the airline. The company would not be neutral on C&R that restrict their ability to operate the company like they want. Example, restricting PHX to a certain size. Locking aircraft into or out of CLT or PHL. Restricting moving pilots from on base to another. Fences.

They are neutral on seniority but not on what seniority means for their business.

Think the company would be neutral on a multi million dollar law suit?

Once the APA becomes the bargaining agent do you think they will care about a law suit?

Beside what have you guys held all along? A new bargaining agent can do what ever they want. If the APA does not like the list usapa gave them. Just change it. According to usapa they can do that.

 

[cleardirect]

Wrong. the company did not pay for that list. To use that list requires a joint contract integrating east and west workforces. Sorry, no $$, no integration. The company chose the separate ops path as it saved them the max amount of $$.
The company does not submit the lists, they are 'neutral' in this process.
Try again.

What did the company give each MEC $300,000 for if it was not the seniority list?

Yes the company did pay for a list.

 

[cleardirect]

Great logic. That is the purpose of M/B….. One group can tell the other group what their list is? How would that have worked out for the TWA F/As?

You are so silly Clear, so silly. But I know you are just kidding.

Greeter

But that is the exact same logic usapa issuing. The east pilots telling the west pilots what the list will be.

Are you saying that usapa is silly?

 

[end_of_alpa]

I will get down off my high horse and apologize for the ass remark. Sorry.

It is not my job or right to police the board or your thoughts, but I threw up in my mouth just a little when I saw the same rhetoric (who saved who, who brought more) starting in relation to the AMR merger. That is stuff for behind closed doors, and I do not mean in any clandestine way. It will just keep us all better neighbors going forward.

Greeter

Apology accepted.

I wasn't trying to make the point of who bought who. As I have always stated I firmly believe in a "time in service" based approach. I was just saying that if the APA is going to leave the LOS/DOH argument behind and advocate a position that they say their pilots should be rationed at rates higher than our pilots then why shouldn't we make the same argument that we should be ratioed higher than them going into a true arbitration?

If you read his quote he said TWO THINGS:

"I know that many of you are concerned about both the near- and long-term impact of a merger on your seniority and future career prospects.

1. You are right to take this issue seriously.

2. Seniority is the lifeblood of our profession, and that number on your HI-1 dictates everything from compensation to quality of life."

So why should we do any less? AOL seems to throw the cash their way, why should we do any less?