Feb / Mar 2013 US Pilots Labor Discussion

[Walmartgreeter]

Guess it comes down to this. US Airways, AMR, APA, USAPA, and 98% of the West Class agreed in signing the MOU that it was not a collective bargaining agreement. In the case of East and West, upon the POR, it in fact replaces the process in LOA 96 for combining seniority lists.

And now the West Class disagrees with that premise, in fact they are suing for an injunction based on exactly the opposite, that there is now a CBA East and West. I sure don't remember voting on that.

" a court will grant a preliminary injunction only if the harm to him or her outweighs the injury to others if the injunction is denied."

I guess the gainful employment of all the persons at the now bankrupt American Airlines will not be affected if the merger is delayed. No problem.
After an injunction, they can all sit tight while the West Class litigation once again works its way through the court system, with the same result.

I always said the Company would remain neutral until their merger plans were interfered with. You got the first volley from Kirby a week ago. I predict the next one will be from Parker himself.

In the South, what Marty Harper just did was a plain and simple “Here, hold my beer. And watch THIS.” The end result is always predictable. But watching it happen is a sport unto itself.

Greeter

 

[Metroyet]

Wow. Just read all the docs from AOL. You know that scene in Star Wars when the heroes have taken refuge in what turns out to be a huge trash compactor? The looks on their faces when they realize the walls are closing in and about to crush them is indelible. I imagine that expression is creeping over the aged faces of more than a few USAPA scabs today.

I really enjoyed the 7 potential LUPs that were thrown to the wall to see if any stick. Now, read them and include the phrase, "even though we already agreed to final and binding arbitration and didn't like the results"

See if it still all sounds so "legitimate" then.

 

[dca319]

Guess it comes down to this. US Airways, AMR, APA, USAPA, and 98% of the West Class agreed in signing the MOU that it was not a collective bargaining agreement. In the case of East and West, upon the POR, it in fact replaces the process in LOA 96 for combining seniority lists.

And now the West Class disagrees with that premise, in fact they are suing for an injunction based on exactly the opposite, that there is now a CBA East and West. I sure don't remember voting on that.

" a court will grant a preliminary injunction only if the harm to him or her outweighs the injury to others if the injunction is denied."

I guess the gainful employment of all the persons at the now bankrupt American Airlines will not be affected if the merger is delayed. No problem.
After an injunction, they can all sit tight while the West Class litigation once again works its way through the court system, with the same result.

I always said the Company would remain neutral until their merger plans were interfered with. You got the first volley from Kirby a week ago. I predict the next one will be from Parker himself.

In the South, what Marty Harper just did was a plain and simple “Here, hold my beer. And watch THIS.” The end result is always predictable. But watching it happen is a sport unto itself.

Greeter

Who said Parker would let this be delayed? If you were Doug, what option would you take to avoid litigation over a case that had proven merit?

Think about it.

This will never see a court room. Ever.

 

[dca319]

Marty is mocking mere taxpayers who work for a living and are unwillingly subjected to his abuse of the legal system.

Our union has been in the mocking business for a long time.

 

[dca319]

Our union and PIC is sitting on info that indicates we have less than zero chance of recovering even a penny. More money pissed away.

 

[Phoenix]

Guess it comes down to this. US Airways, AMR, APA, USAPA, and 98% of the West Class agreed in signing the MOU that it was not a collective bargaining agreement. In the case of East and West, upon the POR, it in fact replaces the process in LOA 96 for combining seniority lists.

And now the West Class disagrees with that premise, in fact they are suing for an injunction based on exactly the opposite, that there is now a CBA East and West. I sure don't remember voting on that. ...

I am not too concerned about what they want to call it. The members of the West class voted, contingently, in favor of replacing LOA 96. Now they want a judge to add additional contingencies, contingencies that are actually contrary to the agreement we made. And they lecture people on integrity.

 

[Walmartgreeter]

It is the Parties' intention that the JCBA shall replace

any and all prior collective bargaining agreements for USAPA; however, for APA, the JCBA shall be

an amendment to the MTA.

According to the MOU we do NOT have a JCBA East and West. Note the words “bargaining agreementS for USAPA.” Agreements, and the MOU recognizes that fact. Not one. More than one.



US Airways agrees that neither this Memorandum nor the JCBA shall provide a basis for

changing the seniority lists currently in effect at US Airways other than through the process set forth in

this Paragraph 10.

Similarly, there are listS, not one. Plural. It’s right there in the MOU.



c. For purposes of clarity, this Memorandum shall be null and void in its entirety and as to all

Parties if the Merger is not consummated.

We are at a time certain in the process. We do not have a JCBA East and West, we do not have a combined seniority list (ask the Company,) and we do not have a POR.

We are status quo. Two contracts, two lists, parked by the NMB, and one injunction outstanding.


Greeter

 

[dca319]

It is the Parties' intention that the JCBA shall replace

any and all prior collective bargaining agreements for USAPA; however, for APA, the JCBA shall be

an amendment to the MTA.

According to the MOU we do NOT have a JCBA East and West. Note the words “bargaining agreementS for USAPA.” Agreements, and the MOU recognizes that fact. Not one. More than one.



US Airways agrees that neither this Memorandum nor the JCBA shall provide a basis for

changing the seniority lists currently in effect at US Airways other than through the process set forth in

this Paragraph 10.

Similarly, there are listS, not one. Plural. It’s right there in the MOU.



c. For purposes of clarity, this Memorandum shall be null and void in its entirety and as to all

Parties if the Merger is not consummated.

We are at a time certain in the process. We do not have a JCBA East and West, we do not have a combined seniority list (ask the Company,) and we do not have a POR.

We are status quo. Two contracts, two lists, parked by the NMB, and one injunction outstanding.


Greeter

Until the APA takes over.

And the there's this gem from Silver:

"US Airways must evaluate any [seniority] proposal by USAPA with some care to ensure that it is reasonable and supported by a legitimate union purpose."

 

[Walmartgreeter]

Wow. Just read all the docs from AOL. You know that scene in Star Wars when the heroes have taken refuge in what turns out to be a huge trash compactor? The looks on their faces when they realize the walls are closing in and about to crush them is indelible. I imagine that expression is creeping over the aged faces of more than a few USAPA scabs today.

How about a pop culture history lesson Metro?

What eventually happened to the those in the trash compactor, how did they come out, all said and done? I seem to remember a medal ceremony, but at my age its all fuzzy.

And how about those that fought at the Gates of Fire, AOL? How did that all turn out?

Educate us, please.


Greeter (and please just call me "old." Aged actually sounds so...old.)

 

[Walmartgreeter]

Until the APA takes over.

And the there's this gem from Silver:

"US Airways must evaluate any [seniority] proposal by USAPA with some care to ensure that it is reasonable and supported by a legitimate union purpose."

Scott Kirby..."no."

 

[Phoenix]

March 26, 2013
Leonidas Update

Today, attorneys for the West pilots filed a Motion for a Preliminary Injunction against USAPA in the Arizona Federal District Court. You can read the filings by clicking here and here. Additionally, this morning Marty Harper sent the following letter to USAPA. Finally, the West attorneys filed a Motion for Class Certification yesterday, which you can read here.

We strongly encourage all pilots to download and read these filings.

Sincerely,

Leonidas, LLC

Its no surprise that Marty is asking for USAPA to help resolve the SLI dispute before the POR date. He understands what the POR does to LOA 96, and that the NIC will be caught up in the collateral damage.

 

[Walmartgreeter]

Its no surprise that Marty is asking for USAPA to help resolve the SLI dispute before the POR date. He understands what the POR does to LOA 96, and that the NIC will be caught up in the collateral damage.

All old news to everyone involved, including a participating West Rep right here on these forums. Everyone understood we had a legitimate union purpose in breaking an 8 year seniority dispute log jam and getting everyone a big pay raise. All voted accordingly.

As for myself, I am a little shaken. I just responded to a post with a Star Wars reference, and actually had a reply. Not sure if that speaks good or bad as to my priorities.

Greeter

 

[Res Judicata]

.....

 

[Res Judicata]

Its no surprise that Marty is asking for USAPA to help resolve the SLI dispute before the POR date. He understands what the POR does to LOA 96, and that the NIC will be caught up in the collateral damage.

Seriously? Did you REALLY think there was ever going to be a set of circumstances whereby USAPA was simply going to be allowed to ignore the Nic award forever? There is absolutely no cover for your fake union. No matter how hard you try, no matter what ridiculous excuse you come up with, no matter how absurdly contorted you attempt to twist and pervert both logic and the law, you're never going to escape the day where a final ruling to going to be made. You can't out wit it, you can't out run it either. You're fake scab union is going in front of a Judge to again explain the behavior. These AOL documents are brilliantly clear and easy to read. Everybody understands exactly what USAPA is and what it's illegal actions and future intentions are.

You ain't gettin' out of this. You MFers wanted a fight. Here it is. No running home with the ball sobbing this time...after we're done with you in court I doubt you'll be able to walk anywhere anyway.

 

[cleardirect]

Guess it comes down to this. US Airways, AMR, APA, USAPA, and 98% of the West Class agreed in signing the MOU that it was not a collective bargaining agreement. In the case of East and West, upon the POR, it in fact replaces the process in LOA 96 for combining seniority lists.

And now the West Class disagrees with that premise, in fact they are suing for an injunction based on exactly the opposite, that there is now a CBA East and West. I sure don't remember voting on that.

" a court will grant a preliminary injunction only if the harm to him or her outweighs the injury to others if the injunction is denied."

I guess the gainful employment of all the persons at the now bankrupt American Airlines will not be affected if the merger is delayed. No problem.
After an injunction, they can all sit tight while the West Class litigation once again works its way through the court system, with the same result.

I always said the Company would remain neutral until their merger plans were interfered with. You got the first volley from Kirby a week ago. I predict the next one will be from Parker himself.

In the South, what Marty Harper just did was a plain and simple “Here, hold my beer. And watch THIS.” The end result is always predictable. But watching it happen is a sport unto itself.

Greeter

Read the letter Marty sent to usapa. No matter how hard you strain to draw a threat. The west is not trying to stop the merger. Soon enough usapa is going to be embarrassed again by demonstrating how ignorant they are. Judge Lane will hear the facts of the misplaced filing and toss it out of his court.

The employees have nothing to worry about from the west slowing or stopping the merger. It is usapa ans east pilots.

I can't figure out if you are to slow to understand the facts or are intentionally lying to continue the FUD.

First, Leonidas, LLC, is the wrong defendant. Leonidas, LLC, has never been a
party to or threatened any litigation. (Id. ¶¶ 106-108.) Moreover, the West Pilots have
merely stated that they would seek to enjoin parties other than Debtor AMR from illegal
acts in the course of seniority integration. (Id. ¶¶ 97-98.) That is perfectly legitimate.

Second, the Bankruptcy Court does not have jurisdiction over USAPA’s claim. See,
generally, Stern v. Marshall, 564 U.S. ___, 131 S.Ct. 2594 (2011). Third, USAPA does
not have standing to assert the Debtor’s claims. Indeed, by doing so USAPA may be the
one violating the automatic stay. Cf. In re Curry & Sorensen, Inc., 57 B.R. 824, 827
(B.A.P. 9th Cir. 1986) (asserting debtor’s avoidance claim violates the stay).