Feb / Mar 2013 US Pilots Labor Discussion

[snapthis]

Thanks for the negative numbers. That way I know I am hitting the target.

 

[Claxon]

Leonidas prepares for Addington II

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[Zone5]

No harm no foul to YOU, you selfish POS. There are furloughed guys that would be called back if you guys only flew what you were obilgated to.

I know. It's all about YOU. No harm, no foul my ass. You westies are just selfish aholes. You've already proven that, all over the world.

It's amazing how the West rationalizes flying 99+ hrs a month with pilots on furlough! I mentioned this "phenomenon" a while back and got a plethora of half baked excuses and what not. Bottom line, there would "be no" furloughees if everyone flew say......85 hrs a month, period.

On another note, the approval percentages of the MOU were by far much higher in PHX than anywhere else in the company, almost unanimous, what 98%? Why do you suppose that is? Clearly, the NIC neutrality of the MOU was "sold" (wink, wink) as anything but to the West. I think they truly believe that the MOU constitutes a JCBA between East & West. We shall see.


seajay

 

[prechilill]

He's all ticked off he did not make the cut at HP and Karen was a much was a much better pick.

He failed the sim ride. True story. God awful pilot.

 

[snapthis]

He failed the sim ride. True story. God awful pilot.

I have to hear the rest of the story in true Paul Harvey form, God rest his soul.

Edit: I think I figured it out. The Weave. The gouge:

It will also give you the basics of the sim profile called the “Van Reavie Weave”. You need to have this profile somewhat memorized before you show up for the practice session. You will only get to fly the profile twice (40 minutes of yoke time total) while you’re there so the learning curve is steep. Be ready!

 

[Graceson]

It us airways was so profitable why were you in BK twice in a short amount of time?

So you think that a single executive was all the east was lacking to survive?

If so why all the hate towards Parker? You guys should be kissing his ass not calling him names. If Parker could have saved you why was AWA going to go away since we had wonder boy?

Several points you make...

The airline was in BK Reorganization. That is the correct phase you point out. Nearly all of the legacy airlines had reached their mature life-cycle and had unsuccessfully tried to reinvent themselves. All efforts failed leaving reorganization as the most viable option. The airline was not in liquidation nor was liquidation a preferred option for dozens of reasons. With exhaustive effort, the airline had reseet the lifecycle clock, successfully freed itself from crushing debt, and was ready to emerge with competive advantage. Parker exploited a business opportunity you, yourself, don't seem to recognize as value.

You seem to be singularly focused on the trend and fail to see the pattern for a breakout. In the Market, you're the kind of retail investor that feeds the more seasoned pro. You look back at a bearish trend, fail to see the pattern, and miss the bullish opportunity until too late. Your mindset is, if the market is declining then it will decline infinitely. Parker saw it...differently.

You see, liquidation is when the corporation has crossed a different threshold where your arguments become valid. Not unusual is your failure to recognize the ripeness threshold, also.

Hate Parker? If you step back, you'd discover that you and I would assess risk and exploit opportunity if we had chossen a different direction in careers. Parker is payed to bring value to investors. Its the nature of his business. If not him, then someone else. It's something I recognize and respect. Don't have to like it, but you should respect a game well played.

Lastly, your point of contrast about AWA going away, though you had the wonderboy. First -- Your market. You were too big for a small market, and too small with available cash and resources to survive the necessary predatory aggressiveness needed in the intrenched competitor markets. As an investor looking at your stock, i might not see a breakout from your trend, and thus shop elsewhere for value. It is what Parker so accurately detailed in crew news.

One of the hardest things to do is to divorce yourself from the very emotional and very human immediate and simplistic point of view. Business trends do not travel in straight lines.

 

[nic4us]

1. glad to hear N924PS was not denied a jumpseat, and that LUV9 is once again proven to be a liar and/ or an idiot.....or both.

2. For A320... speaking of righteous BS..the Nic is not absurd in the least, you got more than you deserved. You were not told you were worthless, just updated on what your worth truly held.

3. For end-of-alpa. The usapa lawyers are incompetent. They named AOL in the case in front of judge Lane. Clue, AOL has never sued anybody. I think who usapa meant to sue was the Addington plaintiffs and the twice certified West class. So, again wasted money from the uscaba brain trust as they will have to refile their motion to Lane, but since it will likely get the same greeting they got last time, maybe they will save their money when Lane tells them to go away and never come back.

4. For Pi-brat and Graceson....pure BS about the post merger east cost structure. Absent the merger and absent the all but certain liquidation, e cost became lower because of the merger, i.e. Ditching expensive leases on real estate and other corporate cost. For example, immediately post merger, when the company was still posting separate financials, the east made a very modest profit, despite the fact it had virtually no cost associated with actually running a company. No rent on corporate HQ, reservation facilities etc....

5. For Brasky....um..I agree with you about flying 90+ hrs a month, unfortunately the way the West system and PBS works you are off target.....still does not mean we do not have "greedy" West pilots.

6. For Swan...usapa does not have an LUP. Further, the West did not manufacture the requirement of the LUP...the SCOTUS did, and the 9th ( ...negotiate for all LCC pilots, both east and West, under pain.......), Wake ( see injunction) and Silver (...does not breach.....provided a LUP.....) have all told usapa the facts!

Also, I am not an AOL high up, but I am a Titanium donor, and one of the majority of West pilots who pay close attention to the joke of a union trying to commit the DFR failure on us, and the court cases that involve us.

7. For everybody....the Nic is still the only accepted system seniority list for all LCC pilots.

 

[FL430]

I've been going through the tapes when USAPA came to town to try to sell their union to West pilots. A furloughed East pilot, Karen Barnett from Staten Island, NY was not buying any of it.

Interesting former East, now West. Take a look but make sure the volume is down.
The best part is where she loudly proclaims that no westies will EVER pay USAPA dues!

 

[FL430]

I don't get on here often but notably absent is Move2CLT. Instead we have a new guy DCA319 that posts in much the same manner with the exception of somewhat toned down rhetoric ( to keep the mods from banishment again?). Strange coincidence? Who does he think he is fooling? It is obviously a juvenile attempt at psy-ops against the east. Just one of his many screen names he used to uptick his positive vote count he used to crow about. How pathetic!

Hi boo boo

 

[cleardirect]

I've got your latest filing figured Clear. The light came on very clearly. You guys have been trying to get the AA pilots and mangagement spooked about the Nic, and threatening them with actionable litigation. You have been ramping the rhetoric with the APA, AMR, LCC and USAPA. The intent was to try and spook one of them into biting on the Nic, and the implied "accept the Nic, and no litigation..." we heard that from you, and Nic4, and it is embedded in Leonidas information over and over. Obviously you two are involved at the higher levels of Leonidas, or let the tactic out of the bag. I think the former. That tactic did not work. Now Harper is trying the next level of intimidation for all parties, the filing. Trouble is, everyone has a pretty clear understanding of the 9ths ruling, and the fact this deal is still not ripe. You know it, they know it. My question is do you actually go all the way to court, or does Harper and Leonidas back down at the doorstep of the initial legal wrangling. and save the cash for the only venue you really have- the possibility of harm after the Nic is not used?
You know you don't have a ripe issue. Just wondering how far you push this thing? I know the company is on to the ripeness. So is USAPA. I really don't think APA could honestly care about it. Even if they did, what could they do, and why would they?
What do you think Clear?

We go all the way.

Maybe you should read the filing again.

APA and AMR are not listed as defendants. Shoots down your theory.

Everyone also has an understanding of judge Silvers ruling also.

Bottom line. Why is usapa avoiding the court answering the question! If usapa is so sure of the outcome why not stop the ripeness argument and let this case go forward?

The Jones letter told the NMB that usapa does not want an answer usapa proves they don't want an answer.

 

[cleardirect]

Their losses to their attorney and to the court system will be minimal compared to Addison. No federal district judge in his/her right mind will even consider hearing the case in light of the Ninths ruling on Addison. It will be dismissed quickly.

Judge Silver heard the companies case in light of the ninths case.

Also after 5 years of usapa there are many additional facts. Addington II is different from Addington I.

 

[luvthe9]

7. For everybody....the Nic is still the only accepted system seniority list for all LCC pilots.

Only problem is it's never going to see the light of day. Sorry.

 

[snapthis]

"The best part is where she loudly proclaims that no westies will EVER pay USAPA dues!" I'll quote it for you corporate jet.

Let me splain. We were in invited to join the union when the treasurer of USAPA complained to the company we were not paying dues. Leonidas told us we should all pay dues so that we could get "Agents of Leonidas" to infiltrate the union.

We got you so paranoid, you had to call 1-800-life loc.

Y'all still hidin under da bed?

 

[Claxon]

Why don't you post the court of appeals or the judges dismissal. The false accusation of document one mean nothing. You love to point out what the ninth said why don't you be consistent and point out what the fourth said about the RICO. Dismissed.

You say "The false accusation of document one mean nothing"

Yes, you wish it did not mean "nothing". Cherry picking in winter, you will have trouble finding the fruit.

"The Plaintiff’s Amended Complaint raises
serious allegations against the Defendants; it alleges acts of intimidation,
harassment, and other threatening behavior against the Plaintiff and its
members. While the Court has concluded that such actions do not come
within the purview of RICO, it may well be that a Court of appropriate
jurisdiction will conclude that such actions do constitute violations of state
law and that injunctive relief is warranted to prevent this type of conduct
from continuing."

Page 45

http://leonidas.cact...ct/97 Order.pdf

 

[Claxon]

Pssst, Marty and Andy, never happened.

"The pilot workforces of America West and US Airways will remain
separate and covered by their respective collective bargaining
agreements (the “Separate Operations&rdquo until Operational Pilot
Integration as provided in Section VI.A.

Section VI.A of the Transition Agreement makes it clear: there can be no
Operational Pilot Integration until “negotiation of the Single Agreement” is
completed."

"That is why the Executive Council made clear in September 2007 that the seniority award cannot be implemented without a joint collective bargaining agreement...."

http://www.unbiasedf...eoperations.pdf