Overspeed
Veteran
- Jun 27, 2011
- 3,245
- 1,065
Now that hurts...really. That hurts.
Every man has his price.
- Thread starter The Dissident
- Start date
Overspeed
Veteran
- Jun 27, 2011
- 3,245
- 1,065
I heard an E Brd member was circulating AMFA cards and then when the guys said no way but would if he had IBT cards. So he came back with IBT cards. No difference, still anti-TWU. Also a shop steward or soon to be shop steward was wearing an AMFA jacket and passing out AMFA cards. That local is just as screwed up. Everyone wants to be popular but when push comes to shove, they play all sides of the fence.
Russ still paying Local 561 guys to run around doing how knows what while AA pays? Bought and paid for aren't they? Yup!
AMFAinMIAMI
Veteran
The memeber out in LA who is passing out cards was an x TWU rep. he has the help of an E-board member passing out IBT cards. He asked me to sell the IBT in Miami since I was part of the group at LAX since 1998 pushing AMFA. I had AMFA cards sent to LAX. NOT to an TWU board memeber. I Support AMFA and will do what I can to promote the Class and Craft union which I believe will better the industry long after I am Gone. I was out there a few weeks ago and most on the night shift from what I was told signed both AMFA and IBT. The X TWU rep sold the day shift guys on the IBT. But Ken McT was out there again most recent and I have heard he has gotten more AMFA cards.
Ken MacTiernan
Veteran
Hey dobby,
What about the international attacking the membership?
When you are in a union the union is suppose to support the membership. When the union attacks the membership then the union needs to be replaced because we all know that "change from within" is a lie!
The twu convention is a joke and an insult to democracy.
MCI transplant
Veteran
- Jun 4, 2003
- 5,311
- 584
- Banned
- #51
Bob, We appreciate you trying, but I feel you're whipping a dead hourse here!------ "Change from within" is something that should have been tryed long ago! The damage has already been done! The TWU had it's chance to do what is right for the membership, but choose to stand with the company to protect it's dues stream!------ The time has come for change, just not the "change" you are suggesting! ------- Again, just one man's opinon!
I do not appreciate anything Bob has done. he has divided the membership more then anyone I know.
Now he is pushing the change from within bullshit. I bet Little promised him a position in the one local concept and now he is pushing it.
This guy is no better then Obama and the rest of the politicians. Bob you misled all your followers are you going to insist they drink your koolaid so you can stay in power, you are pathetic and the members that believe are all ignorant.
Now he is pushing the change from within bullshit. I bet Little promised him a position in the one local concept and now he is pushing it.
This guy is no better then Obama and the rest of the politicians. Bob you misled all your followers are you going to insist they drink your koolaid so you can stay in power, you are pathetic and the members that believe are all ignorant.
TWU informer
Veteran
- Nov 4, 2003
- 7,550
- 3,731
I still appreciate alot of what Bob Owens has done. Sometimes we agree, Sometimes we disagree.
That doesn't mean I would discount and disrespect the admirable things the man has done though.
TWU Local 514 Leadership has been driving the division wedge just as much, if not more than Bob has.
Why is it that so many Americans, and especially those in Tulsa Oklahoma feel that if we disagree then we should hate and disrespect those we are in disagreement with? The freedom and liberty of this country is based on the right to disagree, debate, and come to majority rule consensus.
Some of my coworkers can be friends with me as long as the AMFA card drive is not happening, but once a drive starts, they have to create a disagreement with me so they can "hate and ignore" me. Not because this changes anything on my part, but it protects them from their hateful and bashing "friends", If you can call that a "friend" to begin with.
That is one of many reason I am against the TWU and the TEAMSTERS, the mechanic and related group will never be the majority, so we see hate emerge as the weapon of choice. Hate is about as anti-American as it comes. The fear, the hate, and the anger out on the corner the day we were outside in support of our positions on the T/A was a perfect example of the flawed Oklahoma/TWU mentality on disgreement.
The biggest thing we can all agree on is that the TWU is broken. Can it be fixed? Not in my opinion. I have been around for 27 years and everytime there is a move to make changes, the international counters that move. I appreciate what Bob has done and would love to have him as our prez in local 514 because he looks out for the membership first. Here in Tulsa, our elected officers are seduced by the international with promises of positions and six figure salaries so they throw us under the bus. I have given up all hope in the TWU and only want them gone. The Teamsters offer us the same thing under a different title. Now that local 514 has pushed "The mother of company friendly contracts", the Tulsa membership will be "rewarded" with ninteenth century work rules. Our numbers will decline rapidly and those promised jobs by their union will find themselves without jobs. Through attrition, the rubberstamping TWU members here in Tulsa will be much lower and then the line will have the numbers and finally boot Jim Little and his white flag waving minions to the curb. Bob Owens sees a possibility of change, but I don't see it. There will always be a Kerrigan, Kositek, Orlando, Little, etc. to facilitate the sellout while pointing fingers everywhere else. Yes the TWU has done wonders for bus drivers, but have done nothing but lower the standard of living of the AMTs at AA. I do not want them to have another chance to complete the distruction of our careers. AA has no respect for our profession because the TWU has none. They want stores and fleet to make the same wages as AMTs. As it is they have better benefits than we do. Why? Because the TWU is punishing us for demanding separate negotiations. There is no other way to explain it. Is there anyone here who believes that stock clerks should have more vacation and sick pay than we do? This may be long winded, but there is no way I will support the TWU. In the words of Bob Crandal "We simply cannot afford" to have the TWU represent us any longer.
OP
- Dec 21, 2002
- 321
- 77
- Thread Starter
- Thread starter
- #56
No more change from within crap. Just change the bargaining agent period.
Overspeed
Veteran
- Jun 27, 2011
- 3,245
- 1,065
So wait, Ken is not a LAX AMT. He was up in LAX passing out AMFA cards. So who is the E Brd backing and helping? Ken and AMFA/AMP or the IBT? Either way isn't that self defeating which goes the level of intelligence on the Ruiz run E Brd.
A Voice From the Past!
“What does the M&R Negotiating Committee have to deliver to us?”
The maintenance negotiating committee has been talking with the AA since late 2007. After almost 4 years I am wondering what have the local presidents been doing? After a proposed extension in 2008 that would have been amendable in 2011, and a failed TA that would have been amendable May 2013, what do we have in our pockets? With the cost of living increasing each year and the fact we have had no raise, in effect we have taken a pay cut since May 2008. That has hurt a lot of us and some more than others. Lost homes, overdue bills, reduced expectations for our kids’ college plans, and in many cases much worse. The Presidents keep saying the company is stalling but that answer isn’t good enough for me and my family!!!
A lot of us listened to our local presidents and other negotiating representatives when the July 2010 TA came out and voted NO. We trusted them in that they could deliver a better deal with improved job protections, industry leading wages, an intact pension, and retiree medical. Our leadership that told us to vote NO has now had over a year to get us a better deal!!! We all know that deal has yet to come and while yes the company is probably stalling and the Fed’s are not being all that supportive of organized labor shouldn’t they have known this before they told us to vote NO?
So if we had voted yes, what would we have now? Most of us know the things we didn’t like would be in effect.
[indent=1.2]· Retiree medical for those over 50 at DOS would be on the same plan as before. Those of us under 50, well we would have to fund it with sick time instead of pre-funding. Retiree medical did not go away like many of the “Vote No Coalition” had stated incorrectly.[/indent]
[indent=1.2]· The Base would have had more members working weekends.[/indent]
[indent=1.2]· Most holidays would have been reinstated back to pre-2003 except for three and only at double time.[/indent]
[indent=1.2]· A lump sum but only for the Base.[/indent]
There were several good items though that would now be in effect however.
[indent=1.2]· A structural raise that would have taken us to number two in pay[/indent]
[indent=1.2]· A $2.75 Crew Chief Premium[/indent]
[indent=1.2]· A $2.55 Line Premium[/indent]
[indent=1.2]· A $0.50 Weekend Premium[/indent]
[indent=1.2]· Full SK pay for every day you call in sick[/indent]
[indent=1.2]· Two paid personal days[/indent]
One thing that matters to us most is if the July 2010 TA had passed, what would we have in our pockets right now? The answer to that is when you add up the pay raise, lump sum for the base, CC premium, line premium, and holidays the amount is more than most would think.
As of November 2011 – a full eighteen months from when the pay raises would have been in effect – the amount is anywhere from $11,000 for an AMT to nearly $16,000 for a AMT CC!
Now after 18 months of negotiating and the M&R Committee now saying that the last option is to ask for release to strike and what are we to believe? Will the “Vote No Coalition” get us $9,000 to $16,000 we could have had plus the extra they promised us was still on the table?
We all know the Company is in worse financial shape than before, the talks of bankruptcy and AA being hammered by the Wall Street analysts. Now everything hinges on the Pilots getting an agreement with AA with management expecting dramatic changes to their scope, work rules, pensions and retiree medical. And we are waiting on them? This is not a recipe for success.
Think about it- our strategy is to get a release to put pressure on a company that is on the verge of going into restructuring via bankruptcy. So let’s expedite the Company’s decision to file.
Tell your local leaders to quit telling you what you want to hear, break room rhetoric! Have them tell you the truth of where we are as if they were explaining what we are facing – in your kitchen with you, your wife, and your kids. Then tell them to bring you something back that you can make the decision of whether or not it is good enough for the environment we are in. Let’s be honest the window of opportunity to get an agreement is closing.
…………………………………………………………………………
“ Owens, Peterson, Pike, JR, and their supporters”
After we voted NO they said things would change, and they were right, they got worse!
American Filed for Bankruptcy even though Peterson said they never would, and we got screwed.
Now they’re trying to shift the blame on everyone else. Tulsa Ovhl, the other President’s, the TWU, and their supporters claim if we had AMFA, the IBT, or were non-union, things would be much better. The truth tells a different story.
The vote NO group sucked us in, and now we’ll have to pay the price.
They’re typically blaming everyone but themselves but we know who they are, and we won’t forget.
“What does the M&R Negotiating Committee have to deliver to us?”
The maintenance negotiating committee has been talking with the AA since late 2007. After almost 4 years I am wondering what have the local presidents been doing? After a proposed extension in 2008 that would have been amendable in 2011, and a failed TA that would have been amendable May 2013, what do we have in our pockets? With the cost of living increasing each year and the fact we have had no raise, in effect we have taken a pay cut since May 2008. That has hurt a lot of us and some more than others. Lost homes, overdue bills, reduced expectations for our kids’ college plans, and in many cases much worse. The Presidents keep saying the company is stalling but that answer isn’t good enough for me and my family!!!
A lot of us listened to our local presidents and other negotiating representatives when the July 2010 TA came out and voted NO. We trusted them in that they could deliver a better deal with improved job protections, industry leading wages, an intact pension, and retiree medical. Our leadership that told us to vote NO has now had over a year to get us a better deal!!! We all know that deal has yet to come and while yes the company is probably stalling and the Fed’s are not being all that supportive of organized labor shouldn’t they have known this before they told us to vote NO?
So if we had voted yes, what would we have now? Most of us know the things we didn’t like would be in effect.
[indent=1.2]· Retiree medical for those over 50 at DOS would be on the same plan as before. Those of us under 50, well we would have to fund it with sick time instead of pre-funding. Retiree medical did not go away like many of the “Vote No Coalition” had stated incorrectly.[/indent]
[indent=1.2]· The Base would have had more members working weekends.[/indent]
[indent=1.2]· Most holidays would have been reinstated back to pre-2003 except for three and only at double time.[/indent]
[indent=1.2]· A lump sum but only for the Base.[/indent]
There were several good items though that would now be in effect however.
[indent=1.2]· A structural raise that would have taken us to number two in pay[/indent]
[indent=1.2]· A $2.75 Crew Chief Premium[/indent]
[indent=1.2]· A $2.55 Line Premium[/indent]
[indent=1.2]· A $0.50 Weekend Premium[/indent]
[indent=1.2]· Full SK pay for every day you call in sick[/indent]
[indent=1.2]· Two paid personal days[/indent]
One thing that matters to us most is if the July 2010 TA had passed, what would we have in our pockets right now? The answer to that is when you add up the pay raise, lump sum for the base, CC premium, line premium, and holidays the amount is more than most would think.
As of November 2011 – a full eighteen months from when the pay raises would have been in effect – the amount is anywhere from $11,000 for an AMT to nearly $16,000 for a AMT CC!
Now after 18 months of negotiating and the M&R Committee now saying that the last option is to ask for release to strike and what are we to believe? Will the “Vote No Coalition” get us $9,000 to $16,000 we could have had plus the extra they promised us was still on the table?
We all know the Company is in worse financial shape than before, the talks of bankruptcy and AA being hammered by the Wall Street analysts. Now everything hinges on the Pilots getting an agreement with AA with management expecting dramatic changes to their scope, work rules, pensions and retiree medical. And we are waiting on them? This is not a recipe for success.
Think about it- our strategy is to get a release to put pressure on a company that is on the verge of going into restructuring via bankruptcy. So let’s expedite the Company’s decision to file.
Tell your local leaders to quit telling you what you want to hear, break room rhetoric! Have them tell you the truth of where we are as if they were explaining what we are facing – in your kitchen with you, your wife, and your kids. Then tell them to bring you something back that you can make the decision of whether or not it is good enough for the environment we are in. Let’s be honest the window of opportunity to get an agreement is closing.
…………………………………………………………………………
“ Owens, Peterson, Pike, JR, and their supporters”
After we voted NO they said things would change, and they were right, they got worse!
American Filed for Bankruptcy even though Peterson said they never would, and we got screwed.
Now they’re trying to shift the blame on everyone else. Tulsa Ovhl, the other President’s, the TWU, and their supporters claim if we had AMFA, the IBT, or were non-union, things would be much better. The truth tells a different story.
The vote NO group sucked us in, and now we’ll have to pay the price.
They’re typically blaming everyone but themselves but we know who they are, and we won’t forget.
odie01
Veteran
- May 11, 2010
- 1,321
- 473
