Ethnic Profiling?

[Ch. 12]

You mean like Promiscuity, Gays, Transsexuals, and everything thing else immoral and vile, is that your idea of an open mind. Open your mind up my friend and let the boiling sewage pour into it till overflowing. Is this world worth your eternal soul! This very short life is like a fleeting vapor and in the short time period you would open your mind to the devils funnel willingly and mock others who choose not to, whose the wise one, whose the fool……

That's right. Anybody that doesn't fit 700's model of a "decent human" should be condemned (say...didn't Hitler have the same ideology?). I hate to say it, but my God is based on acceptance and the true character or people. Your hatred is not better than the Muslim extremists.

QA4Jet-A- I get what you are driving at but if we expand a little bit, I think you'll find that it is only a very small portion of the Muslim community that is dangerous...the extremists. As I have been trying to point out, these extremists exist in every walk of life and there are threats from Americans (non-muslim) that are just as great and plentiful as the Muslim community. I think we need to be looking for extremists and not just skin color. That doesn't mean that granny gets a cavity search but it means that the unabomber, the DC Sniper, and Tim McVeigh get the same treatment as Bin Laden.

It is complicated now b/c the west (not just the US) has been in Muslim territory for hundreds of years and a group that cannot seem to get their full independence from the West has grown frustrated...for generations. This will breed more extremists and occupying more of their land won't make it better. It is hard for us to understand in the U.S. b/c we haven't had an occupation since the 1700's. But tell me how you would feel if you had to walk past Iranian guards when walking out of work and you had constant patrols of Iranians driving tanks up and down the streets in your neighborhood claiming that they saved you from your President? Even if our President was an "evil-doer", what we would remember is the Iranian patrol that had inflicted martial law on our lives. Nobody wants to live under martial law and that will breed discontent. Unfortunately, as so many have found over the years, you can't just flip a switch and fix the middle east...but you can't just flip it off, either, and think that it won't get offended.

Back from my tangent...I agree that our profiling can be better but what the general public in the US doesn't understand is that 99.9999% of Muslims are peace-loving non-extremists. I would venture to say that is just as high as all other groups. If we target every Muslim, we will miss the stinky white guy with bombs strapped to his forehead. To think that we've figured out the only source of terrorism/threat is to be ignorant of the real threats and would lead to an inevitable catastrophy. Vigilance is the key...through ALL ethnicities.

 

[700IAM]

Christ's Purpose

The English word sake originated from an old Anglo-Saxon word meaning purpose, or cause. It's often used in the Scriptures to translate the Greek word (pronounced) hi-neck-en which means the same as the English word, purpose. The Bible speaks of "Christ's sake" (e.g. Ephesians 4:30 KJV), meaning Christ's purpose, in terms of His role as the Savior who makes possible the forgiveness of sin for the truly repentant. Those who forsake Christ's sake have a very different fate awaiting them.


"And be ye kind one to another, tenderhearted, forgiving one another, even as God for Christ's sake hath forgiven you"


If not for the sacrifice of the Christ, God may have permanently obliterated all of sinful humanity from the earth long ago (He came very close to doing just that with the flood in the time of Noah). But because of Christ's sake, Christ's purpose, God has given humanity a chance to accept the Sacrifice of His Son. Those who do will be forgiven, those who don't will be obliterated

"And grieve not the Holy Spirit of God, whereby ye are sealed unto the day of redemption Let all bitterness, and wrath, and anger, and clamour, and evil speaking, be put away from you, with all malice: And be ye kind one to another, tenderhearted, forgiving one another, even as God for Christ's sake hath forgiven you." (Ephesians 4:30-32 KJV)


People who reject the Truth very often look down upon believers "in Christ's sake." But the time is surely coming when those who humbly repented and obeyed God will be granted glorious eternal life; they will be "as the brightness of the firmament" (Daniel 12:3 KJV). A brief part of their "shining" might be a reflection of the flames on the day that God burns all of the others who chose to forsake Christ's sake.


"And He said unto me, My grace is sufficient for thee: for my strength is made perfect in weakness. Most gladly therefore will I rather glory in my infirmities, that the power of Christ may rest upon me. Therefore I take pleasure in infirmities, in reproaches, in necessities, in persecutions, in distresses for Christ's sake: for when I am weak, then am I strong." (2 Corinthians 12:9-10 KJV)
"For, behold, the day cometh, that shall burn as an oven; and all the proud, yea, and all that do wickedly, shall be stubble: and the day that cometh shall burn them up, saith The Lord of hosts, that it shall leave them neither root nor branch. But unto you that fear My Name shall the Sun of righteousness arise with healing in his wings; and ye shall go forth, and grow up as calves of the stall. And ye shall tread down the wicked; for they shall be ashes under the soles of your feet in the day that I shall do this, saith The Lord of hosts." (Malachi 4:1-3 KJV)

 

[700IAM]

Children of Waste

Belial, from a Hebrew word that was formed from the combination of two other Hebrew words, pronounced bel-ee, meaning failure, and yaw-al, meaning to be valuable, was a term of scorn meaning to waste one's worth. The word is used in the Old Testament to describe people who were rebellious and lawless. In the New Testament, it's used only once, for Satan.

"Thou didst blaspheme God"

Lawless, rebellious people were referred to as "sons of Belial" or "daughters of Belial." The examples of "children of Belial" provided in the Holy Scriptures below involve idol worshippers, drunkards and homosexuals:


"Certain men, the children of Belial, are gone out from among you, and have withdrawn the inhabitants of their city, saying, Let us go and serve other gods, which ye have not known" (Deuteronomy 13:13 KJV)

"Now as they were making their hearts merry, behold, the men of the city, certain sons of Belial, beset the house round about, and beat at the door, and spake to the master of the house, the old man, saying, Bring forth the man that came into thine house, that we may know him." (Judges 19:22 KJV)

"And Hannah was briefly mistaken for a drunken "daughter of Belial" - she was actually a very righteous woman, answered and said, No, my lord, I am a woman of a sorrowful spirit: I have drunk neither wine nor strong drink, but have poured out my soul before The Lord. Count not thine handmaid for a daughter of Belial: for out of the abundance of my complaint and grief have I spoken hitherto." (1 Samuel 1:15-16 KJV)

That the term "sons of Belial" was used in a figurative sense is made evident in this example in which the rebellious and wicked sons of Eli were called "sons of Belial" in the same sentence:
"Now the sons of Eli were sons of Belial; they knew not The Lord." (1 Samuel 2:12 KJV)

Before she was widowed and married King David, Abigail’ husband Nabal was a "son of Belial"
"for he is such a son of Belial, that a man cannot speak to him" (1 Samuel 25:17 KJV)

It was a "man of Belial" that incited the other Israelite tribes, other than Judah, to not be loyal to King David:
"And there happened to be there a man of Belial, whose name was Sheba, the son of Bichri, a Benjamite: and he blew a trumpet, and said, We have no part in David, neither have we inheritance in the son of Jesse: every man to his tents, O Israel. So every man of Israel went up from after David, and followed Sheba the son of Bichri: but the men of Judah clave unto their king, from Jordan even to Jerusalem." (2 Samuel 20:1-2 KJV)

Jezebel, a "daughter of Belial" if there ever was one, had two "sons of Belial" make false testimony against Naboth so that she could acquire his vineyard by murder:

"And she wrote in the letters, saying, Proclaim a fast, and set Naboth on high among the people: And set two men, sons of Belial, before him, to bear witness against him, saying, Thou didst blaspheme God and the king. And then carry him out, and stone him, that he may die."

"And the men of his city, even the elders and the nobles who were the inhabitants in his city, did as Jezebel had sent unto them, and as it was written in the letters which she had sent unto them. They proclaimed a fast, and set Naboth on high among the people. And there came in two men, children of Belial, and sat before him: and the men of Belial witnessed against him, even against Naboth, in the presence of the people, saying, Naboth did blaspheme God and the king. Then they carried him forth out of the city, and stoned him with stones, that he died." (1 Kings 21:9-13 KJV)

In the New Testament, the identity of "Belial" is made evident - Satan:

"Be ye not unequally yoked together with unbelievers: for what fellowship hath righteousness with unrighteousness? And what communion hath light with darkness? And what concord hath Christ with Belial? Or what part hath he that believeth with an infidel?" (2 Corinthians 6:14-15 KJV)

 

[delldude]

How we go from debating ethnic profiling into a Holy Roller thread? :down:

 

[local 12 proud]

I think you'll find that it is only a very small portion of the Muslim community that is dangerous...the extremists. As I have been trying to point out, these extremists exist in every walk of life and there are threats from Americans (non-muslim) that are just as great and plentiful as the Muslim community.

More left wing spin or perhaps just shear stupidity..Oh wait, is'nt that the same thing.

explain why on 9/11 muslims around the globe were shown by the news media celebrating in the streets those attacks on America, The palestinians for example were handing candy out in the streets to children who were giving "V" signs for victory and chanting 'Death to America' while Men and Women danced and burned the US Flag. why do we not see the 'peace loving' Muslim Majority coming forth and denouncing those acts rather than celebrating them?.......Hmmmmmm!!! <_<

I think we need to be looking for extremists and not just skin color. That doesn't mean that granny gets a cavity search but it means that the unabomber, the DC Sniper, and Tim McVeigh get the same treatment as Bin Laden.

How many christians or any other religion for that matter did you see celebrating in the streets when by using your own examples 'The unabomber', 'The DC sniper', 'Timothy McVeigh' Unleashed their reign of terror? You Did'nt because they are an extreme fringe minority, and they have been brought to justice unlike the terrorist we are still fighting.

extremly weak comparison ch. 12, surely you can do better than that.

It is complicated now b/c the west (not just the US) has been in Muslim territory for hundreds of years and a group that cannot seem to get their full independence from the West has grown frustrated...for generations. This will breed more extremists and occupying more of their land won't make it better. It is hard for us to understand in the U.S. b/c we haven't had an occupation since the 1700's.

More left wing liberal rant which has absolutely not a shred of truth to it. There are over 50 muslim nations in the world, tell us Ohhhh Wise one how many are being occupied and oppressed by the West?

Here, Ill make it easy for you and list the Ten
Largest Muslim Populated countries in the World.

1 Indonesia 182,570,000
2 Pakistan 134,480,000
3 India 121,000,000
4 Bangladesh 114,080,000
5 Turkey 65,510,000
6 Iran 62,430,000
7 Egypt 58,630,000
8 Nigeria 53,000,000
9 Algeria 30,530,000
10 Morocco 28,780,000

Please list those I've posted that we are currently occupying that are not having Religious, Tribal, Or Territorial infighting.

Yea your right about being oppressed, but just so happens its being done by their own citizens.

You are wrong, these are Radical Islamist trying to impose their version of the Koran on the moderate or conservative Muslims if there is such a thing, These tribal religious wars have been taking place without end, way before the west was even civilized. The Iran/Iraq war is just one example out of thousands.

tell me how you would feel if you had to walk past Iranian guards when walking out of work and you had constant patrols of Iranians driving tanks up and down the streets in your neighborhood claiming that they saved you from your President?

Nice try ch.12, You are no doubt brainwashed by the nancy pelosi, Ted Kennedy, howard dean Type left wing wacko's.

Guess you conveniently missed the celebration in Iraq when Saddam Was toppled, guess you also missed the jubilation when Iraqi civilians were shown by the untold masses to be over joyed with the Idea of being able to have a legitimate vote on their Goverments Leaders, You Must have just overlooked the fact that tens of thousands have volunteered to be trained by The coalition to defend the New Iraqi Constitution, And of course you missed the part about the New Iraqi Government requesting us to stay on until it becomes stabilized. But hey you Liberals never have been to keen on Facts.

I agree that our profiling can be better but what the general public in the US doesn't understand is that 99.9999% of Muslims are peace-loving non-extremists.

Really where did you get those statistics, from some left wing liberal slanted rag?... Post your sources please!

If we target every Muslim, we will miss the stinky white guy with bombs strapped to his forehead.

Yea we see that 'stinky white guy with bombs strapped to his forehead' everyday launching terrorist attacks through out the world, blowing up police stations, cafe's, hotels, schools, planes, trains, and automobiles... :blink:

To think that we've figured out the only source of terrorism/threat is to be ignorant of the real threats and would lead to an inevitable catastrophy. Vigilance is the key...through ALL ethnicities.

Finally a statement that I can actually half heartedly agree with, But the Major current threat to the west and the rest of the free world comes from Radical Islam, be they asian, black, brown, white does not matter its the ideaology that we are fighting and it just so happens to be in large part from a region of predominately dark skinned peoples who speak Arabic.

 

[700IAM]

How we go from debating ethnic profiling into a Holy Roller thread? :down:

Profiling Islam

Islam, in Arabic meaning submission to God, or having peace with God, is the youngest of the three largest monotheistic ("one God") religions - Judaism and Christianity being the other two. It was founded in the seventh century after Jesus Christ by Muhammad, who was born about 570 AD in Mecca, in what is today Saudi Arabia. At the age of forty, Muhammad began to believe himself to be a prophet of God. Muhammad's teachings, which are recorded in the Koran, form the basis of Islam, the followers of which are called Muslims.

Islam became the dominant religion throughout large areas of the Middle East, Asia and Africa, where, since the Koran was written in Arabic, God is known as Allah. Muhammad regarded himself as the last of God's prophets, of which he included Adam, Noah, Abraham, Moses and Jesus Christ. Muhammad apparently believed, at first, that his beliefs and leadership would be welcomed by Christians and Jews, but when that did not happen, it marked the beginning of what has become an often resentful and conflicting relationship.

Islamic religious practice includes 5 essential duties:
to say that "There is no god but Allah, and Muhammad is his prophet"
to pray 5 times per day (dawn, noon, mid-afternoon, dusk and after dark) facing Mecca
to give alms
keep the fast of Ramadan
to, if possible, make the pilgrimage to Mecca.
Islamic law also prohibits the consumption of alcohol, the eating of pork, fraud, slander, gambling, usury and the making of images. Although it has no priestly class such as in Judaism or Christianity, religious and legal officials are viewed as having a similar authority since there is generally no division between civil and religious law.
Regardless of where they live, the majority of Islamic people are good, peaceful and law-abiding (many cities in Islamic countries are far safer to walk in at night than some cities in North America or Europe) - all should not be condemned based on the actions of a relatively few violent fanatics, such as those who have committed recent terrorist attacks in Israel and the United States. Christians and Jews throughout history have had their share of violent fanatics too.

One of the greatest focal points of the struggle between Judaism and Islam is Mount Moriah, or the Temple Mount, in Jerusalem. It was there that Abraham nearly sacrificed Issac, and it was there that God commanded King David “the legal owner of the Temple Mountâ€￾ and Solomon to build the Temple and it was there that, according to Islamic tradition, that Muhammad ascended into heaven.

The "Dome of the Rock" was constructed between about 685 to 691 A.D. by Muslims who then had control of Jerusalem. “The Crusades of the Middle Ages were generally a Christian effort to retake the city from Muslims“. The gold-colored Islamic dome on the Temple Mount the dome is part of The Mount Of Olives where “The Return Of Jesus Christ will occurâ€￾ has become a world-famous part of the Jerusalem skyline. Despite the Jewish state of Israel being a reality, Muslim presence, and effective control, of the Temple Mount has been permitted and tolerated by all Israeli governments, so far.

 

[QA4Jet-A]

That's right. Anybody that doesn't fit 700's model of a "decent human" should be condemned (say...didn't Hitler have the same ideology?). I hate to say it, but my God is based on acceptance and the true character or people. Your hatred is not better than the Muslim extremists.

QA4Jet-A- I get what you are driving at but if we expand a little bit, I think you'll find that it is only a very small portion of the Muslim community that is dangerous...the extremists. As I have been trying to point out, these extremists exist in every walk of life and there are threats from Americans (non-muslim) that are just as great and plentiful as the Muslim community. I think we need to be looking for extremists and not just skin color. That doesn't mean that granny gets a cavity search but it means that the unabomber, the DC Sniper, and Tim McVeigh get the same treatment as Bin Laden.

It is complicated now b/c the west (not just the US) has been in Muslim territory for hundreds of years and a group that cannot seem to get their full independence from the West has grown frustrated...for generations. This will breed more extremists and occupying more of their land won't make it better. It is hard for us to understand in the U.S. b/c we haven't had an occupation since the 1700's. But tell me how you would feel if you had to walk past Iranian guards when walking out of work and you had constant patrols of Iranians driving tanks up and down the streets in your neighborhood claiming that they saved you from your President? Even if our President was an "evil-doer", what we would remember is the Iranian patrol that had inflicted martial law on our lives. Nobody wants to live under martial law and that will breed discontent. Unfortunately, as so many have found over the years, you can't just flip a switch and fix the middle east...but you can't just flip it off, either, and think that it won't get offended.

Back from my tangent...I agree that our profiling can be better but what the general public in the US doesn't understand is that 99.9999% of Muslims are peace-loving non-extremists. I would venture to say that is just as high as all other groups. If we target every Muslim, we will miss the stinky white guy with bombs strapped to his forehead. To think that we've figured out the only source of terrorism/threat is to be ignorant of the real threats and would lead to an inevitable catastrophy. Vigilance is the key...through ALL ethnicities.

Chap 12.. I agree that there are good Muslims and we have also bad white focals, Black, any color or ethnic background you pick. I never said that Muslim males between 17 and 40 are the ONLY problem. Consider the ratio. My point was, most Terrorists acts against the USA have been from Muslim males between the ages of 17 and 40. To say we cannot profile the Majority of problem children terrorists puts us right back in the Dark Ages. We might as well wear Blinders. Sorry, Tim McVeigh, Una Bomber, The sniper killings in DC and others do not add up to the death toll of what Muslim males between 17 and 40 have thrown on the world. MHO is, get the biggest problem first, then the lessor. Yes this will be a difficult task but if the Morons who deem all of the Politically Correctness would get their head out of their arse, perhaps we might have a chance. Fanatics.. Extremists... all one in the same. Their Motto... "Death to America"! Well they can KMA.

 

[local 12 proud]

There are over 50 muslim nations in the world, tell us Ohhhh Wise one how many are being occupied and oppressed by the West?

Here, Ill make it easy for you and list the Ten
Largest Muslim Populated countries in the World.

1 Indonesia 182,570,000
2 Pakistan 134,480,000
3 India 121,000,000
4 Bangladesh 114,080,000
5 Turkey 65,510,000
6 Iran 62,430,000
7 Egypt 58,630,000
8 Nigeria 53,000,000
9 Algeria 30,530,000
10 Morocco 28,780,000

Please list those I've posted that we are currently occupying that are not having Religious, Tribal, Or Territorial infighting.

Hindus and muslims massacre each other!

http://www.usatoday.com/news/world/2006-09...xplosions_x.htm

Hmmmmmm..... <_<

 

[delldude]

Islam became the dominant religion throughout large areas of the Middle East, Asia and Africa, where, since the Koran was written in Arabic, God is known as Allah. Muhammad regarded himself as the last of God's prophets, of which he included Adam, Noah, Abraham, Moses and Jesus Christ. Muhammad apparently believed, at first, that his beliefs and leadership would be welcomed by Christians and Jews, but when that did not happen, it marked the beginning of what has become an often resentful and conflicting relationship.

Qur’an 88:1 “Has the narration reached you of the overwhelming (calamity)? Some faces (all disbelievers, Jews and Christians) that Day, will be humiliated, downcast, scorched by the burning fire, while they are made to drink from a boiling hot spring.â€

Qur’an 4:55 “Sufficient for the Jew is the Flaming Fire!â€

Qur’an5 “Fight and kill the disbelievers wherever you find them, take them captive, harass them, lie in wait and ambush them using every stratagem of war.â€

 

[Garfield1966]

Qur’an 88:1 “Has the narration reached you of the overwhelming (calamity)? Some faces (all disbelievers, Jews and Christians) that Day, will be humiliated, downcast, scorched by the burning fire, while they are made to drink from a boiling hot spring.â€

Qur’an 4:55 “Sufficient for the Jew is the Flaming Fire!â€

Qur’an5 “Fight and kill the disbelievers wherever you find them, take them captive, harass them, lie in wait and ambush them using every stratagem of war.â€

Have you read the actual quotes from the Koran? I did a search on line http://www.hti.umich.edu/k/koran/simple.html and the quote in the Koran are a bit different from what you posted. For example, the last quote refers to "idolaters" not disbelievers.

I don't read the bible but my understanding is the bible does not look to fondly on those who do not believ what's writen in there either.

Jews are never mentioned in the Koran, they are just used as a scape goat (by those who twist the meaning of the Koran) just as they were by the christians durring the spanish inquisition and other times through out history.

 

[700IAM]

Have you read the actual quotes from the Koran? I did a search on line http://www.hti.umich.edu/k/koran/simple.html and the quote in the Koran are a bit different from what you posted. For example, the last quote refers to "idolaters" not disbelievers.

I don't read the bible but my understanding is the bible does not look to fondly on those who do not believ what's writen in there either.

Jews are never mentioned in the Koran, they are just used as a scape goat (by those who twist the meaning of the Koran) just as they were by the christians durring the spanish inquisition and other times through out history.

What Satan Fears Most
"Again, the devil took Him to a very high mountain, and showed Him all the kingdoms of the world and the glory of them; and he said to Him, "All these I will give you, if You will fall down and worship me." Then Jesus said to him, "Begone, Satan! for it is written, 'You shall worship The Lord your God and Him only shall you serve.'" Then the devil left Him, and behold, angels came and ministered to Him." (Matthew 4:8-11 RSV)

Many readers of The Bible are somewhat puzzled when they come across the above verses. Satan said that the kingdoms of the earth were his to give, and more surprisingly, Jesus Christ didn't refute that claim.

Satan's World, For A Little While Longer

When Lucifer rebelled, he was defeated and cast down from the heavens back to the earth: "How art thou fallen from heaven, O Lucifer, son of the morning! how art thou cut down to the ground" (Isaiah 14:12 KJV).

Jesus Christ also described the fall, as He witnessed it in His pre-human form: "I saw Satan fall like lightning from heaven." (Luke 10:18 RSV).

Although he may not be absolutely confined to earth (e.g. Job 1:6), the earth is where Satan now resides and has his throne -

* "And to the angel of the church in Pergamum write: 'The words of Him who has the sharp two-edged sword. 'I know where you dwell, where Satan's throne is; you hold fast My Name and you did not deny My faith even in the days of Antipas My witness, My faithful one, who was killed among you, where Satan dwells." (Revelation 2:12-13 RSV)

* "The Lord said to Satan, "Whence have you come?" Satan answered The Lord, "From going to and fro on the earth, and from walking up and down on it." (Job 1:7 RSV)

* "And even if our gospel is veiled, it is veiled only to those who are perishing. In their case the god of this world has blinded the minds of the unbelievers, to keep them from seeing the light of the gospel of the glory of Christ, who is the likeness of God." (2 Corinthians 4:3-4 RSV)

What Satan Fears Most - The Return of Jesus Christ

Satan has already been defeated; he just hasn't been removed yet-- Lame Duck. The Return Of Jesus Christ will mark the end of Satan's rule and influence on earth. He will soon get all that's coming to him, and he knows it.

"But woe to you, O earth and sea, for the devil has come down to you in great wrath, because he knows that his time is short!" (Revelation 12:12 RSV)

"Then I saw an angel coming down from heaven, holding in his hand the key of the bottomless pit and a great chain. And he seized the dragon, that ancient serpent, who is the Devil and Satan, and bound him for a thousand years, and threw him into the pit, and shut it and sealed it over him, that he should deceive the nations no more, till the thousand years were ended. After that he must be loosed for a little while. Then I saw thrones, and seated on them were those to whom judgment was committed. Also I saw the souls of those who had been beheaded for their testimony to Jesus and for the word of God, and who had not worshiped the beast or its image and had not received its mark on their foreheads or their hands. They came to life, and reigned with Christ a thousand years. The rest of the dead did not come to life until the thousand years were ended. This is the first resurrection. Blessed and holy is he who shares in the first resurrection! Over such the second death has no power, but they shall be priests of God and of Christ, and they shall reign with Him a thousand years." (Revelation 20:1-6 RSV)

"And when the thousand years are ended, Satan will be loosed from his prison and will come out to deceive the nations which are at the four corners of the earth, that is, Gog and Magog, to gather them for battle; their number is like the sand of the sea. And they marched up over the broad earth and surrounded the camp of the saints and the beloved city; but fire came down from heaven and consumed them, and the devil who had deceived them was thrown into the lake of fire and sulphur where the beast and the false prophet were, and they will be tormented day and night for ever and ever." (Revelation 20:7-10 RSV)

 

[local 12 proud]

Have you read the actual quotes from the Koran? I did a search on line http://www.hti.umich.edu/k/koran/simple.html and the quote in the Koran are a bit different from what you posted. For example, the last quote refers to "idolaters" not disbelievers.

I don't read the bible but my understanding is the bible does not look to fondly on those who do not believ what's writen in there either.

Jews are never mentioned in the Koran, they are just used as a scape goat (by those who twist the meaning of the Koran) just as they were by the christians durring the spanish inquisition and other times through out history.

I suspect the Koran has as many versions and Interpretations as the 'Holy Bible' does, fact is the koran teaches violence to those who refuse to convert and it is being used as a tool by radicals to justify mass murder.

We're no longer living in the 11th century, but the Islamic fanatics would prefer that we were, and have made their intentions clear. They call this current conflict a (Jihad) Holy War between Islam and the other Religions, The Leader of Iran 'Ahmadinejad' has openly denied the Holocaust even took place, and has vowed to push Israel into the sea. His is not the only ME nation with such contempt for Israel and all western Nations, especially America.

This is a very dangerous sitiuation when you consider such radical believers in possession of WMD's. Do you think for a moment they would hesitate to use such weapons to bring about their version of the 'second coming'? What you and many people don't/won't see is the fact that their beliefs/religion is teaching martyrdom as an express ticket into the arms of Allah (God). These religious zealots have no concern for MAD(mutually assured destruction) in fact they probably welcome the Idea, it gets them into the bossom of Allah and destroys their enemies. Essentially killing two birds with one stone if you will.

Say what you will about Christianity, judaism, or any other Religion. We all know the bloody history but that was then and this is now, we can'not allow this mindset to once more take root and fester or we will indeed find ourselves living in the dark ages, That is if we survive the Nuclear armageddon that will eventually occur. We no longer live in an age of bows & arrows, throwing spears, or rocks to defeat our enemies and neither do they!

You say you don't read the bible and thats all well and good but in order to understand the Religious hatred that stems from that region one must immerse themselves into the biblical teachings that arose there centuries ago. There is a reason it is called the Holy Land not only by Jews and Christians, But muslims as well.

Im in no way going to prosetylize and attempt to convert but i would like to close with just one quote from the bible. It was a prophecy written for the end of the age, and it should give us all pause when we read it.

"I will make JERUSALEM a cup of trembling unto all the people round about ... And in that day will I make JERUSALEM a burdensome stone for all people ..." ~Zechariah 12:2-3

 

[700IAM]

You have the Jews who are Gods chosen people and everyone hates, and then you have the people living around them, and everywhere else in the world who don't worship God, but instead worship his enemy Satan, who God created.

Breaking it down to the least common denominator there are only two forces, no grey areas of confusions like Satan wants you to believe, which are: Good=God and Evil=Satan.

God said, in so many words: You are either for me or against me. That's your choice, most go against him and why it is said the road to Heaven is a narrow one.

The individuals on this thread are all standing on the wide road mocking the few on the narrow.

Using the Bible as God's living Word isn't meant to be condescending to anyone, it's simply relying a message most make a into joke or consider allegories. They are gambling with their eternal soul. High Stake Fools who are Satan’s Children and clueless as they are nurtured into unbelievers to spread the disease to the next generation of poor damned souls.

Laugh and mock at my brothers and sisters. I'll call over to you from the great divide and ask: Can You Hear Me Know?

I made it simple for the simple minded.

God Save Your Souls, in spite of Yourselves

 

[delldude]

You have the Jews who are Gods chosen people and everyone hates, and then you have the people living around them, and everywhere else in the world who don't worship God, but instead worship his enemy Satan, who God created.

Breaking it down to the least common denominator there are only two forces, no grey areas of confusions like Satan wants you to believe, which are: Good=God and Evil=Satan.

So in a round about way you say Allah is Satan?or maybe the Great Deciever would be more appropos.
700,you're pretty saavy with the word....I remember some scripture talking about the end times and the false church and how He will decieve the masses?? ISLAM??False church??
everyone says it will be the vatican but for a long time I truly believe its right in front of our noses in Islam.

God said, in so many words: You are either for me or against me.

So did George Bush

The individuals on this thread are all standing on the wide road mocking the few on the narrow.

Judge not ,lest ye be judged.....

I made it simple for the simple minded.

No one knows if they will enter the kingdom of heaven....all you can do while in the earthly plane is to live your life to the fullest in christ and try to walk his path.We are only mortals prone to sin and all will be judged.Even you may be in for a great suprise some fine day.You come across as above all of us because of your "holiness".you tie your shoes the same as anyone else,don't forget it.no one is mocking....I questioned how we got into a holy thing over the thread title.
Spread the word,don't belittle those who can't see the light,help them to see with Kind words...

Enjoy your weekend brother,

A Friend in Christ

Laugh and mock at my brothers and sisters. I'll call over to you from the great divide and ask: Can You Hear Me Know?

 

[700IAM]

So in a round about way you say Allah is Satan?or maybe the Great Deciever would be more appropos.
False Gods. Yes you understand it correctly

700,you're pretty saavy with the word....I remember some scripture talking about the end times and the false church and how He will decieve the masses?? ISLAM??False church??
everyone says it will be the vatican but for a long time I truly believe its right in front of our noses in Islam.
So did George Bush
Judge not ,lest ye be judged.....
No one knows if they will enter the kingdom of heaven....all you can do while in the earthly plane is to live your life to the fullest in christ and try to walk his path.We are only mortals prone to sin and all will be judged.Even you may be in for a great suprise some fine day.You come across as above all of us because of your "holiness".you tie your shoes the same as anyone else,don't forget it.no one is mocking....I questioned how we got into a holy thing over the thread title.
Spread the word,don't belittle those who can't see the light,help them to see with Kind words...

Enjoy your weekend brother,

A Friend in Christ

The Way To Salvation

"For those who live according to the flesh set their minds on the things of the flesh, but those who live according to the Spirit set their minds on the things of the Spirit. To set the mind on the flesh is death, but to set the mind on the Spirit is life and peace. For the mind that is set on the flesh is hostile to God; it does not submit to God's law, indeed it cannot; and those who are in the flesh cannot please God. But you are not in the flesh, you are in the Spirit, if in fact the Spirit of God dwells in you. Any one who does not have the Spirit of Christ does not belong to Him." (Romans 8:5-9 RSV)

The Process Of Conversion

As the verses above clearly state, no one is truly a Christian without the Holy Spirit which makes conversion possible. From a Christian point of view, conversion means to turn, or change, from the world's way, that is, our own way, to God's Way. Truly change, not merely as a state of mind, but as a way of life - The Way to life, eternal life.

Repentance

Repentance is a change of mind, a vital part of conversion.

"From that time Jesus began to preach, saying, "Repent, for the kingdom of heaven is at hand." (Matthew 4:17 RSV)

"they should repent and turn to God and perform deeds worthy of their repentance." (Acts 26:20 RSV)

"As it is, I rejoice, not because you were grieved, but because you were grieved into repenting; for you felt a Godly grief, so that you suffered no loss through us. For Godly grief produces a repentance that leads to salvation and brings no regret, but worldly grief produces death. For see what earnestness this Godly grief has produced in you, what eagerness to clear yourselves, what indignation, what alarm, what longing, what zeal, what punishment! At every point you have proved yourselves guiltless in the matter." (2 Corinthians 7:9-11 RSV)

"The Lord is not slow about His promise as some count slowness, but is forbearing toward you, not wishing that any should perish, but that all should reach repentance." (2 Peter 3:9 RSV)

"unless you repent you will all likewise perish." (Luke 13:3 RSV)

Baptism

Baptism is an important act of conversion, so much so that Jesus Christ had Himself baptized by John The Baptist, not because He needed to repent of anything, but as an example to those who profess to be Christian.

"John would have prevented Him, saying, "I need to be baptized by You, and do You come to me?" But Jesus answered him, "Let it be so now; for thus it is fitting for us to fulfil all righteousness." Then he consented. And when Jesus was baptized, He went up immediately from the water, and behold, the heavens were opened and He saw the Spirit of God descending like a dove, and alighting on Him; and lo, a voice from heaven, saying, "This is My beloved Son with Whom I am well pleased." (Matthew 3:14-17 RSV)

"Repent, and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the forgiveness of your sins; and you shall receive the gift of the Holy Spirit." (Acts 2:38 RSV)

"Repent therefore, and turn again, that your sins may be blotted out, that times of refreshing may come from the presence of The Lord." (Acts 3:19 RSV)

"Do you not know that all of us who have been baptized into Christ Jesus were baptized into His death? We were buried therefore with Him by baptism into death, so that as Christ was raised from the dead by the glory of The Father, we too might walk in newness of life. For if we have been united with Him in a death like His, we shall certainly be united with Him in a resurrection like His. We know that our old self was crucified with Him so that the sinful body might be destroyed, and we might no longer be enslaved to sin. For he who has died is freed from sin. But if we have died with Christ, we believe that we shall also live with Him." (Romans 6:3-8 RSV)

"He who believes and is baptized will be saved; but he who does not believe will be condemned." (Mark 16:16 RSV)

The Holy Spirit

As the opening verses plainly say, "Any one who does not have the Spirit of Christ does not belong to Him." (Romans 8:9 RSV)

"In Him you also, who have heard the word of truth, the gospel of your salvation, and have believed in Him, were sealed with the promised Holy Spirit, which is the guarantee of our inheritance until we acquire possession of it, to the praise of His glory." (Ephesians 1:13-14 RSV)

"But you shall receive power when the Holy Spirit has come upon you; and you shall be My witnesses in Jerusalem and in all Judea and Samaria and to the end of the earth." (Acts 1:8 RSV)

"And we are witnesses to these things, and so is the Holy Spirit whom God has given to those who obey Him." (Acts 5:32 RSV)

"Repent, and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the forgiveness of your sins; and you shall receive the gift of the Holy Spirit. For the promise is to you and to your children and to all that are far off, every one whom The Lord our God calls to Him." And he testified with many other words and exhorted them, saying, "Save yourselves from this crooked generation." (Acts 2:38 RSV)

A Lifelong Process

Conversion is a lifelong process in which Christians are expected to "grow in the grace and knowledge of our Lord and Savior Jesus Christ" (2 Peter 3:18).

Although all Christians remain sinners (e.g. Romans 7:7-25 and 1 John 1:8-10), those who know better are expected to do better. "For He will render to every man according to his works: to those who by patience in well-doing seek for glory and honor and immortality, He will give eternal life; but for those who are factious and do not obey the truth, but obey wickedness, there will be wrath and fury." (Romans 2:6-8 RSV)

"Let your light so shine before men, that they may see your good works and give glory to your Father Who is in heaven." (Matthew 5:16 RSV)

"What does it profit, my brethren, if a man says he has faith but has not works? Can his faith save him?"

"If a brother or sister is ill-clad and in lack of daily food, and one of you says to them, "Go in peace, be warmed and filled," without giving them the things needed for the body, what does it profit? So faith by itself, if it has no works, is dead."

"But some one will say, "You have faith and I have works." Show me your faith apart from your works, and I by my works will show you my faith."

"You believe that God is one; you do well. Even the demons believe - and shudder."

"Do you want to be shown, you shallow man, that faith apart from works is barren? Was not Abraham our father justified by works, when he offered his son Isaac upon the altar? You see that faith was active along with his works, and faith was completed by works, and the scripture was fulfilled which says, "Abraham believed God, and it was reckoned to him as righteousness"; and he was called the friend of God."

"You see that a man is justified by works and not by faith alone."

"And in the same way was not also Rahab the harlot justified by works when she received the messengers and sent them out another way? For as the body apart from the spirit is dead, so faith apart from works is dead." (James 2:14-26 RSV)