Democracy In Action

[Birdman]

You'r right. We pay dues (70% goes to Locals) to send our Presidents to negotiations. Why do we need observers? We have our democratically elected representative there getting paid by us! They get nice hotel rooms, steak dinners (a lot of them apparently because very few are under 300lbs), rental cars, and a salary. What the hell for if they need to be "observed"?

Sounds like the some members that rant should try running for office. If they don't get voted in then shut up...just saying.

I believe it's called transparency, leading to openess that keeps the whole process honest. The TWU is simply an agent, not a cult, religion, or a social club, paid to improve my standard of living. I'm paying for the right, not priviledge, to know what's being discussed in my behalf.

 

[Overspeed]

<_< ------ Typical reply! ---------"Why do you need observers"? Simple----- To keep them "HONEST"!!!!

So are they all liars and cheats? Vote their butts out! We are allowed to observer our politicians on CSPAN and in person. Did that stop the financial mess we're in? The reduction of workers rights? Reduced regulation that allows our jobs to be outsourced? Observers keep them honest? Uh, no.

 

[Birdman]

So are they all liars and cheats? Vote their butts out! We are allowed to observer our politicians on CSPAN and in person. Did that stop the financial mess we're in? The reduction of workers rights? Reduced regulation that allows our jobs to be outsourced? Observers keep them honest? Uh, no.

I'm pretty sure the back room dealmaking is not broadcast on Cspan or Senator Tom Coburn would not have said, "If you really knew what was being done in Washington, you would fire us all".

 

[strikeforce]

So are they all liars and cheats? Vote their butts out! We are allowed to observer our politicians on CSPAN and in person. Did that stop the financial mess we're in? The reduction of workers rights? Reduced regulation that allows our jobs to be outsourced? Observers keep them honest? Uh, no.

So, you expect CSPAN and the invited rich constituents that sit up in the grandstands to keep their politicians honest???? what a fool!

The american people did vote out the republicans, and we got Obamacare, trillions in debt, 9.2% unemployment and a company friendly NMB. We also have unelected, unaccountable and lifetime union officers that lavish themselves with membership paid for expensive vehicles, steak dinners, trips, and hotels in return for concessionary deals for their people. Just like my wasted tax dollars.....I have wasted union dues. It's the American (Airlines) Way!!!

Here's some more numbers for your liking....

17.5 % wage cut since 2003
reduced ot pay
reduced holidays and pay
reduced vacations
higher out-of-pocket medical expenses
amounts to about $20,000 per year.
.....and the beat goes on month after month after month!!!!

Makes me proud to be a US Citizen, American Airlines employee and TWU member.


Overspeed, the more you talk, the more you're proving my point about the need for observers in all aspects of society.

You're right, we do have cheats, liars, scam artists, swindlers, and scumbags!
.....those aren't words I just made up!

 

[Buck]

So, you expect CSPAN and the invited rich constituents that sit up in the grandstands to keep their politicians honest???? what a fool!

The american people did vote out the republicans, and we got Obamacare, trillions in debt, 9.2% unemployment and a company friendly NMB. We also have unelected, unaccountable and lifetime union officers that lavish themselves with membership paid for expensive vehicles, steak dinners, trips, and hotels in return for concessionary deals for their people. Just like my wasted tax dollars.....I have wasted union dues. It's the American (Airlines) Way!!!

Here's some more numbers for your liking....

17.5 % wage cut since 2003reduced ot pay
reduced holidays and pay
reduced vacations
higher out-of-pocket medical expenses
amounts to about $20,000 per year.
.....and the beat goes on month after month after month!!!!

Makes me proud to be a US Citizen, American Airlines employee and TWU member.


Overspeed, the more you talk, the more you're proving my point about the need for observers in all aspects of society.

You're right, we do have cheats, liars, scam artists, swindlers, and scumbags!

Not the SRP's/OSM's of the time, they lost much more!

 

[Overspeed]

I'm pretty sure the back room dealmaking is not broadcast on Cspan or Senator Tom Coburn would not have said, "If you really knew what was being done in Washington, you would fire us all".

Exactly! The back room deal making is where it all goes down. Over dinner, the "oh BTW" cell phone calls, emails, etc... Observers won't solve that problem. That happens everywhere even in the production managers office, between the shop steward and supervisor, the Local President and the MD's, etc...

How about a "no deal cutting" clause in the Bylaws and Constitutions as well as the contract? When members cut deals with supervisors to change their shifts that they couldn't get if they really bid by seniority, vacations swapped violating seniority, OT deals undermining the OT list, etc... back room deals are a systemic problem. So what about those "observers" on the shop floor? Maybe we should start the "keeping them honest" program first on the floor.

 

[strikeforce]

Exactly! The back room deal making is where it all goes down. Over dinner, the "oh BTW" cell phone calls, emails, etc... Observers won't solve that problem. That happens everywhere even in the production managers office, between the shop steward and supervisor, the Local President and the MD's, etc...

How about a "no deal cutting" clause in the Bylaws and Constitutions as well as the contract? When members cut deals with supervisors to change their shifts that they couldn't get if they really bid by seniority, vacations swapped violating seniority, OT deals undermining the OT list, etc... back room deals are a systemic problem. So what about those "observers" on the shop floor? Maybe we should start the "keeping them honest" program first on the floor.

Overspeed, I'm not sure who you are or where your from, but If you only knew what my slogan was the last time I ran for office.....you would be proud! "NO DEALS"....and the membership didn't like it!!!

 

[Overspeed]

So, you expect CSPAN and the invited rich constituents that sit up in the grandstands to keep their politicians honest???? what a fool!

The american people did vote out the republicans, and we got Obamacare, trillions in debt, 9.2% unemployment and a company friendly NMB. We also have unelected, unaccountable and lifetime union officers that lavish themselves with membership paid for expensive vehicles, steak dinners, trips, and hotels in return for concessionary deals for their people. Just like my wasted tax dollars.....I have wasted union dues. It's the American (Airlines) Way!!!

Here's some more numbers for your liking....

17.5 % wage cut since 2003
reduced ot pay
reduced holidays and pay
reduced vacations
higher out-of-pocket medical expenses
amounts to about $20,000 per year.
.....and the beat goes on month after month after month!!!!

Makes me proud to be a US Citizen, American Airlines employee and TWU member.


Overspeed, the more you talk, the more you're proving my point about the need for observers in all aspects of society.

You're right, we do have cheats, liars, scam artists, swindlers, and scumbags!
.....those aren't words I just made up!

Can you blame them? The deal cutting starts when they walk in the door! From cutting deals on discipline, OT scams, CS scams, vacation change scams, etc... Did you expect them to change when you elected them Presidents of your Local? Who is the fool really? The problem is that when someone talks a little serious changes that may involve pain, many breakroom policitians say what the loud minority screams for.

Ask those Line Presidents who were at negotiations what was the topic of discussions in the 2003 concessions discussion. A few common sense Presidents said we should tell the Company to layoff who they have to and not cut pay much if at all. You would still be making SWA wages now! Instead the weak ones were afraid the members would eat them alive when they came back and told the members there will be RIFs. So deals were cut and concessions rolled out. That wasn't the Int'l, that was your Local Presidents who chose the pay cut option.

 

[strikeforce]

Exactly! The back room deal making is where it all goes down. Over dinner, the "oh BTW" cell phone calls, emails, etc... Observers won't solve that problem. That happens everywhere even in the production managers office, between the shop steward and supervisor, the Local President and the MD's, etc...

How about a "no deal cutting" clause in the Bylaws and Constitutions as well as the contract? When members cut deals with supervisors to change their shifts that they couldn't get if they really bid by seniority, vacations swapped violating seniority, OT deals undermining the OT list, etc... back room deals are a systemic problem. So what about those "observers" on the shop floor? Maybe we should start the "keeping them honest" program first on the floor.

There are observers...."the honest AMT's" and they are looked as the bad guys. Same way the union looks at "observers" at negotiations.

 

[strikeforce]

Can you blame them? The deal cutting starts when they walk in the door! From cutting deals on discipline, OT scams, CS scams, vacation change scams, etc... Did you expect them to change when you elected them Presidents of your Local? Who is the fool really? The problem is that when someone talks a little serious changes that may involve pain, many breakroom policitians say what the loud minority screams for.

Ask those Line Presidents who were at negotiations what was the topic of discussions in the 2003 concessions discussion. A few common sense Presidents said we should tell the Company to layoff who they have to and not cut pay much if at all. You would still be making SWA wages now! Instead the weak ones were afraid the members would eat them alive when they came back and told the members there will be RIFs. So deals were cut and concessions rolled out. That wasn't the Int'l, that was your Local Presidents who chose the pay cut option.

No, I don't expect our elected presidents to change for the goodness of all. It's the "me" factor. I'm with you regarding the RIF's over Concessions. When I lay blame towards the union leadership, local presidents are included. If you and others think Bob Owens isn't partially to blame for the stalled negotiations, he is. Bob, along with the rest of the leadership has no gameplan going forward to force AA's hand, besides "release". The NMB has indicated to the union "no release", so move on to plan B, there is no plan B. That's what angers me, that after 8 years.....there's NO PLAN B.

 

[High Speed Steel]

No, I don't expect our elected presidents to change for the goodness of all. It's the "me" factor. I'm with you regarding the RIF's over Concessions. When I lay blame towards the union leadership, local presidents are included. If you and others think Bob Owens isn't partially to blame for the stalled negotiations, he is. Bob, along with the rest of the leadership has no gameplan going forward to force AA's hand, besides "release". The NMB has indicated to the union "no release", so move on to plan B, there is no plan B. That's what angers me, that after 8 years.....there's NO PLAN B.

Couldn't agree with you more on the Bob comment. He sure has been quiet this week. It appears he confessed his misbehavior and "shut his pie hole"...lol

 

[TWU informer]

Couldn't agree with you more on the Bob comment. He sure has been quiet this week. It appears he confessed his misbehavior and "shut his pie hole"...lol

I agree with you.
But the definition of "misbehavior" is speaking his mind, and informing us all of happenings that we would have otherwise had no knowledge.
And the solution within this "union" is "shut your pie hole" and so you and other TWU worshippers can simply laugh.

That pretty much sums up where we are as a work group and as a union.

Good Luck with that!
We are F***ED

It doesn't matter that we are supressed and members.
It doesn't matter that we are just dues payers.
It doesn't matter that we spend more money on sports tickets and parties, than contract enforcement.

AS long as I've got mine Brother, I am content.
UNION MY ASS!

 

[High Speed Steel]

I agree with you.
But the definition of "misbehavior" is speaking his mind, and informing us all of happenings that we would have otherwise had no knowledge.
And the solution within this "union" is "shut your pie hole" and so you and other TWU worshippers can simply laugh.

That pretty much sums up where we are as a work group and as a union.

Good Luck with that!
We are F***ED

It doesn't matter that we are supressed and members.
It doesn't matter that we are just dues payers.
It doesn't matter that we spend more money on sports tickets and parties, than contract enforcement.

AS long as I've got mine Brother, I am content.
UNION MY ASS!

lol.....

 

[GeradArpey]

Well the DFW elections are starting to heat up with several of the candidates for president sending out mail outs to share their positions. It would appear that simply sending out a letter or placing flyers in the break rooms is the plan of attack. State an opinion enough and hope that it will somehow become fact. Kenya Hardrick’s attacks on Gary Peterson based on information provided by Larry Pike, Local 567 backing the morally bankrupt Keith Stewart and all three candidates ignoring John Talty for reasons that should be obvious to every voter. Friday’s debate should provide some good fodder and If nothing else it should make for an interesting afternoon at the hall.

 

[Overspeed]

Well the DFW elections are starting to heat up with several of the candidates for president sending out mail outs to share their positions. It would appear that simply sending out a letter or placing flyers in the break rooms is the plan of attack. State an opinion enough and hope that it will somehow become fact. Kenya Hardrick’s attacks on Gary Peterson based on information provided by Larry Pike, Local 567 backing the morally bankrupt Keith Stewart and all three candidates ignoring John Talty for reasons that should be obvious to every voter. Friday’s debate should provide some good fodder and If nothing else it should make for an interesting afternoon at the hall.

Will Gary make another dash for management? Or maybe that financial planning gig will pan out? How about HR, I understand he is very close to them?