Bob was right about 3Billion profit

[WorldTraveler]

BNA and RDU failed primarily because AA tried to create two SE hubs as alternatives to ATL and CLT and ended up w/ less mass than was necessary to effectively compete.
Both hubs were also heavily built using mainline equipment but it quickly became apparent that was too much capacity, and as has been noted before, the best use of AA's mainline equipment on the east coast was to build MIA, which AA did.

The new AA still has the challenge to create a profitable presence in the SE and up and down the east coast but by virtue of having fewer hubs and airlines involved, including the end of PIT, MEM, CVG, and much smaller hubs at IAD, the chances are very high that CLT can be a viable hub, even w/ MIA plus whatever happens between NYC and PHL.

 

[eolesen]

Not only was there too much capacity at RDU and BNA, the traffic was split by directionality.

Everything north-south was going to RDU, everything east-to-west was going to BNA. We'd have half-full wingtip departures to both hubs. Had it been just BNA or just RDU, it might have worked out better.

 

[Super FLUF]

The draw down of CLT has obviously already begun.



US Airways Launches Charlotte To London Heathrow Service

PR Newswire - Friday, March 29, 2013

TEMPE, Ariz., March 29, 2013 /PRNewswire/ --Tomorrow US Airways (LCC:NYSE) will begin daily, non-stop service between its largest hub in Charlotte, N.C. and London's preferred business airport, Heathrow. The daily flight will supplement the airline's existing daily service between its international gateway in Philadelphia and Heathrow, and replaces its current service between Charlotte and London's Gatwick airport, which ends today.

US Airways will operate the service between Charlotte and London Heathrow with Airbus A330 aircraft that features Envoy, the airline's international business class. Customers traveling in Envoy will experience the remarkably comfortable and private Envoy Suite equipped with an adjustable seat that reclines into a fully flat bed. The Envoy Suite also features personal in-flight entertainment and a 110-volt universal power outlet.

"US Airways' new daily service to Heathrow reinforces our commitment to our customers and to strengthening our trans-Atlantic network," said Suzanne Boda, US Airways' senior vice president, Airport Customer Service, International and Cargo. "Our new daily flight between our Charlotte hub and Heathrow connects customers in markets throughout the East Coast to London's preferred business and tourism hub."

 

[eolesen]

The draw down of CLT has obviously already begun.

STL, PIT and BNA all had service to London once, too.

Wouldn't get too worked up on moving an existing flight to LGW over to LHR. US was the last of the U.S. carriers serving LGW. Everyone else moved years ago.

Gotta wonder why the third-most important financial hub in the world wasn't already linked to LHR, though.

 

[dfw gen]

Thank goodness we have experts and wash outs in abundance!

 

[FWAAA]

STL, PIT and BNA all had service to London once, too.

Wouldn't get too worked up on moving an existing flight to LGW over to LHR. US was the last of the U.S. carriers serving LGW. Everyone else moved years ago.

Gotta wonder why the third-most important financial hub in the world wasn't already linked to LHR, though.

The LHR slot used by US to move that flight from LGW is the MIA-LHR slot that AA/BA provided to ensure approval of the JBA; what are the odds that new AA gets to keep that slot?

CLT will probably be connected to LHR even after the merger, but that MIA slot will probably have to be provided to another new entrant.

 

[WorldTraveler]

The LHR slot used by US to move that flight from LGW is the MIA-LHR slot that AA/BA provided to ensure approval of the JBA; what are the odds that new AA gets to keep that slot?

CLT will probably be connected to LHR even after the merger, but that MIA slot will probably have to be provided to another new entrant.

given that DL and VS are pushing for a joint venture that will put all 3 US carriers on similar footing with 15+ flights per day at LHR, there probably aren't any new entrants that could legitimately ask for the slot - or argue that there isn't enough competition in the market. Just because a new entrant (let's say B6 decides to start LHR flights) wants access to LHR doesn't mean that existing carriers have to provide access just because they are large.
The reason why AA/BA had to divest slots was because their JV made them so much larger than other carriers and there really was not reasonable check since UA was not and is not part of a JV that includes a carrier w/ an LHR hub.

The same principle could very well apply to GRU, however, esp. if AA ever intends to have a JV with JJ. Even if there are slots available, and the new terminals at GRU are intended to provide capacity to allow US-Brazil services to grow, there will be no carrier that is even remotely close to AA-JJ in terms of size to provide reasonable competition.

And US had the option of buying or leasing a slot on the

 

[LowManOnThePole]

US posted plenty in losses and has been to BK twice and also won over three rounds of concessions, what a blazing success USAir has been. The issues with AA were structural relating to labor costs-specifically crushing work rules that made certain markets uneconomical to serve, not because they didn't have a hub in Charlotte, try again. MIA is the preferred gateway to Latin America, the AA brand has considerable name recognition and history in that region, AA at MIA is much larger and serves more markets in Latin America and the Caribbean than DL at ATL or UA at IAH. The facilities at CLT are dumpy, it's not a major market that people travel to and from like BOS, LAX, MIA, NYC, etc.

CLT is big for US because that is all they have along with DCA, PHL, and PHX not because it is some amazing market that all the airlines are rushing to serve.

Josh

Well not everybody hates the South as much as high and mighty Josh does

http://www.travelandleisure.com/articles/americas-best-and-worst-airports/14

CLT is number 2 on America's best airports by Travel and Leisure..

 

[eolesen]

CLT is number 2 on America's best airports by Travel and Leisure..

Maybe that's because it's not crowded?...

First of all, it's an old story. The survey was done in 2011...

Second, the methodology is pretty specious. The publisher did the survey, not a neutral party, and didn't have any control factors.

Third, they only included the following 21 airports in the US:

 Atlanta, GA (Hartsfield-Jackson International Airport, ATL)
 Baltimore, MD (Baltimore/Washington International Thurgood Marshall Airport, BWI)
 Boston, MA (Logan International Airport, BOS)
 Charlotte, NC (Charlotte Douglas Airport, CLT)
 Chicago, IL (Chicago O’Hare International Airport, ORD)
 Denver, CO (Denver International Airport, DEN)
 Detroit, MI (Detroit Metro Airport, DTW)
 Houston, TX (Houston Intercontinental Airport, IAH)
 Irving, TX (Dallas/Fort Worth International Airport, DFW)
 Las Vegas, NV (McCarran International Airport, LAS)
 Los Angeles, CA (Los Angeles International Airport, LAX)
 Miami, FL (Miami International Airport, MIA)
 Minneapolis, Minnesota (St. Paul International Airport, MSP)
 Newark, NJ (Newark International Airport, EWR)
 New York, NY (John F. Kennedy International Airport, JFK)
 New York, NY (La Guardia Airport, LGA)
 Orlando, FL (Orlando International Airport, MCO)
 Philadelphia, PA (Philadelphia International Airport, PHL)
 Phoenix, AZ (Sky Harbor International Airport, PHX)
 San Francisco, CA (San Francisco International Airport, SFO)
 Seattle, Washington (Seattle-Tacoma International Airport, SEA)

It doesn't list some of what I'd consider good airports on all fronts, such as AUS, IND, DCA, PDX, or MDW.

 

[WorldTraveler]

And the $100 million question is, “How in the world has this survey changed any of the decisions that any airlines have made regarding the viability and development of their hubs?”

And the answer is clearly, “NONE.”

MSP and DTW are ranked far higher than ATL, which didn’t even make the list but neither did DFW, yet ATL and DFW are the #1 and #2 largest hubs in the US.

I supposed if you are looking for something to give you hope that CLT will remain important to the combined AA/US network, this survey is as good as any – but it says nothing about how viable CLT actually is as a hub and how its importance will change as a result of the merger.

 

[eolesen]

I think DFW and ATL were the 'tweeners. Not in the top 10 or bottom 10...

Surveys like this are almost as comical as hearing people quote JD Powers rankings, not realizing that companies have to pay JD Powers for the privilege of being ranked.....

 

[FWAAA]

You guys and your uppity critical thinking.

Of course, you're both correct.

I agree with eolesen's list of decent airports. Another favorite of mine is the new RDU terminal that replaced the old, cramped, "designed for connections and not O&D" AA hub terminal.

 

[WorldTraveler]

it's incredible to think a business should run itself based on logic.

 

[LD3]

Maybe that's because it's not crowded?...

40 mil pax a year...doesn't matter if it's o&d or xfer, the airport still has operate like one of the big boys to accomodate that volume of traffic...I just don't understand why all you airline superboys hate CLT so much, it has been a poven hub for US and may continue to be, if down the road it does not continue to be a viable hub then that will benefit the flying public with lower fares...

 

[WorldTraveler]

nobody hates any hub... but it isn't about emotion or preference or loyalty that will decide CLT's future - or that of any other airline hub.

The size of hubs will be determined by economic factors. CLT is as big as it is because it is the only hub for US in the SE and shared with large midcon hubs at ORD and DFW. It is anyone's guess how well CLT will fare when it has to compete for its position with multiple other hubs. OTOH, ATL hasn't shrunk since the NW merger when DL gained two strong hubs in the Midwest.... so perhaps all of the posturing about CLT will come to nothing.

In reality, PHX is probably a whole lot more at risk than CLT.