Bankruptcy

[comatose]

Bob has a lot to deliver on. That's why he has focused so much on the conspiracy theories and spinning that BK is really not that bad.

Have you seen this?

http://aviationblog.dallasnews.com/archives/2011/11/to-ta-or-not-to-ta-that-is-the.html

How could he deliver anything if it's the international and one other local president doing the negotiating.

Go ahead and try to deflect the accountability away from the International.

The TWU way is find me a scapegoat.

Don't settle for anything less than what you deserve.

 

[FWAAA]

If UAL outsources and spends more on OH than AA does, that's where that 13% figure comes into play and why FWAAA has such heartburn over it, then there is obviously a cost benefit to insourcing. The question is where is the crossover point where that's no longer the case and how close can we get to it? Ups told their guys the number was $40/ hr. So figure it's somewhere above that and below $50.

The only heartburn I suffer is when I realize that your fixation on nonsensical numbers like the 13% figure (which I debunked a little bit ago in Chuck's blog thread about negotiations) may be part of the reason that your brothers aren't getting the $50/hr they deserve.

Here's a link to the discussion of the 13% fallacy:

http://airlineforums.com/topic/35870-twu-negotiationswhat/page__view__findpost__p__844659

 

[TWU informer]

Bob has a lot to deliver on. That's why he has focused so much on the conspiracy theories and spinning that BK is really not that bad.

Have you seen this?

http://aviationblog.dallasnews.com/archives/2011/11/to-ta-or-not-to-ta-that-is-the.html

That letter looks like and is formatted just like a TWU International insert flyer for a ballot.

I would like to see a signature and "who" was passing it around in N.Y.

This means we will indeed have another T.A. this next week, and then the real manipulation will begin and in the end will have passed a worse T/A than the one we turned down....It's 1989 all over again.

Who is going to count the Fleet Ballots and the next M&R ballots?

 

[eolesen]

I, along with 2/3's of the membership gambled that the economy would turn around. It didn't, and you Informer nor the internAAtional could have predicted it.

Point of order... there were more than a few people predicting that the economy would not recover quickly and probably would head into a double-dip. We were labeled as everything from naysayers to racist bigots out to undermine the new POTUS...

 

[TWU informer]

Point of order... there were more than a few people predicting that the economy would not recover quickly and probably would head into a double-dip. We were labeled as everything from naysayers to racist bigots out to undermine the new POTUS...

But in every card game someone gambles. 🙂

 

[Bob Owens]

That letter looks like and is formatted just like a TWU International insert flyer for a ballot.

I would like to see a signature and "who" was passing it around in N.Y.

This means we will indeed have another T.A. this next week, and then the real manipulation will begin and in the end will have passed a worse T/A than the one we turned down....It's 1989 all over again.

Who is going to count the Fleet Ballots and the next M&R ballots?

Ballotts for the 562 election went out this week, last time they sent their lapdogs, including Steve Luis to tell our members that they were at a critical point in negotiations, that Tulsa was going to make sure Geo pay was in there,and needed to keep the committee as is, in other words not to vote for me. It had a big effect on the guys as they had never seen a President from Tulsa come to a line station and talk to the guys, and he told them what they wanted to hear, by the following Spring he broke his word and did not support Geo pay.

I have a pretty good idea where it came from, as usual, it was unsigned.

 

[Overspeed]

But in every card game someone gambles. 🙂

Yup. And the way Bob is playing, he will has already pushed the kids out of college and junior college is next. Nothing like playing games with other peoples money or in this case, jobs.

 

[Overspeed]

Point of order... there were more than a few people predicting that the economy would not recover quickly and probably would head into a double-dip. We were labeled as everything from naysayers to racist bigots out to undermine the new POTUS...

And the "recovery" we had just recovered some of the uber rich's bank accounts. Most of the middle class didn't get a job which is what I would think would be part of the recovery equation.

http://www.theatlantic.com/magazine/archive/2010/03/how-a-new-jobless-era-will-transform-america/7919/

"It’s likely, then, that for the next several years or more, the jobs environment will more closely resemble today’s environment than that of 2006 or 2007—or for that matter, the environment to which we were accustomed for a generation. Heidi Shierholz, an economist at the Economic Policy Institute, notes that if the recovery follows the same basic path as the last two (in 1991 and 2001), unemployment will stand at roughly 8 percent in 2014."

 

[comatose]

Given the trash TA we received in 2010 and knowing how the

economy has not improved and the financial state of this company,

I would gladly vote NO again.

 

[Bob Owens]

And the "recovery" we had just recovered some of the uber rich's bank accounts. Most of the middle class didn't get a job which is what I would think would be part of the recovery equation.

http://www.theatlantic.com/magazine/archive/2010/03/how-a-new-jobless-era-will-transform-america/7919/

"It’s likely, then, that for the next several years or more, the jobs environment will more closely resemble today’s environment than that of 2006 or 2007—or for that matter, the environment to which we were accustomed for a generation. Heidi Shierholz, an economist at the Economic Policy Institute, notes that if the recovery follows the same basic path as the last two (in 1991 and 2001), unemployment will stand at roughly 8 percent in 2014."

More fear, in the meantime mechanics are working tons of overtime on planes that fly full. I hear from mechanics at other carriers it's the same over there as well. Normally the airlines are the first ones hit by a recession but this time they seem to be the only ones not hit, weren't AAs revenues up 9% last quarter? Isn't AA on track to bring in $24 billion this year? How many times has AA brought in as much as $24 billion?

 

[Overspeed]

More fear, in the meantime mechanics are working tons of overtime on planes that fly full. I hear from mechanics at other carriers it's the same over there as well. Normally the airlines are the first ones hit by a recession but this time they seem to be the only ones not hit, weren't AAs revenues up 9% last quarter? Isn't AA on track to bring in $24 billion this year? How many times has AA brought in as much as $24 billion?

Full planes mean nothing if you aren't making enough to cover your costs. Is that how you run your home?

Bobby Jr,, "Dad pay me more allowance?"

You,"Uh son, my fuel cost are up, I need to buy a new car because the old one has 300,00 miles on it, and food has gotten expensive."

Bobby Jr, "Dad don't con me, you are always working OT and you and Mom just took a vacation."

You, "Son, don't question me. This is my house and my rules. Don't like, get a job and move out."

Based on your positions on this blog, you must be deeply in debt and cave to the son's demands.

Yep mechanics are working tons of OT. When I look around the DFW ready room at any of the terminals I see mechanics playing on their laptops for hours. And yes, I am one of them. If management would pull their head out of their "Blank" they wouldn't call in OT like they do. But hey, working one gate call for 8 hours tim and a half. That's money I can't turn down.

Revenues are up but guess what, so are costs.

I am sorry about telling the truth. If you would like to hear fairy tales then read your own stuff. Believe what you want to believe. Fact is every other airline union that took their chances in BK is not better off then they were before. Outsourcing is up, pensions got hammered, medical benefit costs went up, and the jobs have not returned. But they didn't have Bob Owens so we are going to get a different result...right? RIGHT?!?!

 

[Bob Owens]

Full planes mean nothing if you aren't making enough to cover your costs. Is that how you run your home? "Dad pay me more allowance, I know you worked a lot of OT?"

Revenues are up but guess what, so are costs.

No, I pay my bills and do without, I would not refurbish my terminals and buy nearly 500 new planes if I could not afford it. I would not write a blank check to the IT department either, nor would I install unneeded mods on planes I'm planning on dumping, or buy tablets that the mechanics don't want or any of the other things that AA has been doing to burn money. AA has been spending money like a drunken sailor for years, and you just accept it as an excuse not to pay us a fair wage, I don't.
AA seems to be able to afford anything and everything except paying us what we earned.
You said that every other airline union that took chances in BK is not better off than before, well are we better off than we were before the threat of BK?

 

[Mr Red]

Full planes mean nothing if you aren't making enough to cover your costs. Is that how you run your home?

Bobby Jr,, "Dad pay me more allowance?"

You,"Uh son, my fuel cost are up, I need to buy a new car because the old one has 300,00 miles on it, and food has gotten expensive."

Bobby Jr, "Dad don't con me, you are always working OT and you and Mom just took a vacation."

You, "Son, don't question me. This is my house and my rules. Don't like, get a job and move out."

Based on your positions on this blog, you must be deeply in debt and cave to the son's demands.

Yep mechanics are working tons of OT. When I look around the DFW ready room at any of the terminals I see mechanics playing on their laptops for hours. And yes, I am one of them. If management would pull their head out of their "Blank" they wouldn't call in OT like they do. But hey, working one gate call for 8 hours tim and a half. That's money I can't turn down.

Revenues are up but guess what, so are costs.

I am sorry about telling the truth. If you would like to hear fairy tales then read your own stuff. Believe what you want to believe. Fact is every other airline union that took their chances in BK is not better off then they were before. Outsourcing is up, pensions got hammered, medical benefit costs went up, and the jobs have not returned. But they didn't have Bob Owens so we are going to get a different result...right? RIGHT?!?!

YOU DON'T SEEM TO UNDERSTAND.We are the lowest of the low ,the other airlines are moving up as we speak.The last TRASH T/A would have set another Low for the airline AMT !!

 

[odie01]

YOU DON'T SEEM TO UNDERSTAND.We are the lowest of the low ,the other airlines are moving up as we speak.The last TRASH T/A would have set another Low for the airline AMT !!

He understands. Their is a reason why he posts, perhaps some form of compensation from the company union.

 

[strikeforce]

Full planes mean nothing if you aren't making enough to cover your costs. Is that how you run your home?

Bobby Jr,, "Dad pay me more allowance?"

You,"Uh son, my fuel cost are up, I need to buy a new car because the old one has 300,00 miles on it, and food has gotten expensive."

Bobby Jr, "Dad don't con me, you are always working OT and you and Mom just took a vacation."

You, "Son, don't question me. This is my house and my rules. Don't like, get a job and move out."

Based on your positions on this blog, you must be deeply in debt and cave to the son's demands.

Yep mechanics are working tons of OT. When I look around the DFW ready room at any of the terminals I see mechanics playing on their laptops for hours. And yes, I am one of them. If management would pull their head out of their "Blank" they wouldn't call in OT like they do. But hey, working one gate call for 8 hours tim and a half. That's money I can't turn down.

Revenues are up but guess what, so are costs.

I am sorry about telling the truth. If you would like to hear fairy tales then read your own stuff. Believe what you want to believe. Fact is every other airline union that took their chances in BK is not better off then they were before. Outsourcing is up, pensions got hammered, medical benefit costs went up, and the jobs have not returned. But they didn't have Bob Owens so we are going to get a different result...right? RIGHT?!?!

So, you want to blame Bob Owens, president of Local 562 for AA managements failure to properly manage the business. You're lucky you can sit at a laptop for 8 hours, and I wouldn't go around and brag about it because one day AA may ban laptops at work, and then what are you gonna do with yourself Overspeed? The fairy tales are two fold....the INTL has colluded with management to punish the AMT's for rejecting the POS T/A, and the company has made everything hunky dorry at work....unlimited CS's and sitting around for 8 hours playing the laptop....it's all part of the game so the troops don't rebel against either party....and, our membership is foolish enough to fall for this tactic. Talk about playing cards....no! it's called TWU/AA is playing US like a fiddle. If 11,000 idiots (me included) would get off their arses and show the company and INTL their displeasure with negotiations maybe we wouldn't be guessing on what's going to happen on November 17th!