August/September 2013 Fleet Discussion

[737823]

josh yes that is true. cwa rep agents are at all of us mainline cities... do not know about air wiskey or their ramp but in the cities such as mdt abe dtw buf etc and the list goes on the cwa has their own agents whereas the ramp was eliminated back in 03 n 05 and some of those cities closed up permanently

Thanks Robbed. SCOPE should be the number one priority here. I am sure the company will push for something similar to the UA agreement and only have SCOPE for the hubs but they should put their foot down to protect the remaining stations and insource as many as possible.

At US hubs is Express flying handled by mainline? AA has separate Eagle personnel at the hubs, outstations it varies.

Josh

 

[mike33]

i hear ya on the profit but in reality i do think the vast majority of those profits are strictly based on all the fees the company charges.. as for the fleet in no way shape or form would i want to see any kind of crappy deals that were handed to ua and hal i however want a contract as does many folks that has scpe enhancments and better wages and everything else but when will we get that is up in the air while ah knew if he stalled for 18 months i would not and never would expct him to actually come to an agreement in the light of the merger with aa i think he is going to stall til we get the green light to merge with aa then he will have forced the iam to negogiate a transitional agreement therefore he knows he would bypass the sec 6 i think thats the game plan ah wants and he will stop at nothing to get that and thats how i see it right now

Profits is profit...who cares where it comes from.
Remember 1 thing robbed......the company doesnt have a BK judge sitting in for them this time. Any mistakes made now are our own doing. I dont think the junior FSA realizes just what a good position they are in right now. Hell, settle now for peanuts and you could be with shells in 5-6 yrs compared to the rest of the industry. I expect with all the advertising thats been touted of the New American that the longer we hold out the more it is to our benefit. Problem is the AA guys outnumber us, but as much as they resent the TWU, it may work in our favor. Nobody wants labor unrest in this Merger.......

 

[Tim Nelson]

How many times do you have to be told a 401k is not a pension, it is a self-funded retirement account with a company match.

What about the workers who cant afford to contribute to a 401k?

What is their retirement?

Who said anything about a 401k being a defined pension? Who said it is self funded? Many 401ks are funded by the company, and a match to boot. The previous 401k that fleet had, the company funded up to 10% plus a 2% match. The United pilots just got the company to fund their 401k to the max levels, I believe a 14% company automatic contribution. Why do you keep saying that a 401k is self funding? It's only self funding if one chooses to take care of a match program or chooses to put in a certain % of earnings. Even in matches, it is at least 50% company funded. At AMR, the company contributions is actually greater than the IAMPF for topped out rampers who get the full match. But it's high time that unions start negotiating real 401ks and not just matches. At any rate, an option should be considered, sorta like how the IAM142 gave the AS rampers. Some are more comfortable with a pension, but others are more comfortable with portability, tax savings, and choices of defined contributions plans.

 

[Tim Nelson]

Profits is profit...who cares where it comes from.
Remember 1 thing robbed......the company doesnt have a BK judge sitting in for them this time. Any mistakes made now are our own doing. I dont think the junior FSA realizes just what a good position they are in right now. Hell, settle now for peanuts and you could be with shells in 5-6 yrs compared to the rest of the industry. I expect with all the advertising thats been touted of the New American that the longer we hold out the more it is to our benefit. Problem is the AA guys outnumber us, but as much as they resent the TWU, it may work in our favor. Nobody wants labor unrest in this Merger.......

+1

 

[robbedagain]

Thanks Robbed. SCOPE should be the number one priority here. I am sure the company will push for something similar to the UA agreement and only have SCOPE for the hubs but they should put their foot down to protect the remaining stations and insource as many as possible.

At US hubs is Express flying handled by mainline? AA has separate Eagle personnel at the hubs, outstations it varies.

Josh

yes i agree that scope is clearly the nbr 1 that we must secure
as for the hubs piedmont does the ramp for the express in phl and i think clt and dca not 100% sure of phx though in a nbr of cities where the ramp was outsourced piedmont took over and in one case after the contract ended expr jet took over then abandoned it w less than a yr left and piedmont took over again.

 

[rockit2]

Not only Retro but what about a signing bonus, second shift differential ?

 

[robbedagain]

Profits is profit...who cares where it comes from.
Remember 1 thing robbed......the company doesnt have a BK judge sitting in for them this time. Any mistakes made now are our own doing. I dont think the junior FSA realizes just what a good position they are in right now. Hell, settle now for peanuts and you could be with shells in 5-6 yrs compared to the rest of the industry. I expect with all the advertising thats been touted of the New American that the longer we hold out the more it is to our benefit. Problem is the AA guys outnumber us, but as much as they resent the TWU, it may work in our favor. Nobody wants labor unrest in this Merger.......

thats true and i never lost sight of that this time given that us did exit yrs ago but do you see my point mike that with the us making huge profits mostly on the fees the point is their making money and knowing allen hemmeraging hemmingway he and the monkeys running the circus are not wanting to pay crap. i agree with ya that the junior fsas need to be brought up to date and given facts i do that in my station on my shifts
now let me ask you this if we settled for peanuts we be shells in 5 to 6 yrs we still be behind in the entire airline world if you will.. but the longer we hold out and given the animosity that aa folks have with the twu but with the twu/iam association i would have to think that we could have more to benefit us than before am i right if thats what youre saying there bro.. while no one wants labor unrest in the merger... us monkey mgmt people are sure helping to get that one going with their stall n delay tatics

 

[mike33]

now let me ask you this if we settled for peanuts we be shells in 5 to 6 yrs we still be behind in the entire airline world if you will.. but the longer we hold out and given the animosity that aa folks have with the twu but with the twu/iam association i would have to think that we could have more to benefit us than before am i right if thats what youre saying there bro.. while no one wants labor unrest in the merger... us monkey mgmt people are sure helping to get that one going with their stall n delay tatics

The waiting /negotiating game should come to the forfront once the DOT approves this merger. IMO the TWU has written their future with the MOU. It is up to us to neg/neg/negotioate for a US Fleet contract before transition and we may have the opportunity to maybe better their MOU. They have signed..........we have yet too!

 

[robbedagain]

i understand that now mike thanks yes i def agree with you there the biggie quest is how quick would them monkeys at tempe circus want to settle with the fsa btwn now and say the govt approval

 

[Tim Nelson]

The waiting /negotiating game should come to the forfront once the DOT approves this merger. IMO the TWU has written their future with the MOU. It is up to us to neg/neg/negotioate for a US Fleet contract before transition and we may have the opportunity to maybe better their MOU. They have signed..........we have yet too!

That's one reason why the TWU supports the IAM section 6 talks, i.e., the wage reopener in 2015 is conditioned on the wages of United, Delta, US AIRWAYS. If the IAM just wimps out of section 6 and enters transition talks within 12 months after single carrier, then that screws over all AMR members since the US AIRWAYS wages will be stuck at $20.57. Big AH knows this as well so strategy is everything. AH knows that if he gives US AIRWAYS one penny, that will be calculated in with the new American wage starting in 2015. That's not so far away.

Unfortunately, I don't believe many TWU members are educated on the timetables and negotiations. I've spoken to many in ORD who seem to think that once single carrier is established that new negotiations is going to produce more wages rapidly. One thing is for sure, history of transition talks is clear, quick transition negotiations result in something as soon as 3 years but most transition talks take 3+ years with an average of 5 years.

 

[mike33]

That's one reason why the TWU supports the IAM section 6 talks, i.e., the wage reopener in 2015 is conditioned on the wages of United, Delta, US AIRWAYS. If the IAM just wimps out of section 6 and enters transition talks within 12 months after single carrier, then that screws over all AMR members since the US AIRWAYS wages will be stuck at $20.57. Big AH knows this as well so strategy is everything. AH knows that if he gives US AIRWAYS one penny, that will be calculated in with the new American wage starting in 2015. That's not so far away.

Unfortunately, I don't believe many TWU members are educated on the timetables and negotiations. I've spoken to many in ORD who seem to think that once single carrier is established that new negotiations is going to produce more wages rapidly. One thing is for sure, history of transition talks is clear, quick transition negotiations result in something as soon as 3 years but most transition talks take 3+ years with an average of 5 years.

Point taken. I am hoping that this merger is not the norm, as the touting goes on about how great its going to be for everyone, the pressure is turned up on everyone but us if we stay patient.

 

[mike33]

i understand that now mike thanks yes i def agree with you there the biggie quest is how quick would them monkeys at tempe circus want to settle with the fsa btwn now and say the govt approval

Robbed, govt approval will come the first week in Sept if not sooner. No way anything moves for us before that. ( IMO)

 

[robbedagain]

the first week oh i thought it was towards the end of sep ok.. if no sec 6 produces agreement by then and if the nmb does not release fsa or even the mechanics what are the next steps

 

[mike33]

the first week oh i thought it was towards the end of sep ok.. if no sec 6 produces agreement by then and if the nmb does not release fsa or even the mechanics what are the next steps

Lock n' Load

 

[Tim Nelson]

+1