August/September 2013 Fleet Discussion

[cltrat]

Maybe you need to attend a union meeting, ask your shop stewards, grievance committee or AGCs, I was told by some friends on the ramp the Baskett was going through all the breakrooms last week and briefing everyone. And Fairbanks gave a detailed update at the union meeting, as did M&R GC and GLRs.

Maybe they should give more than one briefing since everyone is not there every day.
Or better yet they could send me a letter with an update sort of like the one I got when they told me my pension was being cut.
As far as the meetings no thanks, I live thirty miles away and I don't need to drive a 60 mile round trip to listen to Cashion tell me what crooked politician I need to support.\
I still recall him telling us how great Jim Black was and anyone with a third of a brain knew he was going to prison.
Now my shop steward who I trust more than anyone else close to this has not been there when I worked this week.

 

[Tim Nelson]

Maybe you need to attend a union meeting, ask your shop stewards, grievance committee or AGCs, I was told by some friends on the ramp the Baskett was going through all the breakrooms last week and briefing everyone. And Fairbanks gave a detailed update at the union meeting, as did M&R GC and GLRs.

I can tell you that MF doesn't give any detailed report. He is an arrogant prick who doesn't even answer questions and talks down to everyone. We gave him a piece of our mind in ORD when he played his game. MB, OTOH, isn't so high and mighty and actually answered questions and he doesn't talk down like MF does.

regards,

 

[Jester]

Now my shop steward who I trust more than anyone else close to this has not been there when I worked this week.

That's about the truth of the matter here in PHX too. Just seems that so many above the shop steward level become more corporate in nature with their placating and non-answers to questions. Even some of the shop stewards sound more like Company types, including the more "senior" guys in the union. I expect an adversarial relationship with Management while representing my rights, instead of acting as a "deal maker" where the Company is in the wrong. Just seems that the longer people stay in the union above the rank and file, the more they want the rank and file not to bother them, and maybe they have lost their fire to represent the Membership.

 

[roabilly]

This thread has regressed into a political garbage dump!

We have “Josh” (a banker in Boston) that has an unnatural fixation with destroying the IAM, who is now posting in tandem with Nelson. Then… we have Nelson… who claims to be fully at peace with himself, while claiming to “love life” after his dismal showing in the last 141elections.

This observation is so full contradictions that it would leave Steven Hawking bemused!

1) If Nelson is so content, then why does he spend countless hours -- days -- weeks -- months -- years -- and decades on his obsession with discrediting the IAM?

2) If Josh is banker in BOS, what drives his obsession with discrediting the IAM?

Folks’… it doesn’t take a Rocket Scientist to see what’s happing here! 700 has posted facts… proof… and case history-- yet... the spin continues just as it has for “countless hours -- days — weeks -- months -- years -- and decades”!

Meanwhile… Fleet is at critical point in history, and the proponents of discord hammer away at any trust and/or credibility between the Membership and the Bargaining Unit… you do the math!

 

[roabilly]

I can tell you that MF doesn't give any detailed report. He is an arrogant prick who doesn't even answer questions and talks down to everyone. We gave him a piece of our mind in ORD when he played his game. MB, OTOH, isn't so high and mighty and actually answered questions and he doesn't talk down like MF does.

regards,

MF has forgotten more than you will ever know about creditability! The man tells it like it is… as does MB! You hold grudges against those who will not blindly follow your convoluted megalomaniacal agenda-- It’s as simple as that!

I suppose that’s why we don’t exchange Christmas Cards!

 

[mike33]

This thread has regressed into a political garbage dump!

We have “Josh” (a banker in Boston) that has an unnatural fixation with destroying the IAM, who is now posting in tandem with Nelson. Then… we have Nelson… who claims to be fully at peace with himself, while claiming to “love life” after his dismal showing in the last 141elections.

It has become repetitive harping on the same subjects over and over. At what point does it all narrow to whats coming in the next few months. What intrigues those that aren't fleet to hijack threads on subjects that have no outcome for them?.....

It's like kids with no manners!

 

[roabilly]

It has become repetitive harping on the same subjects over and over. At what point does it all narrow to whats coming in the next few months. What intrigues those that aren't fleet to hijack threads on subjects that have no outcome for them?.....

It's like kids with no manners!

I’ll wager that it’s not as much “intrigue” as it is “objective”! You and I both know the deal here… after all… it’s not that difficult ascertain! We are both veterans of this thread, as well as the Industry. We both understand the realities of Collective Bargaining under the auspices of the RLA...

So... it's more like kids playing charades, only with with limited acting skills!

 

[necigrad]

All I know for certain is that if the Tim Nelson/700UW posts were deleted this thread would be a hell of a lot more efficient, manageable, and probably productive as well. And that's assuming no one is avoiding it because of the fighting. If there are people ignoring it for that reason, stopping the fighting would INCREASE the participation in the forum, which would INCREASE the knowledgebase, INCREASE the amount of informed and proactive members, and INCREASE solidarity.

Note that this only applies to their back and forth. It does NOT apply to the on topic discussions, whether they be correct and accurate or not.

Just a random thought from a random guy.

 

[Tim Nelson]

What is being said in the breakrooms by the NC?

Members of the NC came to ORD and our members there heard the NC say that they were digging in and getting a fair and equitable contract now, not waiting for transitions. Specifically, it was said that they are asking for things north of the AMR contract. I myself think the focus shouldn't be on an AMR bankrupt contract but I understand the line of conversation will necessarily involve AMR in it. North of AMR is certainly on the right path.

However, I have received calls saying that in some breakrooms, they are saying that the transition talks is where they will gain the most. What have brothers and sisters on this board hear? FWIW: Transition talks suck and always have, and because of no strength in transition talks, they usually drag out for years and years. Moreso, lately.

regards,

 

[Tim Nelson]

A good marker for how our leadership is positioned, regardless of what they say or what we support, will be the signing of a helping hand agreement, or the refusal to sign such an agreement.

Gosh I hope Delaney doesn't give any help on this without getting some big items first. Usually, helping hand agreements are signed by the union leaders to help management, but are packaged and explained to the membership that the agreement helps the members. Again, hopefully, nothing is signed helping the merger without getting substantial gain, otherwise it will undercut and lessen leverage for our NC.

This is the first thing we have to watch for and it will necessarily tell us if we are being played or not.

I'm very cautious because IAM141 said all the right things and did all the right things at Hawaiian and United, but at the end of the day, it stole from the membership at Hawaiian, and attempted thievery at United. Watch for that helping hand agreement. It is a marker that will determine future events.

Now is the time to support the NC, but the signing of a helping hand agreement will not be supported by me unless it had substantial gain [which they never do].

regards,

 

[Tim Nelson]

MF has forgotten more than you will ever know about creditability! The man tells it like it is… as does MB! You hold grudges against those who will not blindly follow your convoluted megalomaniacal agenda-- It’s as simple as that!

I suppose that’s why we don’t exchange Christmas Cards!

It's not important that we don't exchange Christmas cards, take it easy.

Perhaps my ego is a bit bigger than it should be, but I'm fairly proud of what I have accomplished for the memberships of this district as a lot of my work has resulted in immediate benefit for the membership, and explicitly so.

Whatever the case, as I told MB, I'm not soliciting respect or trust so it doesn't bother me that MB said he has absolutely no respect for me. That's fine. I've heard it before.

At any rate, me, you, and most if not all on this board do have a commonality we are fighting for, i.e., digging in and standing firm for a solid contract now. That's a worthy position, one that our NC has also taken, and I think we have great leverage in doing so. In fact, me and you have been on the same side of almost every fight, even politically, except one. Keep up the fight Roabilly, I like that in ya.

regards

 

[700UW]

AA is interested in using US employees to work their flights as a vendor.

 

[737823]

AA is interested in using US employees to work their flights as a vendor.

Makes economic sense to do so, thanks to the bargain basement agreement the IAM produced and has maintained for eight years.

Josh

 

[700UW]

Lets see do the math, 13-8= bankruptcy cba.

Now its 2008, they negotiated a transition agreement that gave them back some of the things lost.

Once again you post nothing you know of.

And US has 33 stations where fleet is, AA has 17, UA has like 25, DL I believe has less than US.

So keep trying, dont you have to evict someone from their house with your foreclosure paperwork.

And tell the board who you work for and if your company took TARP funds.

You have only been asked over a dozen times.

 

[737823]

Tim has said repeatedly that the transition agreement isn't a bankruptcy agreement, they added IAMNPF to replace the 401K. But 2005 or 2008, it has still been prolonged concessions for the membership.

Josh