April/May 2013 IAM Fleet Discussions

[mike33]

huh? You havent done anything different. Calm down, joint talks cant happen until the merger is complete. Delaney negotiated in section 6 at ua until one year after single carrier so get your facts straight. Did ur little brother walk past you in your own station against your recommendation and the 4 agcs there and bust off a nomination right in front of you. you establishment boys just dont listen you dont listen and you will make the same mistakes as the other nc. Are you going to tell everyone the small ass wage you guys are asking the company for? Lol

The election is over. But if you say something is amiss? Then so be it. We will see.
I have a question though Tim?

If you know of the wage proposal then post it for us!! If you are guessing then thats not representative of a leadership i want to partake in.

 

[robbedagain]

CB i know i appreciate it as does my coworkers in my station all the work yes it may be slow but at least things seem to be progressing along for the better... may i suggest to you and the nc to see if its possible if you could get a 401k with match like what the airline used to have and i believe aa has it now good luck cb and the entire crew im glad that you and the crew are making progress

 

[charlie Brown]

CB i know i appreciate it as does my coworkers in my station all the work yes it may be slow but at least things seem to be progressing along for the better... may i suggest to you and the nc to see if its possible if you could get a 401k with match like what the airline used to have and i believe aa has it now good luck cb and the entire crew im glad that you and the crew are making progress

Robbed
I'll be honest, I don't think that's something you'll see until we get to the joint agreement, simply because that's not something we would feel we have to have now in order to move to joint talks. Don't know who is going to be on that committee, but I would hope we would have both, and if not, give the members a one time choice of which one they would prefer. That's just my 2 cents. And I'll pass along the good luck. Thanks

 

[Tim Nelson]

Tim
I thought it was going to get posted, but seen today it wasn't, I'm going to make some calls tomorrow, I was too busy today, but you may have to give me a couple of days. That's the best I can do.

thank you. regards,

 

[robbedagain]

thank you cb i guess for the interim time being i think better sick wages scope language and protections are the top priority good luck again

 

[ChockJockey]

Ask and ye shall receive.

http://www.twubkfact...OZQ=&tabid=1494

Well I'm fine with DOC slotting...I'd have been fine with DOH too, wouldn't have made much of a difference in my case anyway. Hopefully this part goes smoothly enough, I don't want to be here six years from now arguing about it, that's for sure...

 

[Tim Nelson]

CB i know i appreciate it as does my coworkers in my station all the work yes it may be slow but at least things seem to be progressing along for the better... may i suggest to you and the nc to see if its possible if you could get a 401k with match like what the airline used to have and i believe aa has it now good luck cb and the entire crew im glad that you and the crew are making progress

i believe our nc has shifted prematurely on a comprehensive bargaining stance. I dont believe 142 has made a similar move. Imo, the iam will hoodwink our nc into a half ass mini contract with sad wage increases in 2012 and 2013. Then 142 will double up. Dont get your hopes up with the pollyannas who will tell you a small pay raise is all you can get. Our leverage is strong because management needs things to move fast. Dont get pissed at me, the ua members were pissed at me until they found out who was telling the truth and who was lying all along. At united, other unions got 12%-17% pay raises before joint talks and are now negotiating for another 15%. But our goofy eboard decided 5%-11% was good enuf for 7 years. Cb never bothered standing up against that 'ramp treason" even though he was on the eboard and knew such a nasty contract would necessarily affect usairways negotiations. regards,

 

[mike33]

The election is over. But if you say something is amiss? Then so be it. We will see.
I have a question though Tim?

If you know of the wage proposal then post it for us!! If you are guessing then thats not representative of a leadership i want to partake in.

Ok, so i understand you wouldn't say one way or the other as it verifies that someone on the inside is passing info to you. I agree with your line of thinking if that is the case. What i don't agree with is the accusation that the committee is settling for a paltry wage increase and trying to get CB to acknowledge it. I wouldn't expect him to respond to that just as you aren't responding. Nothing is final till signatures are on the paper.

As i was typing you were posting the previous post! The readers should know for clarification that that was the previous contract that we are under now. Correct ?

 

[Tim Nelson]

Ok, so i understand you wouldn't say one way or the other as it verifies that someone on the inside is passing info to you. I agree with your line of thinking if that is the case. What i don't agree with is the accusation that the committee is settling for a paltry wage increase and trying to get CB to acknowledge it. I wouldn't expect him to respond to that just as you aren't responding. Nothing is final till signatures are on the paper.

As i was typing you were posting the previous post! The readers should know for clarification that that was the previous contract that we are under now. Correct ?

just seen the amr "talking points" for its managers. They said the aflcio recommendation is similar to the cwa/ibt arrangement. Management and both unions will benefit with that so i hope the workers do as well. Not sure when this is legally possible but it was beneficial for upstairs. The question is, how early can the nmb transfer the certification to the new entity? Im a bit fuzzy on that but i would think the nmb would love the idea and could even do it before final merger approval with the risk being born on the unions(small risk). Interesting

 

[mike33]

I missed the point of Quoting me with your answer?......but it had to be addressed so now we move on

 

[700UW]

The ibt left the afl-cio along with the SEIU and started their own alliance, they werent thrown out of the afl.

 

[necigrad]

Ahhh...

 

[Kev3188]

That is everyone’s gripe about every large bureaucracy in existance! Name me one Airline Union that is not perceived that way. Hell-- name me one multilayered government, business, or origination that is not viewed this way. The very nature of nondisclosure agreements and Government oversight serve to further compound this perception in our industry.

The difference is that people work *for* a corporation. A union works *for* it's people.

NDA'S, the RLA, etc. are all well and good, but you're using those as a rationalization for the keeping the status quo. All of those things are what they are. You can still build a bottom-up structure, and foster engagement despite them.

Guys like Timmy use this reality to further divide the Membership with mistrust that is continually inflamed with rhetoric. The N/D guys are the most transparent we have ever had-- They are light years ahead of past regimes in terms of communication and trust!

I was afraid my posts might be construed as a knock against your NC. They're not. My indictment of the current "system" goes far beyond them, and far beyond DL 141.

...then unionism is the perfect place since all can't be satisfied the same way.

My "mindset" is that America's working class needs to start pushing back. We've been conditioned for far too long that "they can do that, brother," "we did the best we could," and "we'll live to fight another day" are acceptable bargaining positions. We've become complacent, and allowed those we've elected to speak for us to do the same.

As for being satisfied, you're absolutely correct. Some place an emphasis on Scope. Others base rates. And so it goes. That's not a bad thing as long as the entire membership is *engaged.* When that happens, almost nothing is impossible.

yes it may be slow but at least things seem to be progressing along for the better...

IMO, slow can be okay (see ROA's comments about government oversight), as long as people are kept involved and informed.

The ibt left the afl-cio along with the SEIU and started their own alliance, they werent thrown out of the afl.

Yep. Change to Win.

Separate from that-and I know I've said it before- IMO Andy Stern was as detrimental to labor as any boss could've ever been.

 

[roabilly]

The difference is that people work *for* a corporation. A union works *for* it's people.

I agree that people work for Corporations, Unions work for people. The conundrum lies within this simple concept—The Unions are working for people BECAUSE people work for Corporations! You see, we cannot escape the reality of complex, multifaceted, and hierarchical influence either way. We already have a fluid mechanism for electing our officers… much more fluid than that of the Corporations. Have you ever voted on who would be CEO of US/AA? Have you ever voted on who would represent the Company in negotiations?

When you enter Government oversight, business ruthlessness, American politics, GOPAC legislation, and finally, unadulterated GREED into the equation-- You come up with exactly where we are now… give or take release or cool down period!

Further, you may, or may not have noticed that the Airline Industry has more clout with American Government than you may think. Case in point, the Airlines just got a resolution to a sequestered budget that was adversely influencing on time performance and profits! Think about this… a divided Congress made an exception to a bitter partisan grid locked political battle to just to appease the Airlines!

Now… what would YOU do if you were a Union Leader/ Negotiator? Would you simply propose a strike on the first day? Guess what… you CAN’T! You would be in violation of the RLA! The facts are you would have to play by the exact same rules as every committee has for decades! You would not be able to do one single thing better, or faster-- that’s reality!

 

[freedom]

Congress appeased the people not the airlines ,not to mention polticians fly too.