April/May 2013 IAM Fleet Discussions

[The Bagfather]

The senority LOA is very intriguing to me. I always thought it should have been a non issue, because every concept of fairness in this situation spoke for it. The TWU now gains credibility and may be a stronger contender for representation. The IAM gains
points for what I think is placing the memberships good ahead of its own agenda. It also IMO makes an easier way for some compromise deal to be struck. It also takes away one of the main stated reasons brought up for the urgency of a new contract which was seniority protection. Someone more in the mix could maybe comment on that. BF

 

[Kev3188]

Yes they do. They have those mentioned, and SAN, LAX, SFO, SEA, DFW, ORD, ATL, BDL, TPA, FLL, MCO, and I might be missing one or two. But with those listed, 4 can be cut. Don't spread lies that there's none to cut.

I thought I read on here that BDL maintenance had closed??

Charlie…
It’s real simple... if you are not a mindless Nelson minion… you are someone else’s “children”!

I know I'm gonna get torched for this, but there is definitely a current of paternalism (and condescension) in the IAM hierarchy. Too much "we know what's best for you," and "we got this," and not enough building from the bottom up.

They are relying on an antiquated mindset (be it for organizing, Section 6, etc.) that is no longer effective, and labor is paying the price.

Tim's comment may have been poorly delivered, but it spoke to something that absolutely exists, and absolutely needs to change if progress is to be made.

 

[robbedagain]

i think this part from www.justplanenews.com an article in the dallasnews.com was interesting pertaining to the twu/iam seniority agreement...
it says it wont be date of hire... FOR MOST EMPLOYEES we think it will be date of hire...

 

[700UW]

Date of Classification

 

[necigrad]

What's DOC as opposed to DOH going to do to those who were gifted DOH in the merger?

 

[psa8979]

"Date of Entry" means the day you started in the Classification or Class and Craft. I will use my history in the Industry to give an example. Started working for Crownair FBO owned by PSA in 1975; drove the Shuttle Bus in SAN/MO until 1979; entered the F/S Classification at LAS in 1979 Ramp/Operations. My Entry Date will be 08/09/1979. Basically what LOA has done has made those Airline Workers "Whole" in "Their Entry Classification" and probably in most cases have their Majority of time or Seniority. Solidarity in DFW .

 

[Tim Nelson]

Tim
What's up with the name calling?? Seems a little junior high school to me. My little bro used to always call me names, cause he could never win a fight. So I'll tell you the same thing I told him. If it makes you feel better, then ok, go ahead. Calling members children, and Mr x and laughing about it, I bet it makes everyone on here regret not voting for you for pres of our district. With all that stand up character you display!! Keep it going strong!!! Like I said. You are your own worst enemy. Anyway, I'm off here for the night. Good talking to ya today!!

stand up character? Who is the one posting under charlie brown? I think if someone thinks i am my own worst enemy then they are misled insomuch as i dont kiss the established ass in over 15 years of less than fair representation by the iam. I do enjoy the respect that the membership has given me. Winning organizing drives command respect when i worked for the establishment. Flying down to clt and walking past you and every established leader that clt has to pick up my nomination there was respec from the masses. Getting out the no vote on a arsehat ta at ua and shutting it down over the "establishment" when im not even a united employee shows credentials. Suspending my campaign and putting together a complaint against ou and the entire eboard is also pending but undetermined at this time. I have reason to believe a determination is coming this week. Time will tell.
Im not your little brother and i always find it interesting how you and the establishment continue to show disregard for some things. You arent concerned about me opinion? That is disappointing since my opinion has been in the strong majority most times (and each leadership team has noted this) i exercised my opinion on a ua or us contract vote (. I realize there are some pollyannaism on this forum but i think you ought to do a better job of considering opinions thanthe ua nc. And can you ask delaney to post the loa you guys are talking about? Its a fair request and im not sure why i should even have to ask this since our members deserve the respect to br able to read it. regards

 

[blue collar]

I thought I read on here that BDL maintenance had closed??

You're correct. I don't work there anymore, and forgot they had closed it

 

[mike33]

"Date of Entry" means the day you started in the Classification or Class and Craft. I will use my history in the Industry to give an example. Started working for Crownair FBO owned by PSA in 1975; drove the Shuttle Bus in SAN/MO until 1979; entered the F/S Classification at LAS in 1979 Ramp/Operations. My Entry Date will be 08/09/1979. Basically what LOA has done has made those Airline Workers "Whole" in "Their Entry Classification" and probably in most cases have their Majority of time or Seniority. Solidarity in DFW .

Wow...i remember you. What a lucky guy to be driving all those women in ' Hot Pants" back and forth to the crew lounge.....Every single flight att had to pass thru as San was the only crew base!

 

[roabilly]

I thought I read on here that BDL maintenance had closed??



I know I'm gonna get torched for this, but there is definitely a current of paternalism (and condescension) in the IAM hierarchy. Too much "we know what's best for you," and "we got this," and not enough building from the bottom up.

They are relying on an antiquated mindset (be it for organizing, Section 6, etc.) that is no longer effective, and labor is paying the price.

Tim's comment may have been poorly delivered, but it spoke to something that absolutely exists, and absolutely needs to change if progress is to be made.

That is everyone’s gripe about every large bureaucracy in existance! Name me one Airline Union that is not perceived that way. Hell-- name me one multilayered government, business, or origination that is not viewed this way. The very nature of nondisclosure agreements and Government oversight serve to further compound this perception in our industry.

Guys like Timmy use this reality to further divide the Membership with mistrust that is continually inflamed with rhetoric. The N/D guys are the most transparent we have ever had-- They are light years ahead of past regimes in terms of communication and trust!

 

[mike33]

That is everyone’s gripe about every large bureaucracy in existance! Name me one Airline Union that is not perceived that way. Hell-- name me one multilayered government, business, or origination that is not viewed this way. The very nature of nondisclosure agreements and Government oversight serve to further compound this perception in our industry.

Guys like Timmy use this reality to further divide the Membership with mistrust that is continually inflamed with rhetoric. The N/D guys are the most transparent we have ever had-- They are light years ahead of past regimes in terms of communication and trust!

Totally agree ROA. If you want to use mindset against your own, then unionism is the perfect place since all can't be satisfied the same way. One has to negotiate with that in mind and try and do what the committee decides. This is no place for (1) person to dictate. As a committee, the ND is doing a find job for US. Can you ever recall a previous RC group as forthright as ND? Not ever.

 

[roabilly]

Totally agree ROA. If you want to use mindset against your own, then unionism is the perfect place since all can't be satisfied the same way. One has to negotiate with that in mind and try and do what the committee decides. This is no place for (1) person to dictate. As a committee, the ND is doing a find job for US. Can you ever recall a previous RC group as forthright as ND? Not ever.

Agreed "33"!

 

[blue collar]

Name me one Airline Union that is not perceived that way. .

AMFA

 

[700UW]

What about the failed strike at NW?

And the $500,000 payment to Delle Femme?

Members didnt vote on those funds.

And no strike fund.

 

[mike33]

AMFA

A union has to believe that there is strength in numbers. I dont believe that AMFA feels that way as far back as i can remember !

"
AMFA’s Record Against Solidarity

written & posted 11/05​

A letter from National Director Delle-Femine April 28, 1994​

“ Our task, our mission is to separate from the cleaners/janitors. That’s our goal, and through your support and help we will win.”​

April 4, 1994 “The Mechanic” flyer​

“Mechanics and Inspectors wages historically have been sacrificed by the IAM in order to provide an artificially high scale for the unskilled workers who dominate the catch-all union.”​

AMFA memo April 7, 1994​

“The mechanics at UAL are being forced to make concessions for the unskilled class of cleaners and baggage handlers.”​

* AMFA’s attorney Lee Seham in an August 11, 1994 letter to the National Mediation Board arguing AMFA should not have to represent United Airlines’ Cleaners because,​

“The professional lives and collective bargaining aspirations of skilled craftsmen cannot be dictated by individuals who preponderantly wipe tray tables, dispose of trash, or clean the exterior of an aircraft with a mop. Forcing this unnatural alliance guarantees instability.​

Thats not a union i want on the property!​