April/May 2013 IAM Fleet Discussions

[700UW]

The merger is not secure, there will be changes and layoffs, especially PHX. Doug has all ready abandoned PHX as the HDQ will be in Texas and not PHX.

US is making record profits, it did not need a merger to survive.

Airlines have come and gone and employees have done the same.

 

[freedom]

The merger is not secure, there will be changes and layoffs, especially PHX. Doug has all ready abandoned PHX as the HDQ will be in Texas and not PHX.

US is making record profits, it did not need a merger to survive.

Airlines have come and gone and employees have done the same.

I'm sorry that you can't see the benefit to our increased job security .

and yes , I'm aware that anything could happen to PHX , while I and others would like to hope that we will survive , we have seen CMH , we have seen PIT,LAS ...no one knows who could be next ...

but on average and overall , this will make the entire network stronger ..

I know that some of you will chime in that I will probably survive any culling , but I urge you to remember LAS ... even my seniority wouldn't have protected me from that (and they are a major tourist city ) ..but as I've said , it is my sincere hope that PHX will be spared .

 

[700UW]

How much job security did the US/HP merger bring?

Ramp laid off, pilots laid off.

So no one has job security in a merger, whats gonna happen to cities were AA is large and US is small and vice a versa?

 

[necigrad]

For the record, I have to emphasize that Freedom (and all the others that voted for the '08 contract) did not cause the LAS cutbacks. I think and argument MIGHT be made that without the outsourcing in the contract LAS would not have happened, but I wouldnt' call it a strong argument. Keep that in mind, because PHX can EASILY be cut just like LAS in the next several years. What's the DOH of #100 in PHX? If you're near that person I'd consider life in another city or outside of US.

 

[ChockJockey]

I don't need to do it , but if you feel the desire to quote me , go ahead ...I've already explained my world view to our AA brothers and sisters ..

I am on record has having voiced complete confidence in this companies management .. I've said before and will say again , that I think Doug parker is the best airline CEO in the industry .

I think you grossly overestimate your own influence.

 

[freedom]

I think you grossly overestimate your own influence.

I think you grossly overestimate your own influence.

not really , I have what could be called an almost complete vote of no confidence from the members of this forum ...

I would put my influence at zero ... one if I count myself LOL ...

 

[ChockJockey]

not really , I have what could be called an almost complete vote of no confidence from the members of this forum ...

I would put my influence at zero ... one if I count myself LOL ...

Why is it that you shrug and concede job losses and displacements for a stronger network but when it comes to the possibility of a fraction of your pay going to the pension you start breathing fire?

 

[freedom]

Why is it that you shrug and concede job losses and displacements for a stronger network but when it comes to the possibility of a fraction of your pay going to the pension you start breathing fire?

because i don't believe that the pension is sound .....

no point in throwing good money after bad ....

i'm fine with todays current levels of contributions , but i have no wish to , contract after contract divert more of our workers compensation package to a pension that will grow weaker and weaker , requiring ever higher amounts of money in order to stay solvent .

 

[robbedagain]

HEY freedom what will you say or think youll say if and only if the govt were to say no to aa n us merger? i bet you would nt be able to have anything to say. as far as you having something against the union leaders making 100k what about the twu folks who sold you down the river without life jackets n anchors.. you sure as hell dont care that you sent 30 some stations mostly out west packin... basically saying adios amigos to thousands of your fellow co workers... face it dude get help... the pension is a hell of a lot more sound than workin in the airline industry as has been proven time n time again with the closure of cities
your distate for ur own coworkers sure as hell shows here just wait til sept when the govt says yea or nea to the merger... and id say in 2 yrs or less phx will be a focus city may be.... with aa lax n dfw there is no need to keep phx a hub just a presence or focus city should do
may be you wil be one of the ones to lose ur job and see how u feel then

 

[freedom]

HEY freedom what will you say or think youll say if and only if the govt were to say no to aa n us merger? i bet you would nt be able to have anything to say. as far as you having something against the union leaders making 100k what about the twu folks who sold you down the river without life jackets n anchors.. you sure as hell dont care that you sent 30 some stations mostly out west packin... basically saying adios amigos to thousands of your fellow co workers... face it dude get help... the pension is a hell of a lot more sound than workin in the airline industry as has been proven time n time again with the closure of cities
your distate for ur own coworkers sure as hell shows here just wait til sept when the govt says yea or nea to the merger... and id say in 2 yrs or less phx will be a focus city may be.... with aa lax n dfw there is no need to keep phx a hub just a presence or focus city should do
may be you wil be one of the ones to lose ur job and see how u feel then

The government will not oppose the merger ... Doug parker has promised to save jobs ... jobs are now the number one priority politically for all parties in this country .

as to losing my job ....If your suggesting that i somehow think the sun will always shine down upon me , you know , i wish that were true ...

with my luck i will be outsourced/furloughed/laid off

 

[Harry Callahan]

The government will not oppose the merger ... Doug parker has promised to save jobs ... jobs are now the number one priority politically for all parties in this country .

as to losing my job ....If your suggesting that i somehow think the sun will always shine down upon me , you know , i wish that were true ...

with my luck i will be outsourced/furloughed/laid off

Freedom are you for real ? Because of Doug Parker the merger will not be opposed. Get real man.

And honestly I hope I'm wrong as I don't want to see one job lost, but imho PHX will have layoff's down the road & Freedom out.

Freedom thanks for bringing me out of retirement in this thread & giving me some much needed laughter.

 

[700UW]

Doug's promises are worthless, I think Freedom hasnt been wearing a hat and sunscreen in the PHX heat.

 

[robbedagain]

FREEDUM ARE YOU truly that insane? dougies promises are like a horse's sh!t and if you dont believe that then i got swamp land and swamp home for sale for 3.00 in the antartica SERIOUSLY DUDE YOU NEED HELP... THE FACT DP CANNOT NEGOGIATE DEALS WITH OUR OWN BUT CAN DO SO FOR ANTHR AIRLINE AND ANTHER UNION WHAT THE HELL DOES THAT TELL YOU.... TO ME IT TELLS ME NOTHG BUT PURE DISRESPECT secondly most of us have yrs with the airline and been thru more hell than you will ever know in your life time

 

[necigrad]

Actually, at least in the HP/US merger, which fleet employees were forced to be laid off? None. Every single employee was able to transfer if they desired, thus Parker can say that it didn't cost anyone their job. Granted, trying to sell a home with a mortage in LAS or SoCal in the late 2000's was kind of difficult, especially if it meant moving to the NE, but NO ONE was forced to give up the job.

I'm not saying I agree with this business model, but that fact is, any employee not working because of furlough made the choice to be furloughed.

 

[ChockJockey]

because i don't believe that the pension is sound .....

no point in throwing good money after bad ....

i'm fine with todays current levels of contributions , but i have no wish to , contract after contract divert more of our workers compensation package to a pension that will grow weaker and weaker , requiring ever higher amounts of money in order to stay solvent .

That's my point exactly. How can you call for solidarity when you're indifferent to job losses and obsessive over your take-home? Do you value solidarity because of how it benefits the membership or do you value solidarity because of how it benefits Freedom?

His screen name and quasi-libertarian opinions on economics and politics strongly suggest a taste for a kind of hands-off individualism that puts the needs and rights of the individual over all others. This is well and good, since we live in a country where people are allowed to think and believe as they wish. The problem is that is that the ethos of individualism (not to be confused with individuality) and that of unionism are wholly incompatible. The former insists that by seeking one's own self-interest above all others everyone (somehow) benefits while the latter insists that the individual subsume and sacrifice the prominence of his/her wants to the good of the whole. I think this is the crux of his irritating double-speak, that he wants the best of both worlds even though they can't be reconciled. The committed individualist has no need for unionism unless unionism can be used to further his own individual interests.

No, Freedom doesn't 'speak' for PHX in that anybody who shouts the most nonsense most loudly from any place speaks for it. I doubt PHX will see reductions to the degree that his position will be threatened (by virtue of his seniority). If buy-outs are offered and the geriatric crowd in PHX takes them then he probably has nothing to worry about. If buy-outs are not offered and they furlough from the bottom the worst he might have to face - if you can imagine it - is having to actually get in the bin.