APA, USAPA and the Ghost of TWA

[Piedmont1984]

Agree that the Nic will be used as a starting point by any arbitrator, and that there's going to be a dovetail at best. DOH ain't gonna happen.And no, to WT's "gotta know now" question, I wouldn't expect this to drag out as long as either US/HP and UA/CO.For starters, the numbers don't support the gamesmanship of creating a new union just because you don't like the arbitration results.Second, you won't see the process paralyzed by two MEC's within the same union refusing to come to an agreement.

If the Nic is used as a starting point, what need is there for a west only merger committee? On the contrary, the MOU states and even APA acknowledges the existence of two lists, east and west. If the Nic is not in effect between east and west then how do you start with the Nic going into arbitration? If the courts have not been able to implement the Nic then how do the arbitrators suddenly acquire such authority?

The best that the west pilots can hope for is a seat at the merger table in which they get the opportunity to argue for something which resembles the Nic. The conditions necessary to implement the original Nic Award were never met and never will be met.

However, if APA truly wants to venture into arbitration and install 3 merger committees at the table then they better hurry, USAPA has already filed for arbitration IOW the provisions of 59 CAB 45.

 

[luvthe9]

 
 
 
Sorry our crazy uncle "luvthe9" got out of his room again. 
 
The overwhelming majority of pilots are very happy about the merger., one of the most hated here on the east.

And Traiotor is one of us east guys it will throw his fellow employees under the bus, when you here the name Chip Munn and you will think Traitor, our two most hated and least respected on the property.

 

[luvthe9]

 
 
So your DOH 1989 FO goes ahead a lineholding  AA 1989 757 Captain?
 
Yes or No

No way, again conditions and restrictions should prevent that, but if you don't fight the NIC you will have around a 2009 going ahead of your 89 boy.

 

[luvthe9]

This letter was posted because of the APA filing................................This is the APA Filing.  Every pilot needs to spend some time reading this.  The APA will be in your future and they would love to take your past.  Every pilot here, senior pilot or new hire needs to understand what the APA has planned for all of us.  This and their update is an eye opener for all of us that thought the APA had learned their lessons after the TWA debacle.  I know the BPR understands that the fight is one that needs to be won.  I hope Gary Hummel understands that too.
 
Instead we see an APA that is greedy, a liar and will also take from us all we have worked for.  But we are not TWA and we have the resources and the experience needed to push back. 
 
The American pilots are being short sighted.  At some point if history is any indication, they will need everyone on their side as the old corporate culture begins to assert itself.  If they persist in trying to take our rights away, they will find no unity from the former US Airways pilots.  As far as I'm concerned, if they persist, I will never fight for them when they ask.
 
As for them joining forces with the west, they will screw the west faster than you can say that.  They are just using them for leveage.  Then they will turn on the west.
 
So, in closing let me get this right.  The Company is using the APA to divide the pilot group for all time.  The West is using the APA in the hopes they will get the NIC.  The APA is using the west to divide us and use the excuse we never merged the two sides as a reason for dumping the Protocol.  Everyone is using everyone else against us in an effort to circumnavigate the McCaskill-Bond statute along with the MOU provisions to gain critical leverage in our seniority integration.
 
You can see this is not going to be simple.  But we didn't start this fight.  We need to make sure we finish it.   You can do that by supporting your BPR.
 

 

[traderjake]

Instead we see an APA that is greedy, a liar and will also take from us all we have worked for. 

 
 
Says the guys who reneged on a mutually agreed upon arbitration process (the Nicolau Award) because they didn't like the result. 

 

[traderjake]

No way, again conditions and restrictions should prevent that, but if you don't fight the NIC you will have around a 2009 going ahead of your 89 boy.

 
Please stop begging APA to fight a battle you couldn't win, you're embarrassing all of us.

 

[MCI transplant]

Oh! This is going to be fun!!!-------- A three way free for all!

 

[fatherabraham]

Mci,

I predict way more complicated.
More than 3 groups to offend!

One particularly sick trio stars:

CM as Francis
Trader as Edward
Prechilill as Claire

Soon enuf you will know these characters...sorry in advance.

FA

 

[traderjake]

Soon enuf you will know these characters...sorry in advance.

 
By the sound of APA's last update reference USAPA they're already sorry.

 

[Claxon]

Agree that the Nic will be used as a starting point by any arbitrator, and that there's going to be a dovetail at best. DOH ain't gonna happen.And no, to WT's "gotta know now" question, I wouldn't expect this to drag out as long as either US/HP and UA/CO.For starters, the numbers don't support the gamesmanship of creating a new union just because you don't like the arbitration results.Second, you won't see the process paralyzed by two MEC's within the same union refusing to come to an agreement.

Read the 9th Court of Appeals San Francisco for starters. You know, the FEDERAL Court.
Of course if the APA wishes to, they can put a 1984 hire at the very TOP of their list and go from there. That is the Nicolau position.Their choice.
The APA better get smart with Parker or they are going to get an interesting ratio where 1984 hires from Airways are slotting in 777 and 787 positions.
And don't say it can't happen.
You think arbitrators are upset with Nicolau being stopped? They would love to slam a deal home for your TWA brothers.

 

[MCI transplant]

Mci,

I predict way more complicated.
More than 3 groups to offend!

One particularly sick trio stars:

CM as Francis
Trader as Edward
Prechilill as Claire

Soon enuf you will know these characters...sorry in advance.

FA

From someone who has been through it,------- Good Luck to all! And hope, and pray, that a curtain Arbitrator named Kasher, has retired! Or it might appear that it has gone well beyond Arbitration.

 

[Claxon]

By the sound of APA's last update reference USAPA they're already sorry.

We call this guy Traitor
The Benedict Arnold of US Airways

 

[Claxon]

Says the guys who reneged on a mutually agreed upon arbitration process (the Nicolau Award) because they didn't like the result.

Let the Nicolau fly APA! 1984 hires right at the top of your 777 list.

 

[Claxon]

"we want DOH with C and R"
 
c and r?
 
length of fence, widebody or everything?

You better spool up pal, you are honestly going to get hosed if you don't.

 

[luvthe9]

You better spool up pal, you are honestly going to get hosed if you don't.

You will soon learn our management loves to divide and conquer it has already started, we were hoping you would catch on to that. We really hoped this would go smooth but it looks like that ship sailed, good luck to all of us.