AMFA......read on

[WeAAsles]

Really? There was no amfa drive at the time. How many write ins did the twu get? How many write ins did the cwa, alpa, apa, afa or any other union get? That election was about getting rid of the IAM and make a change for the IBT. Why would they write in other choices and dilute the vote which would have been counterproductive? Diverting the interest was what happened here at AA when the IBT showed up and made a play for us. It diverted interest to three groups. We need to stay focused on one goal. Remove the twu and support amfa for the M&E. If not then we will have gained nothing.

You see now I can give you credit here for a point well made. Bet I surprised you? 😱

 

[AMFAinMIAMI]

This is not a knock but I was wondering what you guys were thinking when during the IAM vs IBT election at Usairways, AMFA only received 7 write in votes? That could have been the biggest opportunity AMFA had to throw out as you guys like to call it one of those "Industrial Unions" and you have to admit that 7 was an embarrassment.

As OldGuy just related the reality is that people will complain about what they currently have but when it comes to putting pen to paper to move to replace it they may not be as dissatisfied as you might think? If they really were don't you think they would put their money where their mouth is?

 

 
WeAAsles
 
What you don't understand is that AMFA unlike the large industrial unions does not have a Organizing staff.  the IAM mechanics would of had to of contacted AMFA National, got cards and then conducted the drive themselves just as we here at AA have done for many yrs. At the beginning of this drive here at AA we did contact IAM guys who wanted the IAM gone who pushed for the IBT and asked them to make proposal to the IAM members if AMFA could be an option.
 
AMFA Cards have been collected since Jan. there.

 

[WeAAsles]

 
WeAAsles
 
What you don't understand is that AMFA unlike the large industrial unions does not have a Organizing staff.  the IAM mechanics would of had to of contacted AMFA National, got cards and then conducted the drive themselves just as we here at AA have done for many yrs. At the beginning of this drive here at AA we did contact IAM guys who wanted the IAM gone who pushed for the IBT and asked them to make proposal to the IAM members if AMFA could be an option.
 
AMFA Cards have been collected since Jan. there.

Hey listen. I've given you guys a lot of crap and you took it. If this is at the end of the day what you really want I wish you of course all the best and great success. Seriously.

You're actually about the only AMFA guy on these forums I have any use for because you don't just try to drum up or tap into people's anger to try and sway them. I admire you for that.

The TWU is by far not perfect and has made a few mistakes since I signed up at AA but I don't buy into all the drama people portray that they're the worst thing since Adolph Hitler that others try to portray. I defend that because it's unfair and frankly disgusting to me that people on this forum constantly attempt to sell it.

Anyway AMFAMIA whatever happens either way just support your union when you think they can use it and want it from you whoever they are and you'll have my respect.

Peace.

 

[AMFAinMIAMI]

Hey listen. I've given you guys a lot of crap and you took it. If this is at the end of the day what you really want I wish you of course all the best and great success. Seriously.

You're actually about the only AMFA guy on these forums I have any use for because you don't just try to drum up or tap into people's anger to try and sway them. I admire you for that.

The TWU is by far not perfect and has made a few mistakes since I signed up at AA but I don't buy into all the drama people portray that they're the worst thing since Adolph Hitler that others try to portray. I defend that because it's unfair and frankly disgusting to me that people on this forum constantly attempt to sell it.

Anyway AMFAMIA whatever happens either way just support your union when you think they can use it and want it from you whoever they are and you'll have my respect.

Peace.

WeAAsles
 
I am glad that you finally realize this is what we want, and that to me the betterment of my class and craft is my goal.  You can support the TWU, I don't really care. It's not my place to sway you either way. But you are not within my class and craft and for us to make the union environment here at AA a stronger place for the mechanics first, which in turn could make it better for your class and craft, There is enough apathy within the rank and file, any further distraction makes my job harder. So can you Do ME and the other mechanics a BIG Favor. Stay out of Mechanics discussions when it comes to AMFA. 
 
I assume that there are enough problems within your class and craft that you can motivate and keep the union you support strong and working for YOU.

 

[700UW]

WeAAsles
 
I am glad that you finally realize this is what we want, and that to me the betterment of my class and craft is my goal.  You can support the TWU, I don't really care. It's not my place to sway you either way. But you are not within my class and craft and for us to make the union environment here at AA a stronger place for the mechanics first, which in turn could make it better for your class and craft, There is enough apathy within the rank and file, any further distraction makes my job harder. So can you Do ME and the other mechanics a BIG Favor. Stay out of Mechanics discussions when it comes to AMFA. 
 
I assume that there are enough problems within your class and craft that you can motivate and keep the union you support strong and working for YOU.

There you go again, you dont get the concept of the forums, they are a message board, learn how it works in life.
 
And typical elitist.
 
So how did AMFA work out at NW and AS being on their own?

 

[WeAAsles]

WeAAsles
 
I am glad that you finally realize this is what we want, and that to me the betterment of my class and craft is my goal.  You can support the TWU, I don't really care. It's not my place to sway you either way. But you are not within my class and craft and for us to make the union environment here at AA a stronger place for the mechanics first, which in turn could make it better for your class and craft, There is enough apathy within the rank and file, any further distraction makes my job harder. So can you Do ME and the other mechanics a BIG Favor. Stay out of Mechanics discussions when it comes to AMFA. 
 
I assume that there are enough problems within your class and craft that you can motivate and keep the union you support strong and working for YOU.

I would love to comply with your request but at the same time you need to request from those of your brothers who support your team to stay out of other threads where all they do is hijack the conversation and run it into a tangent on how bad the TWU sucks. I could get into a conversation about issues in the Middle East and they will still come on and segue it into "It must be the TWU who are providing guns to the rebels"

When they can learn their own measure of self control will be when I will stop jumping into conversations that should possibly not involve me.

And I also have to correct you on the comment "This is what WE want" Until those cards are submitted and the vote happens this is not a statement you can say is fact. The members as a whole will make that determination as it should be.

 

[AMFAinMIAMI]

I can tell you that I have asked my fellow mechanics here in Tulsa to sign cards.  I have encountered so much complacency that it amazes me.  On many occasions the person will admit they are not happy with how the TWU has represented them but they don't want to sign a card.  I have even gone so far as to ask these people who don't seem to care if they will sign a card so we can at least have a vote so the majority can decide how to move forward.  If we could get the people who don't care one way or the other to sign a card we could have a vote tomorrow.  Just can't figure these guys out.  Got any ideas about a different approach?

 
Oldguy
 
If you have done what you say and they still can't bring themselves to sign cards, they deserve what happens to their future.
 
Maybe its the past, the way some of my counterparts went about pushing the thought of AMFA, there in Tulsa. Many organizers have talked about looking for the right thing that will stir the emotion, drive, union spirit, at Tulsa so that we can move away from the TWU which we as Mechanics feel has failed our class and craft.
 
We have had the same discussions here on this forum over and over and at the Burger burns, T-shirt give-aways and every thing else we have tried.
 
In the end which is coming sooon because I can tell you, this Will be the last of the AMFA drives here at AA. If the TWU/IAM association becomes our representational entity, we will be the laughing stock of the industry. Known for bending over and taking all the crap the company has dished out and still waved the Pom-Poms.
 
Tulsa has had the roll call votes because its size, and the officers in place in the past.
Tulsa has had the best of what the company did give us and the Line guys resented that. Even to the point of wanting tulsa to close and put down the T-Town guys.
Those attacks I think have hurt our efforts, but we still have always come back and tried to give the Tulsa Mechanics every chance to join us to remove the TWU.
 
I don't have the answer because I can't relate to the guys there that idea has to come from the Mechanics there. You work and live in the same area, You know what each person feels is best for their families.
 
The 1 yr NMB bar ends this month, Do we have enough cards to file the answer to that is "NO" so will the Organizers go to AMFA National with the cards and have them present them to the NMB with the filing paperwork this month, again "NO".
 
We also need the USAir guys cards as well, since due to the last two filings the gate agents and the Flight attendants have been deemed one transportation group.
 
I believe that some info that we have as Organizers needs to be released to everyone.
Some of my counter parts don't. if we preach that AMFA is all about Honesty, Integrity, transparency, with out back door info and deals then we should set the example.
Put it all out there and then let the members decide which is best. I think every one should know where we are with the cards, so either they get in the fight to make it happen or it dies and then we the organizers can get our lives back since it's been
16 yrs here at AA for me this battle. For some even more.
 
AMFA at AA in 2014

 

[Kev3188]

I can tell you that I have asked my fellow mechanics here in Tulsa to sign cards.  I have encountered so much complacency that it amazes me.

Sounds like your shop exemplifies the nation as a whole.

Only when we (collectively) figure out how to change that mindset will labor get turned in the right direction.

 

[swamt]

When the committee has enough cards and after the one year lockout. The alliance vote if there is going to be one may move filing dates around. The organizers I am told are working with the USAir guys because they need to make sure if the SCS is in effect then USAir is included. On the long term side both sides are locked into a contract until 2017.
If you are inpatient then may I suggest you work on getting cards signed. This is a we effort not a them. We need to help ourselves in getting cards signed. Search out a AMFA organizer at your station and lend a hand. We only have ourselves to blame if we just sit back and do nothing but complain about the TWU and the Alliance.

Yes the organizers are working with the US guys.  They have meetings in PHX already set up.  If anyone from SWA could attend to answer any questions would be a good move.  Sometimes hearing from a mechanic who has been living it is better than just promoters of AMFA.  Just a suggestion.  Here's the meeting times:
 
Wed. Aug. 6 from 6am to 8pm in Phoenix.  Conference room in T4 near B21 and B23.   
Take the time to attend and ask all the questions you want.  Nothing will go unanswered.  Read the AMFA constitution, bring it to the meeting, and ask anything about it at the meeting.  I wish I could attend to help answer questions, hoping someone already with AMFA could take a little time and help answer some questions from the mechanics.   I was a big time fence sitter when AMFA was organizing here at SWA, attending these informational meetings helped me make my decision as we were all bombarded with lies after lies from the teamsters, as they would say anything to try and discredit AMFA.  Do your own homework and get the information on your own don't be lazy and expect to get spoon fed and regret it later on.  best move we ever made at SWA was firing the teamsters and bringing in AMFA hands down...

 

[AMFAinMIAMI]

There you go again, you dont get the concept of the forums, they are a message board, learn how it works in life.
 
And typical elitist.
 
So how did AMFA work out at NW and AS being on their own?

 
Again 700UW has to stick his nose in on every thread saying its a forum and elitist and more of his bs.
 
attempting to drift the conversation off to something else. He is on every thread and almost every sub thread here
on this forum. He tells us all how much he knows and shows us his fantastic google skills and says he knows this person or another.
 
He is NOT an airline employee anymore and is so ate up with the IAM. He has no life other than to be on this forum.
He misses being in the industry and has nothing better to do than to come here and talk about stuff he has no clue about any longer.
 
He has never been represented by AMFA or the TWU, Has never been a mechanic, Never has he worked at AA.
 
He has been told to go away by so many but still is here.
 
He will have no say in any vote if it happens and had not vote at USAir either.
 
Just a want to be living in the Past, trying to re-live his supposed glory days.
 
 
 
AMFA at AA in 2014

 

[AMFAinMIAMI]

I would love to comply with your request but at the same time you need to request from those of your brothers who support your team to stay out of other threads where all they do is hijack the conversation and run it into a tangent on how bad the TWU sucks. I could get into a conversation about issues in the Middle East and they will still come on and segue it into "It must be the TWU who are providing guns to the rebels"

When they can learn their own measure of self control will be when I will stop jumping into conversations that should possibly not involve me.

And I also have to correct you on the comment "This is what WE want" Until those cards are submitted and the vote happens this is not a statement you can say is fact. The members as a whole will make that determination as it should be.

WeAAsles
 
If you ask them not to comment on ramp/fleet type threads about the TWU I would assume they would since most mechanics dont at this point care about anything but what needs to happen for us.
 
I don't get into ramp issues, fleet or any other threads that are no concern to me. So lets call that even and you can chat up the TWU in threads that effect you and fair enough?

 

[700UW]

 
Again 700UW has to stick his nose in on every thread saying its a forum and elitist and more of his bs.
 
attempting to drift the conversation off to something else. He is on every thread and almost every sub thread here
on this forum. He tells us all how much he knows and shows us his fantastic google skills and says he knows this person or another.
 
He is NOT an airline employee anymore and is so ate up with the IAM. He has no life other than to be on this forum.
He misses being in the industry and has nothing better to do than to come here and talk about stuff he has no clue about any longer.
 
He has never been represented by AMFA or the TWU, Has never been a mechanic, Never has he worked at AA.
 
He has been told to go away by so many but still is here.
 
He will have no say in any vote if it happens and had not vote at USAir either.
 
Just a want to be living in the Past, trying to re-live his supposed glory days.
 
 
 
AMFA at AA in 2014

Please show me and the whole board where in the Terms of Service does it say only a mechanic an airline employee can post here?
 
Let me give you a little hint, it doesnt.
 
Yet on EVERY thread you try to eliminate anyone who doesnt agree with you from posting.
 
Let me tell you, you arent going to stop me or anyone else from posting here.
 
You dont own the boards, and you dont make the rules, if you dont like what someone has to post put them or ignore or just pass them by.
 
So you havent been represented by AMFA, so using your way of thinking, you shouldnt post either.
 
Get off elitist attitude and learn to debate the topic instead of making about a poster, how you post and what you post tells all about you.
 
We now return you to the regularly scheduled program.

 

[WeAAsles]

WeAAsles
 
If you ask them not to comment on ramp/fleet type threads about the TWU I would assume they would "since most mechanics don't at this point care about anything but what needs to happen for us."
 
I don't get into ramp issues, fleet or any other threads that are no concern to me. So lets call that even and you can chat up the TWU in threads that effect you and fair enough?

Nice mantra. Maybe we should make that the doctrine of all unions? I always expected that that comment was true but thank you for confirming it. 

 

[AMFAinMIAMI]

Nice mantra. Maybe we should make that the doctrine of all unions? I always expected that that comment was true but thank you for confirming it. 

WeAAsles
 
The pilots are on their own, so are the Flight attendants. Soon the simm tech's with the lastest filing, the gate agents, are as well. But when we the mechanics want that for us its a bad thing? WHY is that?
 
The electricians/Plummers/Painters/Longshoreman/etc.. all are on their own as well.
 
Why is it a big deal for mechanics at AA be be seperate?   If you are a union guy no matter which union is having strife with company each should support the other, correct? What union you have or what they get for you is not my concern. That is what I mean but you and 700UW want to spin it into something else.
 
The betterment of my class and craft is what I want for all mechanics in the airline industry, not jst here at AA.
 
It has nothing to do with education or anything else, its that we want to determine our own destiny. Good/Bad.

 

[La Li Lu Le Lo]

how you post and what you post tells all about you.

It sure does,
 
Why do you think I can't stand you?