AA and Labor Negotiations-2020

[dfw gen]

People should retire when they feel it's time. The very lengthy pay cut in 2003 cost members thousands upon thousands of dollars. Add to that the frozen pension which hurt and easy to see why people are trying to not retire so quickly. Then we have the last 5 or 6 years of bankruptcy deal where we lost more which makes you wonder how much we have actually lost in retirement from all this. These bad experiences have me in a not giving position for concessions. If they file chapter 11 so be it. Hopefully it can all be avoided, but it is harder to retire.

We are all painfully aware concessions are just taken for granted and pissed away. And the do their best to drag their feet to restore. Nope not interested in concessions.

 

[ALUS78]

It’s working smarter, not harder.

Maybe I just value time as a commodity.

Tell that to your mortgage company and utility companies.Kev I think you're a good man but if you feel that strongly go part time or trade off a couple of days a week. I think it's going to be years for the airlines to get back to where they are today

 

[dfw gen]

Has anybody not learned their lesson after 9/11?
I have to admit 9/11 caught me with my pants down, it took me 5 years but i worked my way back. The next five after that was putting two kids tgru college. The last 9 years was preparing for the next 9/11 or this mess. Im too young at 57 to retire but i can make it work if i have to with a part time job for the benefits..

 

[1AA]

Has anybody not learned their lesson after 9/11?
I have to admit 9/11 caught me with my pants down, it took me 5 years but i worked my way back. The next five after that was putting two kids tgru college. The last 9 years was preparing for the next 9/11 or this mess. Im too young at 57 to retire but i can make it work if i have to with a part time job for the benefits..

Sounds like a text book story. I can relate in similar ways. I'm sure others can too.

 

[dfw gen]

Sounds like a text book story. I can relate in similar ways. I'm sure others can too.

It just blows my mind how many people are living way beyond their means. We as mechanics make a good living and have been for a while. Benefits are the only thing holding me back, if they offer an early out when the sh*t hits the fan ill be looking very close at the numbers. The wife had to talk me out of it a month ago

 

[CremaDiLimone]

People should retire when they feel it's time. The very lengthy pay cut in 2003 cost members thousands upon thousands of dollars. Add to that the frozen pension which hurt and easy to see why people are trying to not retire so quickly. Then we have the last 5 or 6 years of bankruptcy deal where we lost more which makes you wonder how much we have actually lost in retirement from all this. These bad experiences have me in a not giving position for concessions. If they file chapter 11 so be it. Hopefully it can all be avoided, but it is harder to retire.

no argument at all. i said everyone has the right to decide.

some of the people involved have long told anyone who would listen that they have more money than you.

they are sticking around because they can hide. i'm guessing it's either greed or it's psychological. i do believe some are afraid they will die if they retire.

my opinion is that the angriest are this way because lus mngt. has shrunk the pool of desirable once-upon- a-time LAA jobs and some of these guys also have shoulder and back probs. their argument is if lus mngt wants the new aa to be leaner and more 'efficient', then cut the fat of those who really shouldn't be here anymore. send them for a physical test.

the assoc./iam saved the catering jobs in 2 iam hubs. there are no more cabin and related or bus driving jobs, jobs that are mail-specific anymore for laa.

 

[CremaDiLimone]

The airline Biz is a back stabbing industry

agreed.

The industry itself is not family friendly so working Holidays, Nights, missing so much that other industries workers don't have to deal with makes for a tough life. As the younger guys come along they see the older guys slowing down and they want them to leave because they want the better days off, shift, work area.

agreed. this is the way my seniority was brought up.

the negative now is that many older workers can't retire comfortably with pension/social security/savings in 2020, as they did in 1988.

this is a hard reality my generation has to accept. those good shifts aren't trickling down anymore. the senior citizens won't give them up or the company has eliminated them.

UnLike most other service industries many go through different family problems, divorce, having to commute due to the layoffs/cutbacks.

i'd say one of the biggest reasons the seniors stick around is health insurance for an unemployed spouse who is not old enough for medicare. worker is 66 and wife is 59 and not working. if his wife has health issues, he's not going anywhere for awhile.

If you listen to the guys who have been around along time they all say it was a better workplace back in the day. Union members stuck together, NO MATTER WHAT, those days are over the IGM attitude of the younger generation and I want it all now is in place.

you seem sincere and there have been and still are lots of good union people. i've seen some who basically became personal attorneys for their scammer friends, who had no business working for aa. union brothers and sisters getting screwed over and the union looking the other way, due to personal friendships. i've also seen the union not lift a finger to stop the growing status of PT workers - who incidentally, were only weekend warriors, a long time ago - as you say, in better union days.

maybe the AMTs can rally together, no way i see that with fleet.

 

[swamt]

Hey, everyone has a right to think whatever the hell they want, but....

No one has a right to tell another guy to retire. If that guy wants to stay there till he's 90+ that's his prerogative and younger guys should try to help him instead of trying to stick it up his arse and complain about him pulling down premium shift and days off..

F yall that do that ****...

Quit freaking whining....

One of these days, one of you might find yourself in the exact same position,,, with some guy fresh on the block ,, giving you shite cuz your still there.... F That!!

Take the high road,,,, not the low one....

I would not ask nor complain if anyone does or doesn't retire. Your right, everyone can do as they please. Hell, AA's has the Lead AMT still there probably now hiting 90 years old. As far as someone bitching because a senior man is holding a better position, days off or shift is just childish. It's all about seniority in this business, EARNED seniority, he shall use it as he pleases. One of my points about folks not retire to enjoy retirement, I just hate seeing them fall apart health wise shortly after retire and not get the chance to really enjoy it.
One guy that recently retired at 70, once he did it, lived it and saw how well he could get by, always said he wished he done it earlier at 60-65. 1 yr. later, brain tumors took him away rather quickly. So sad, and that's what I hate seeing. My mono is retire as soon as you possibly can and enjoy the heck out of it. But I do understand why some folks must stay and continue working and will always respect that.
So I apologize to anyone I may have offended with my statements...

 

[SkydrolJunkie]

Not to worry guys. The TWU's got your back.

You just need "To Lower Your Expectations" a little.

 

[swamt]

It just blows my mind how many people are living way beyond their means. We as mechanics make a good living and have been for a while. Benefits are the only thing holding me back, if they offer an early out when the sh*t hits the fan ill be looking very close at the numbers. The wife had to talk me out of it a month ago

You do what will make YOU happy. I know we all include our wives when making huge decisions, but if ya know you can make it by getting a much more less stressful P/T job to help carry you with an early out program offered, I would consider it too. If AA goes into BK again, pretty sure we all know it'll be a minimum 10-15 years of dragging out a BK contract once again. So I would agree with ya, take the package and run, run fast to another less stress job and something you really like to do.
dfw; Good luck with any decision you make and may God Bless...

 

[Kev3188]

Tell that to your mortgage company and utility companies.Kev I think you're a good man but if you feel that strongly go part time or trade off a couple of days a week. I think it's going to be years for the airlines to get back to where they are today

I did. The difference was that I was voluntold to, instead of being able to pick it on a bid sheet.

No one's arguing that it is a cut in income; what it is now is a choice between time/money. If I'm taking a 25% cut in base pay, then I want 25% of my time back.

 

[Tim Nelson]

I did. The difference was that I was voluntold to, instead of being able to pick it on a bid sheet.

No one's arguing that it is a cut in income; what it is now is a choice between time/money. If I'm taking a 25% cut in base pay, then I want 25% of my time back.

25% cut in hours > 25% cut in pay.
No Concessions, but if a union presses and secures concessions then getting paid 32 hours at current pay is much better than working 40 hours at 25% reduced pay.

 

[dfw gen]

25% cut in hours > 25% cut in pay.
No Concessions, but if a union presses and secures concessions then getting paid 32 hours at current pay is much better than working 40 hours at 25% reduced pay.

Getting nervous?

 

[Buck]

Coming in late: Under the merger agreement? the payroll agreement that all get paid bi-weekly? except for New Jersey state law? Someone help me here.

 

[ALUS78]

25% cut in hours > 25% cut in pay.
No Concessions, but if a union presses and secures concessions then getting paid 32 hours at current pay is much better than working 40 hours at 25% reduced pay.

How about laying off those that are not needed,and if absolutely needed giving those that are left a way smaller cut???