Virgin appearently wins gates at DAL

[robbedagain]

on the other hand we all are still waiting for DL to file the "legal challenge" regarding DCA and LGA   now I suppose youll say they'll file one bec they could not get the 2 slots at DAL   
 
swamt  although im not surprised by VA entrance into DAL  Im rather surprised no other airline (lcc) filed other than WN and DL   I would of thought may be Allegiant or even Spirit would have but so far neither one has done so
 
as for prices  I would imagine WN will probably begin at or may be below what VX is offering

 

[700UW]

Yep, where is the legal challenge?
 
DCA?
LGA?
DAL?
 
And he is making things up the City of Dallas hasnt issued one word about the DAL gates and he is speculating once again, making things up in his mind while at the DL Bunker with the lawyers for the "legal challenge".

 

[WorldTraveler]

and you two can't comprehend/grasp/understand that the issue is not resolved yet. There wouldn't be a legal challenge until Everything is exhausted... and even then I never said it was guaranteed to happen.

There is a reason why DL's DAL schedule is still for sale.

What the two of you and swamt absolutely cannot stand is that once again I called this one right from the beginning while you all jumped on the bandwagon of DL would lose and continue to beat that drum despite the overwhelming evidence being that AA is the loser in all of this.

They shed gates and slots; not DL. AA had the right to use DAL but gave it up as part of the merger.

DL has the legal right to force its way in to DAL if it isn't accommodated. DAL knows it and is trying to mediate a solution and prevent a full-scale meltdown. WN execs are smart enough to realize that if they don't cooperate, not only will have they still have DL in their backyard but WN could lose a whole lot more.

 

[700UW]

You have been beating the drum of a legal challenge for months, it has been months since the DCA and LGA slots were sold and still no legal challenge.
 
Typical DL WT BS once again.
 
And so where are the statement from the City of Dallas of how you said why the lease transfer wasnt approved yet?
 
No source, no facts, no press release.
 
You havent been right right, DL got no slots at DCA nor at LGA and is shut out of DAL, three strikes your out!

 

[WorldTraveler]

in your complete impatience and desire to try to prove me wrong, you can't comprehend that the process isn't finished.

And DL has not been shut out of DAL.

It is only because DL has so handedly overcome one strategic challenge after another - to my great accolades - that you can't help but hope for a defeat even though you are the one that shows you are driven completely by emotions and a complete lack of understanding of the business aspects of what is involved in this case.

DAL is governed by federal laws and the entire legal rework of the WA in 2006; the DOJ can't just come in and decide to throw them all out. DAL has to figure out how to make it all work but none of it provides for a complete shutout of DL or any other airline from the market or for WN or VX to really have the duopoly that you and swamt think they will have based on having 18 of the gates with a greatly weakened UA holding onto two others.

It simply doesn't work the way you want it to and for you to try to turn it into yet another personal grudge match shows precisely why you are such a poor representative for the IAM which you claim to be advocating for. You repeatedly stick your nose into subjects you know nothing about, including this whole DAL topic, and then wonder why you are repeatedly called on the carpet for throwing gasoline on a fire which you set.

DL will be at DAL and they will be accommodated. That is the law and it is what is happening and I have said all along would happen as much as you or swamt or robbed want to believe otherwise.

 

[700UW]

Nice deflection, where is the legal challenge you said would happen?

It's been months.

And where is the press release from the city of DAL?

 

[WorldTraveler]

It is no wonder US had no trouble rolling over the IAM.

No surprise at all.

You truly have no idea how much you are DL mgmt.'s best friend in convincing DL employees that unions are a really bad idea.

Either you are incredibly dense, argumentative, or cannot read. You choose which of the three - or all of the above applies but you could not have posted what you just posted if at least one of the three did not apply

 

[700UW]

And once again you pollute a thread with things that have no baring on the topic.

This is about the gates at DAL, not a union drive.

 

[WorldTraveler]

then you should be able to grasp that I have said multiple times that the process is not resolved and there wouldn't be any lawsuit until it is.

The fact that you immediately came back with asking where the lawsuit is invites exactly the ridicule that you try to avoid.

I don't really think you are stupid. I do think you are completely unable to recognize that someone else might be right, admit you are wrong, and move on to something else.

You continue to try to dig up old wounds in hopes of inflicting a little bit more damage but you are the one that looks damaged in the process.

For the 66 millionth time, if a lawsuit occurs, it will ONLY be if all other efforts to resolve DAL access have been unresolved.

Since E agrees with me that DL will be there, the question is not how many flights but how far DL is willing to push it now in order to ensure that it has a place at DAL down the road. It can only play this card once. I'm betting they will push as far as they want right now. WN can figure out how to live within the framework that they sought for 30 years as well as the payback that DL is potentially seeking for WN's privileged position in the DCA/LGA bidding exercise.

Virgin did everything DL needed in order to ensure DL has a big operation at DAL.

 

[robbedagain]

60 day rule has passed  so yes we both GRASP it   YOU clearly DO NOT!   Simple fact is DL has been knocked down   they may not be out yet  but its getting close!  learn to grasp that   DAL will most likely approve VX and the 2 Slots

 

[WorldTraveler]

no you do not. There is no 60 day rule in the federal airport access rules and there is no 60 day rule in the lease that WN signed with DAL.

I'm not questioning whether DAL will approve the lease with VX.

My statement is and will remain that DAL MUST accommodate new entrant airlines and that if DL's schedule is not accommodated, DL becomes a new entrant airline which must be accommodated within UA, Virgin, and WN's existing schedule - which means that DL aircraft could very well end up parked at the 16 gates that swamt has said that WN will never share with anyone.

Problem for him is that he doesn't know what the 2006 agreement between DAL/DFW/etc etc says and which specifically says that DAL will force existing airline tenants to accommodate new entrants if they don't volunteer to do so.



thanks to the DOJ, and because the DAL lease agreement doesn't specifically say how many flights constitute a new entrant, VX just set that threshold as about 20 flights/day.


DL will have a large operation at DAL thanks to the DOJ who stuck their nose into something they didn't understand.

WN's operation will shrink every time a new airline decides to show up at DAL.

 

[700UW]

DL isnt a NEW Entrant.

 

[robbedagain]

you are flat out wrong and you cant or will never admit it WT    VX got the 2 slots at DAL  PLAIN N SIMPLE    Secondly  Even if DL serves DL it will not be on the 20 plus or minus  due to the constraints.    Third  DL is not a new entrant nor a low cost carrier.   And fourth  yes the 60 day rule has passed for DL to file legal challenges for LGA and DCA    you were wrong on that  and I have a good feeling youre gonna be wrong on this one   Sounds like you lost the bet to me

 

[WorldTraveler]

By the definitions of the federal airport access laws, if DL is not accommodated at DAL and they choose to enter the market, they absolutely are a new entrant at the airport.

A new entrant to an airport is one that doesn't serve that airport at the time. Virgin is no more of a new entrant to the US market or the DFW metroplex than DL is right now. The DOJ simply made its own rules but which do not eliminate the rules that already exist for how DAL has to be run, including both the 2006 agreement that allowed longhaul domestic flights to be added from DAL in the first place - and which WN signed - and federal airport access laws - which DAL recognized when it created the agreement which all five of the parties signed.

You two indict yourselves by the fact that keep trying so hard to prove me wrong when you are so hopelessly clueless about what the laws are that actually govern the process.

The DOJ could offer preferential access to two gates at DAL but it cannot and did not eliminate the right that other airlines including DL have to serve the airport.

Remember that the DOJ touted before the trial that never happened that it didn't have time to prepare because of the federal shutdown. this situation is proof positive they were right and they will end up doing more harm to WN than WN ever could have received at DCA and LGA. DL, which was shut out of the DCA/LGA process, is only to happen to take advantage of the DOJ's incompetence at WN's expense.

DL will be at DAL; the DOJ just set the bar for how much service a new entrant can add by allowing a new entrant to take 10% of the gates at an airport; and WN and VX absolutely will have to accommodate other airlines who choose to expand at DAL.

Further, WN is now faced with making DAL a success and being subjected to a wave of new airlines that will want to start service there.

Those are facts and you two can't seem to grasp that the very reason that DL's schedules are still there is because DL is absolutely in the legal right to insist that it be given access to DAL regardless of what the DOJ did.

 

[700UW]