US Pilots Labor Discussion 3/11- STAY ON TOPIC AND OBSERVE THE RULES

[BoeingBoy]

These are just my opinions. But I will say binding arbitrations became something of a "fad" back in the middle to later 70's.

Just think of the mess that would be created if every minor contract grievance had to go before a judge. Or dropped by the union, leaving the company free to interpret the contract as it saw fit.

As for wiggle room, there's always time for that before an issue goes to arbitration. The parties are free to negotiate a settlement if one can be reached.

Jim

 

[Be Careful What You Wish For.]

As for wiggle room, there's always time for that before an issue goes to arbitration. The parties are free to negotiate a settlement if one can be reached.

As NW/DL clearly shows how to do it vs. East screws West.
Do you guys sleep at night?
Yeah, you probably do.

 

[BoeingBoy]

AS NW/DL clearly shows how to do it vs. East screws West.

I was thinking about the normal contract grievances, but that example works too.

Jim

 

[Be Careful What You Wish For.]

Does pay accrue with LOS or DOH?

If you're off property do you come in at the same rate as someone who was continuously employed with a similar DOH?

 

[ableoneable]

BS!!!...and the standard west tap dancing. Do you now DENY that many of yours were, in actual fact, in grade school when others out east began their professional flying careers?....others that the nic would magically make "junior" to said "kids"? Again...just more west BS...

Tough luck if you don't like the "characterizations"/FACTS!!

Sigh, you're still trumpeting the same tired B.S. It matters not that some west pilots were in school while easties were flying.

What matters is that west pilots were flying as 757/320/737 lineholding captains while east pilots were furloughed. You and your brethren attempted to make these furloughees senior to west captains. You attempted, and in fact continue to attempt, to steal the jobs of west pilots.

You try to justify this blatant theft by trumpeting the fact that, on the fringes of the seniority list, there exits examples of pilots who are a generation apart.

This does not mitigate the fact that you are still guilty of attempted theft. You merely attempt to justify it by stating that age differences mitigate your crime.

 

[flybynite]

Just think of the mess that would be created if every minor contract grievance had to go before a judge. Or dropped by the union, leaving the company free to interpret the contract as it saw fit.

As for wiggle room, there's always time for that before an issue goes to arbitration. The parties are free to negotiate a settlement if one can be reached.

Jim

Jim,

I dealt with this long before this became an issue. Many times. It never goes there. The minor stuff always gets resolved. Mostly in the office.

The big stuff....went into a grievance process. And there was an appeal process too if all didn't go well. But be that as it may....all parties felt as though they had been dealt with fairly.

And as with any grievance that's being dropped by the Union, yes it can and more than likely be left up to the company's interpretation. But, what's that got to do to with what I'm talking about?

All I'm saying is that arbitration as part of our contracts is not a good thing because you as a union member do not have the same rights as a regular citizen. You don't have the right of an appeal.

Which for me, is just wrong. I, personally, do not think binding arbitrations right off the bat should be in our contracts at all.

You could have mediations and or unbinding arbitrations...there are are a number of things you can do. But nothing binding unless there's a judicial process. Yes, it's slow and costly but there's loads of wiggle room before it gets that far.

Just my opinion.

 

[BoeingBoy]

Does pay accrue with LOS or DOH?

As far as the steps on the pay scale for specific airplane/seat, yes it does but that is eclipsed by the pay difference of moving to bigger equipment or from right to left seat.

If you're off property do you come in at the same rate as someone who was continuously employed with a similar DOH?

Only if the two are then in the same plane/seat.

Jim

 

[Be Careful What You Wish For.]

All I'm saying is that arbitration as part of our contracts is not a good thing because you as a union member do not have the same rights as a regular citizen. You don't have the right of an appeal.

Then don't agree to it.

To agree and renege has led to this - live up to you're agreements.

That would show integrity.

Integrity has nothing to do with this and money has everything to do with it.

The high brow and verbose arguments are laughable and irrelevant.

Admit it.

 

[flybynite]

Then don't agree to it.

I never have.

 

[Be Careful What You Wish For.]

I never have.

Maybe you haven't but they did.

 

[Metroyet]

I never have.

Did you ever specifically agree to be in your current tax bracket? I didn't. Guess what?

Stop paying your taxes and you'll get a lesson who really owns your house. Try your argument on the Feds and see how far you get.

 

[Be Careful What You Wish For.]

As far as the steps on the pay scale for specific airplane/seat, yes it does but that is eclipsed by the pay difference of moving to bigger equipment or from right to left seat.



Only if the two are then in the same plane/seat.

Jim

Thanks

 

[EastUS]

Do you guys sleep at night?

It's not always easy. :blink: ..Sometimes I wake up screaming in sweat-soaked sheets. ....Why; Just last night again....the Ghost of Christmas West arrived at the appointed hour with it's mournful wailings of "You can live on LOA93 FOREeeeeevvvvver!!". As if that wasn't bad enough..along came the dark vision of Tiny Timwest, who really wanted nothing more than loving care, and a few aged old east shoulders to climb atop and ride happily ever after as their newest "captain"..meanwhile cheerfully blessing all around with "I hate all of you'se!!" Somewhere around the 3rd hour came the Ghost of Jumpseat Denial..and things just deteriorated from there.

This morning...I hired a well-reviewed exorcist...so I'm hoping for more "peace" for my troubled soul tonight .

 

[HPDriver]

I have worked here the whole time under some very difficult times.

You haven't worked at this airline for 22 years.

Your time at AAA was taken into account just as mine was at AWA. Our relative seniority was combined into one list. My new relative seniority moved me back a little, but it's pretty close.

Your airline is gone. It was merged.

Time to stop living in the past.

 

[nic4us]

"Your question is not "simple". = That's pure BS, just total and unmitigated BS. The only concern within which said qustion can be spun as other than simple is that of easilly exposing the flagrant selfishness and opportunism of those that would seek to make such an inquiry into something somehow magically mysterious and complex."



I couldn't help but notice...

Now that was funny, and made me laugh