Us Airways Union Struggle Nears

[PITbull]

PitBull,
are you living under a rock? UA has stated its intentions to eliminate UA's employees hard-earned pensions and US will undoubtedly do the same. Just because you haven't been hit when you're standing in the middle of the interstate doesn't mean you're safe.

[post="178109"][/post]​

Obviously, I'm not living under your rock.

UA and U can have all the intentions in the world to eiliminate everything under the sun and take from the employees; doesn't mean they will get it.

UA management has been in BK for 2 years, they have not moved to abrogate agreements nor have they terminated their pensions. In fact, the United BK judge has told UA managment in no uncertain terms, "either make peace with labor or else". I'm sure you read that article 3 weeks ago.

Also, United is having some difficulties and obstables in there attempt to terminate labor's defined pensions.

 

[cavalier]

Obviously, I'm not living under your rock.

UA and U can have all the intentions in the world to eiliminate everything under the sun and take from the employees; doesn't mean they will get it.

UA management has been in BK for 2 years, they have not moved to abrogate agreements nor have they terminated their pensions. In fact, the United BK judge has told UA managment in no uncertain terms, "either make peace with labor or else". I'm sure you read that article 3 weeks ago.

Also, United is having some difficulties and obstables in there attempt to terminate labor's defined pensions.

[post="178174"][/post]​

Yea, everything is safe and sound in bankruptcy and all the uproar is for not. These silly posters you must constantly correct and set them straight since few humans have your great wisdom....NOT.

Remember when you ran away and I got on my knees and begged you not to leave because I'd go berzerk?
Well, you left me anyhow and the days got worse and worse and now you see I've gone completely out of my mind.

And They're coming to take me away Ha Ha
They're coming to take me away ho ho he he ha ha
to the funny farm where life is beautiful all the time, and I'll be happy to see those nice young men in their fleece white coats
and they're coming to take me away ha ha

You thought it was joke and so you laughed, you laughed when I had said that losing you would make me flip my lid, right? You know you laughed, I heard you laugh, you laughed, you laughed and laughed and then you left, but now you know I'm utterly mad.

And they're coming to take me away Ha Ha
They're coming to take me away ho ho he he ha ha
To the happy home with trees and flowers and chirping birds and basket weavers who sit and smile and twiddle their thumbs and toes
They're coming to take me away ha ha...

I cooked your food, I cleaned your house, and this is how you paid me back for all my kind unselfish loving deeds. Huh? Well you just wait they'll find you yet, and when they do they'll put you in the ASPCA you mangy mutt.

And They're coming to take me away Ha Ha
They're coming to take me away ho ho he he ha ha
To the funny farm where life is beautiful all the time and I'll be happy to see those nice men in their fleece white coats
They're coming to take me away Ha Ha

 

[USA320Pilot]

BoeingBoy:

BoeingBoy said: "Funny, the 60 days is tied to getting concessions from the other employee groups, not returning airplanes to the leasors or parking them. Could USA320Pilot be confused?"

USA320Pilot comments: The company has removed the S.1113 protection letter from the most recent agreement. Today I asked NC chairman Doug Mowrey if the 60-day protection was placed into previous proposal's because it coincided with the 60-day bankruptcy code requirement on the maximum time limit to release aircraft EETCs, leases, or financing agreements, and both he and ALPA's legal counsel they said yes.

ALPA's advisor's told the MEC that if they had struck a deal two months ago an agreement could have been obtained that was 80 to 85 percent of the ask. They also said that every day ALPA waited to get a deal the ask would be more and the proposals would be worse. Guess what? They were right. Now the "just say no" RC4 group has the worst company proposal yet with no S.1113 protection, no minimum fleet count, EMB190s/CRJ-900s on the way to MDA/PSA, no fragmentation language, and no DC Plan. Mwereplanes heroes have done a "banG up" job letting 50 years of collective bargaining about to be carved up due to the RC4 using 27 roll call votes in 6.5 months and ignoring ALPA's legal and financial advisors.

Guess what? That's going to be the imposed deal in bankruptcy.

With that said, I believe the company will be better positioned for success due to the RC4 because the pilot and other labor union cuts will be deeper by not having consensual agreements before bankruptcy. Now they will likely either be imposed or more draconian, all due to the RC4 and their ineptness.

By the way, the RC4 are about to become irrelevant and without their DC Plan, regardless of Mwereplanes comments.

Respectfully,

USA320Pilot

 

[700UW]

Lets see you are not a union rep, nor ever negotiated a collective bargaining agreement, nor are you a bankrutpcy judge or attorney.

You have no idea just like the rest of the employees what will happen.

 

[USA320Pilot]

I attended a confidential briefing today as a union rep and I know exactly what will happen.

USA320Pilot

 

[700UW]

Lets see the confidential briefing was not with Lakefield or the BOD, you do not have any idea of what will happen, you keep forgetting you are not the CEO, SR VP, VP, Director or Manager, you are a regular line pilot, a regular employee.

I seriously doubt Lakefield told you what the company is going to do.

Delusions of Granduer.

 

[USA320Pilot]

Today a board member told the MEC in closed session what is going to happen.

Many people and their union's could become irrelevant, but that is their choice.

Respectfully,

USA320pilot

 

[700UW]

A board member cannot by law tell the MEC what the company is going to do.

SEC regulations prevent that.

Keep trying though.

 

[to much time to quit]

I attended a confidential briefing today as a union rep and I know exactly what will happen.

USA320Pilot

[post="178324"][/post]​

You seem to be in great shape according to this:

By the way, I'm fine with a failure with wife;s recent offer for nearly six figure income, if necessary. In addition, my USAF retirement, my PBGC award, my DC Plan, 401(k), IRA's, and both my wife and I having full social security benefits that in total are more than you currently make, we will be fine in retirement, which I am fortunate to have.

Since we have no debt and no martgages, we can survive the bump.

Thanks for your concern, but after listening to Lakefield for four hours yesterday in both "open" and closed" session, I believe you have much, much more to worry about than me.

Regards,

USA320Pilot

So why do you waste your time trying to convince everyone to keep bailing water outa the hull?? I would bet you have an honesty problem. :down:

 

[USA320Pilot]

I care about US Airways and I want to see the company prosper. Today I am more encouraged the company will survive and prosper than any time during the past two months. Why? It's unfortunate, but I believe the labor cuts will be even deeper, which is necessary due to the rising fuel prices and management has a plan to make the company work.

It's too bad that labor elected to not willingly participate in the new business plan, but that was their choice.

I'm going to bed now. There is really no need to debate any more.

Respectfully,

USA320Pilot

 

[Dog Wonder]

A320 Pilot,

If there, could there, would there, be a time when you have an epiphany.

In the eyes of US Airways all of us (if we worked here) are irrelevant

 

[700UW]

Will you change your name to A320FO, E170pilot, CRJpilot or ERJpilot as you will become irrelavent as your grour will have the "painful" clause inflicted upon it?

 

[BoeingBoy]

USA320Pilot,

"USA320Pilot comments: The company has removed the S.1113 protection letter from the most recent agreement. Today I asked NC chairman Doug Mowrey if the 60-day protection was placed into previous proposal's because it coincided with the 60-day bankruptcy code requirement on the maximum time limit to release aircraft EETCs, leases, or financing agreements, and both he and ALPA's legal counsel they said yes."

Perhaps you should read the 1113 letter in previous proposals (and I do see that it is missing in the latest proposal - makes sense since there's no way to have an agreement in place before the filing). The original 60 day limit and later Nov 12 limit specifically referenced section 2 and 6 of the letter, and those sections specifically address concessions from the other work groups and implementation of the ALPA TP agreement.

There was no specific date in any of the company 1113 letter offers that addressed a reduction in the fleet. However, there was the "at any time" if there is a "material" reduction in mainline flying.

As I've said before, what you termed "protection" in the form of an 1113 letter was not worth the paper it was written on. The company could have started the abrogation process at any time, whether we had an agreement or not, simply by parking a few airplanes. They didn't even need to change the leases, financing, etc.

Jim

Jim

 

[USA320Pilot]

BoeingBoy:

I'm not disputing you. What I said was the bankruptcy code gives the debtor 60 days to reject an agreement and I was talking about aircraft leases, EETCs, and financing agreements. It can apply to other agreements too.

What will determine the minimum fleet count is not US Airways, it's the creditor's.

Regards,

USA320Pilot

 

[700UW]

During the last bankruptcy Section 1110 which covers lease abrogations went way beyond 60 days.

If you look up the motions on the court web site you will see 1110 motions that went on even after US emerged bankruptcy.

I believe this was done by mutual agreement with court approval.