US Airways Has AA Labor Backing for AMR Takeover: Sources

[usa1]

eolsen is it possible that CLT could remain a large large station still keep mia as hub but then what happens to dca and phl i kind of think that by keeping clt as a hub to compete head to head with ATL

PHL and PHX will probably be hit the hardest US-side. MIA could be hit (some) AA-side.

 

[wings396]

I don't see CLT going away due to MIA.
It has been no secret that DL had interest in the MIA operations, and I doubt that ATL would take any hits due to it. I can see some CLT flying shifted to MIA, but new flying can be added to CLT to other markets.

 

[Kellerguy]

The layoffs may be long completed before this happens, so question is will they recall or not.

 

[robbedagain]

why would phl behard hit given if its done correctly they could use that to supplement the AA JFK hub something like how UA/CO did with EWR/IAD Im not sure PHX would be hard hit but please elaborate

 

[kirkpatrick]

The IAM is a fair union and they will never put AA at the bottom of the list but would slot you in by senority as it should be.

Take a look at how they helped the TWA flight attendants with the AA/TWA acquisition.

MK

 

[Jacobin777]

Of course it will, and same for everyone else. More cuts are coming if we link up with this fool. No way we keep even what AA is offering because US will have to be brought up into the fold, especially if there will be any unity and harmony. And we all know Doug Parker's track record on that. He would rather have the animosity because they equal cost savings. We've had enough of that on our end, and our end is pretty mild compared to east vs. west. No thanks!

+1. Parker is a shrewd man. He'll sell everyone down to Hades if he has to.

True, on one hand.

On the other, Labor can turn AA into another Eastern Airlines and then go to work elsewhere.
Creditors and Judges can mandate all they want. But if Employees still refuse to be decent workers/partners/employees under the mandated terms, it all becomes meaningless.

Everything is not really controlled in the legal system unless Labor allows it to be.

Labor alone can make even more than a deal happen if and when it decides to do so.

What's "decent" in this day and age? Having a job is better than not having a job.

AMR's plan right now is to obtain a very large cost advantage over the competition.
Parading the promise of Profit Sharing Checks as a great alternative to guaranteed pay.
The prevailing management thinking is that this allows the strong to eliminate the competition.

However, between Bankruptcy Laws and Corporate Welfare from City, State, Federal Governments, everyone survives and the race to the bottom continues. The only losers are the middle class workers of Airline Industry. The competition will simply either get voluntary concession match from their employees, or execute the Laws that will allow them to take them anyway,

And each night, we hear current Presidential Candidates promising jobs and a better future. Yet, the Lawmakers are the masters of the plan that is the destruction of a once proud and well paid job provider.

It is a Merry-Go-Round of fantasy entriched idiots using their minds to destroy humanity.

What's even worse, is those that actually defend this as good.

Parker will make the situation for you guys no better...if anything, it will be worse.

I'm not against a merger, but I think it should happen after AA is out of BK and on AA's terms - not Parker's terms.

Stand alone....Pretty simple concept, isn't it?

How about yours? A bailout? The only bailout you will get from Parker is a can and an expectation for you to do the bailing.

+1. Who's to say he won't file for BK in a few years after a potential merger? I don't see where the cost savings will come from otherwise. Revenues IMHO will not be able to stay in line with increased costs.

Stand alone, giving concessions to a Management Team that has been given concessions time and time again and yet we are still here and now in C11.

Great idea!
Far from original, but great idea.

I do fault AA for not filing for BK in 2003, but what's done is done.

There is plenty of evidence showing AA's cost structure is out of line with its peers. Merging with LCC isn't going to change that one bit at all.

The toxic issue is really and East Pilot issues and it goes away with any merger.

Really? How? Any proof on that?

Not sure how accurate these numbers are (I'm sure FWAAA can verify), but this was posted elsewhere by an AA mechanic.

"As a mechanic the us air contract looks better than what I have now not to mention what AA is proposing for the future. If US air were to take over today I would imediatly gain 5 paid holidays, 1 week of vacation, 6 paid sick days, retiree medical coverage at 55 instead of 62 or even none, an active pension, double time pay rates ,15 weeks severence in the event of a layoff with recall rights, double pay for holidays, the list goes on and on . All of these gains for about a 3% cut in pay which won't even be an issue come July when the us air mechanics get thiier next raise. Before anyone goes off about outsourcing or layoffs just remember AA'S current proposal is worse than the 50% in US Air's current contract . After alot of reserch and comparison I think AA needs to re-think their position and come along way twards labor's position to get my vote ."

I like the "lollipops" you and your colleagues are supposedly getting, but where is all of the extra revenue going to come from?

If its too good to be true then it usually is. While US is doing fine right now (at least financially), how long will raises, paid holidays last in this competitive environment. I'm quite curious.

I know it doesn't matter what any of us say, but I'll still say this: For the unions at AA to be backing US Airways is a big mistake. Management at US Airways is just as horrible, if not worse than that of AA. I know everyone at AA is pissed at AA management, but US Airways will not, I repeat, WILL NOT be better towards you. US managers are big on deception and inaction. Any promise that US makes is just that, an empty promise. And the longer they can drag out fulfilling their promises, the better it is for them.

The grass in this case is not greener on the other side. I guarantee you that.

+1.

 

[Jacobin777]

The simple fact is that AA spent eight years with uncompetitive labor costs, including several years in which AA's revenue production fell dramatically relative to its peers because its costs were out of life with its competitors and it was forced to keep capacity in the system which needed to be removed.
.
AA is fixing the revenues, in part by using the little cost advantage it has already gained in BK.
.
What won't ever change is that AA's cost structure is out of line with the industry including with competitors on their domestic system who do a much better job at cost control than AA.
.
It should surprise NO ONE that AA labor will continue their efforts to reduce the company's efforts to reduce labor costs, esp. eliminating 11K dues paying members.
It should also come as no surprise that US, despite two BKs, is desperately trying to save its own franchise - since it has tried multiple times to gain a larger network carrier with better revenue generating abilities - but has come up empty handed every time.
.
Why ANY AA employee would believe that US can provide a better deal - long term or short term - when US can't produce revenue on par with AA and has lower paid employees on average than AA - is behind comprehension.
.
There will always be people who will hold onto any kind of hope - false or not - in order to avoid facing the harsh reality that AA has to be turned around - whether as a standalone or with US.
.
Some AA people foolishly believe that US will minimize the cuts that have to be made at AA while US people foolishly believe that if they get their hands in AA's cookie jar, all of their problems will end.
.
What should be apparent is that US wants AA's revenues - but is nowhere interested in or capable of paying US people wages comparable to what AA people will make - because US' revenue generating capacity is fatally flawed compared to the larger network carriers.
.
NO one has yet to explain how Parker is going to come up with the $7-10B that AA's non-labor creditors are going to want for the cuts they have endured - given that LCC's market cap is a fraction of that amount and AMR's turnaround plan is based on heavy borrowing for fleet renewal.
Anyone?
.
The bottom line is there is NO incentive for the non-labor creditors to accept a deal with US because the recovery on their claims will be BETTER with a reorganized, standalone AMR.
.
The whole goat rodeo that Parker is trying to orchestrate with labor should be seen as such - nothing more than an attempt to hold out false hope to AA labor that the cuts AA is making can be reduced - all the while using what gains AA does obtain thru the BK process to funnel AA revenues to US, which remains unable to compete with the top tier network carriers despite multiple BKs and some of the lowest paid employees in the industry.

WT, I usually have been disagreeing with you on many items the past 1/2 decade, but I actually agree with you here.

PHL and PHX will probably be hit the hardest US-side. MIA could be hit (some) AA-side.

PHL actually probably wouldn't be. It's a hub which the merged carriers can take advantage of.

 

[jersey777]

And if you believe for one second that Parker is going
to give ONE penny of that $1.5 to labor; you are the most
naive person on this planet.
[/quote]


You may want to read the latest apfa hotline with usairs contract proposals and compare it to AA's termsheet and maybe you will think different. Bottom line is that their proposal puts lots more money in my pocket!

 

[FWAAA]

You may want to read the latest apfa hotline with usairs contract proposals and compare it to AA's termsheet and maybe you will think different. Bottom line is that their proposal puts lots more money in my pocket!

When you say "usairs contract proposals" are you talking about the failed TA that US recently offered its FAs or are there some new proposals out there that are specific to AA? The APFA hotline doesn't have any specifics.

 

[john john]

Not sure how accurate these numbers are (I'm sure FWAAA can verify), but this was posted elsewhere by an AA mechanic.

"As a mechanic the us air contract looks better than what I have now not to mention what AA is proposing for the future. If US air were to take over today I would imediatly gain 5 paid holidays, 1 week of vacation, 6 paid sick days, retiree medical coverage at 55 instead of 62 or even none, an active pension, double time pay rates ,15 weeks severence in the event of a layoff with recall rights, double pay for holidays, the list goes on and on . All of these gains for about a 3% cut in pay which won't even be an issue come July when the us air mechanics get thiier next raise. Before anyone goes off about outsourcing or layoffs just remember AA'S current proposal is worse than the 50% in US Air's current contract . After alot of reserch and comparison I think AA needs to re-think their position and come along way twards labor's position to get my vote ."

WorldTraveler says US pay and benefits are well below AA

 

[jersey777]

When you say "usairs contract proposals" are you talking about the failed TA that US recently offered its FAs or are there some new proposals out there that are specific to AA? The APFA hotline doesn't have any specifics.

Bridge Term Sheet Highlights
Early Out APFA's proposal accepted
No Furloughs
Wage Increases: 2.5% on effective date.  1.5% annually over next 5 years.
Retirement: Pension plan frozen. Replaced with a 401(k) contribution.
Current employees will receive automatic 401(k) contributions for 5 years, with no match requirement.  Contribution levels as follows:
9.9% age 50 +
6.75% age 40 – 50
5.5% age 39 – below
At the conclusion of the 5 year period, all FAs would receive a 3% contribution with up to a 5.5% match.
Active Health Benefits: Better than AA’s proposed plan
Retiree Health Benefits: Implementation of Voluntary Employee Beneficiary Association (VEBA).
Bidding: Preferential Bidding System (PBS) with our input
Reserve:
Incorporate earlier Reserve assignment notification
Add AM/PM Ready Reserve shifts.
Allow Reserve pick-up on days off to be paid on top of guarantee.
Current reserve rotation will be maintained.
Sequence Pay Protection:  APFA proposal
Schedule Maximum:
Minimum of seventy (70) credit hours and a maximum of ninety (90) credit hours per bid period.
Flex in the maximum line value by an annual amount of twenty (20) hours, but in no case more than five (5) hours during any given month.
Incentive Pay/Per Diem: Incentive pay eliminated.  Per diem rates increased to:
Domestic: $2.00
International: $2.20
International Override:
$3.00 per hour for each international leg. Override for deadhead, trip and duty rigs and trips “not flown” consistent with CBA
Combined Domestic & International Operation
Current Duty Rigs Preserved
Expedited Negotiations for New Contract:  Negotiations for a market based contract will take place immediately following a single-carrier certification.  If an agreement cannot be reached within 60 days of the certification the matter will be submitted to final binding arbitration.
Maintain all other provisions in our current Contract including:
Vacation accrual and pay
Current PVDs
Sick hour use and current sick policy
Current Hotel language
ATC/ Code 59

 

[nycbusdriver]

You may want to read the latest apfa hotline with usairs contract proposals and compare it to AA's termsheet and maybe you will think different. Bottom line is that their proposal puts lots more money in my pocket!

They will reneg on the promises one way or the other. Mark my words. Just like a sleazy politician who lies to get elected, Parker is telling you folks exactly what you want to hear. Sure, you'll get some money in the short term, but what Horton is offering will look like a gold mine compared to what Parker will offer in your next, soon-to-come bankruptcy.

 

[WorldTraveler]

Bridge Term Sheet Highlights
Early Out APFA's proposal accepted
No Furloughs
Wage Increases: 2.5% on effective date.  1.5% annually over next 5 years.
Retirement: Pension plan frozen. Replaced with a 401(k) contribution.
Current employees will receive automatic 401(k) contributions for 5 years, with no match requirement.  Contribution levels as follows:
9.9% age 50 +
6.75% age 40 – 50
5.5% age 39 – below
At the conclusion of the 5 year period, all FAs would receive a 3% contribution with up to a 5.5% match.
Active Health Benefits: Better than AA’s proposed plan
Retiree Health Benefits: Implementation of Voluntary Employee Beneficiary Association (VEBA).
Bidding: Preferential Bidding System (PBS) with our input
Reserve:
Incorporate earlier Reserve assignment notification
Add AM/PM Ready Reserve shifts.
Allow Reserve pick-up on days off to be paid on top of guarantee.
Current reserve rotation will be maintained.
Sequence Pay Protection:  APFA proposal
Schedule Maximum:
Minimum of seventy (70) credit hours and a maximum of ninety (90) credit hours per bid period.
Flex in the maximum line value by an annual amount of twenty (20) hours, but in no case more than five (5) hours during any given month.
Incentive Pay/Per Diem: Incentive pay eliminated.  Per diem rates increased to:
Domestic: $2.00
International: $2.20
International Override:
$3.00 per hour for each international leg. Override for deadhead, trip and duty rigs and trips “not flown” consistent with CBA
Combined Domestic & International Operation
Current Duty Rigs Preserved
Expedited Negotiations for New Contract:  Negotiations for a market based contract will take place immediately following a single-carrier certification.  If an agreement cannot be reached within 60 days of the certification the matter will be submitted to final binding arbitration.
Maintain all other provisions in our current Contract including:
Vacation accrual and pay
Current PVDs
Sick hour use and current sick policy
Current Hotel language
ATC/ Code 59

anyone who thinks that US can build a business plan that includes preserving over 2000 jobs that were otherwise going to be cut and then offer pay and benefit raises right out of the box is incredibly naive.
.
US average employee salaries are the lowest among network carriers.. that information is fully available from DOT and SEC data.
Of course no one wants to think they are the lowest paid... but the facts ON AVERAGE speak for themselves.

 

[jersey777]

They will reneg on the promises one way or the other. Mark my words. Just like a sleazy politician who lies to get elected, Parker is telling you folks exactly what you want to hear. Sure, you'll get some money in the short term, but what Horton is offering will look like a gold mine compared to what Parker will offer in your next, soon-to-come bankruptcy.

Sir, your bitterness will be overlooked by the 3800 flight attendants whose jobs will be saved by this proposal......and also by those long term flight attendants who finally have a decent early out proposal and won't lose their retiree medical benefits!

 

[737823]

Jacobin777, welcome back! Haven't seen your posts in a while. Hope all is well.

Josh