TWU and IAM representation alliance vote

Will you vote in a TWU and IAM representation alliance? (A/C maint. only)

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Bob Owens said:
"Your side" being those who somehow buy into the idea that the value of our labor is dependent upon the profits that our management is able to make with that labor.  AA does not get a discount on landing fees because they don't make as much as UPS, why should they expect a discount on our labor?  
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19th October, 2011

Airlinefinancials.com Bob Herbst is one saying bankruptcy is inevitable, predicting it within the next two or three quarters, despite the cash on hand. Analysts are also suggesting such a move would help the entire industry since it could clear the way for more consolidation. Of course, US Airways was mentioned as the usual suspect especially since American’s market cap is now so low. But it would take a court-supervised reorganisation to make that happen, said Herbst.

"A Seeking Alpha analysis pointed out the mountain of debt and pension obligations the carrier must surmount, adding it does not have the cash flow to do so."

http://centreforaviation.com/analysis/expectations-too-high-on-american-airlines-pilot-deal-as-bankruptcy-concerns-continue-60827
 
And whose side do you think Wall Street is on?
 
Cash flow went up by $7 billion between the first big giveback and bankruptcy, on top of that AA cut 40,000 workers. So where did/does all that extra money go? Fuel took a big chunk but not even all the $7 billion, what about the 40,000 JOBS, that alone is at least another $2 billion they had to play with. It didn't stop them from buying 500 more new planes than they already had on order. You also forget that over that 10 years they paid off over $10 billion in debt.
 
As for labor costs. ground workers are in a different arena than those in the cockpit because of outsourcing. When work gets outsourced the cost doesn't really get eliminated  as reflected in the balance sheets the company releases, it gets moved, but the effect on the reports is that its eliminated. So if AA outsourced Fleet Service or aircraft maintenance in MIA to AAR services on the books the labor costs for MIA would go to zero, but that's not what happened, nor would the labor costs be based on what AAR pays their workers, it would be based on what AAR charged, and that is not disclosed. This was a challenge we had with Videtich who despite our undeniably much lower compensation would support the companys argument that our maintenance labor costs were the highest in the industry. Well of course they are when you do 90% of your maint in house while everyone else outsourced 50% or more. They weren't apples to apples comparisons and no such comparisons were available due to AA's unique situation. There were other factors that distorted the figure such as the fact that AA had one of the oldest fleets in the industry, thus more maintenance but less aircraft acquisition costs. Kind of like the trade off we made by keeping and maintaining an older car vs buying a new one. Would you rather repair and maintain or make payments to the bank?  We were never given the whole picture, instead Videtich would cherry pick anything the company or AIRCON provided him to make it seem like we were being unrealistic by asking for what everyone else was getting.  So as we were attacked as having the highest maint labor costs the offset to aircraft acquisition costs and costs to vendors was never factored in or made available. Even in bankruptcy where the company would not give us full value for every job we let go, they subtracted "estimated" outsourcing rates (even if we had allowed 100% outsourcing we would not have been able to meet the ask) , we were never given figures as far as how much AA saved by not having to buy new planes and instead keep older ones flying. They did cite how much they would save on fuel with the new aircraft (to justify keeping the 500 new airplane order through BK) but never how much paying for the planes and everything that goes with that would cost.
 
NMB CR-7131 NEW APPLICATIONS FILED AUG 4-AUG-8 2014
IAM/TWU
 
Since the date investigation of this case was recessed, the Board is
informed that the Air Line Mechanics Association, International, has
become affiliated with the United Automobile Workers, CIO. The
other parties to this dispute, namely the Transport Workers Union
of America, CIO, and the International Association of Machinists,
AFL, will be permitted to present to the mediator all available evidence
of their interest in this ease, for the Board's final determination
of the names of the contesting parties to appear on the ballots.
A mediator will be assigned to conclude this case at the earliest
possible date, and all concerned will be informed accordingly.
 
For the mechanics at US and American what has either one of these unions (TWU-IAM) really done anything for us? Now they want to join together to fatten up their own wallets. The IAM will tell the guys at US if you leave you will lose your pension. That is a LIE!!!!! the TWU will tell the guys in Tulsa AMFA is going to get rid of overhaul, this is also a LIE. What both of these money grabbing  entities want is your dues money and to tell what you need. There is no true voice of the membership. A few are chosen to do as they are told in contract negotiations and are paid well to deliver the union propaganda. Again I ask what has either of these unions done? We and I mean WE are the lowest paid in the industry. I am tired of being the Chicago Cubs of the airline industry and hear our unions say we will get them next time. I hear the scare tactics being used that the US guys are going to get screwed in seniority integration. With AMFA nothing is farther from the truth. The plan is to take occupational seniority and put the lists together. Simple, fair, and easy. The goal is not the fight like pilots but as one group get the contract that we deserve. To have contract negotiations that are open to the members, to vote in the officers of our own choosing that we can recall when they stop representing the members best interest. Information is power, signing a card gives you a choice nothing more. Change can be scary, but to be lead around by the nose and told that substandard contracts are good enough and that we will tell you what is good for you can no longer happen.  The proof is out there for everybody to see, AMFA represents two airlines Southwest and Alaska #1 and #3 paid in the industry. If you have a chance to talk to any of the guys at these airlines it may or may not make you take a second look. 
 
TRAVIS said:
Some good reading. and common sense LOL
 
 
http://www.local591.com/?zone=/unionactive/private_view_page.cfm&page=22TWU202F20IAM20Association20Info22
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Travis,  great find.  Now let's see how many people actually  read this.  Hence my post in #843 quote; "maybe the NMB is seeing problems with this alliance thing.  I smell a run off coming"   I really think it is coming.  The 591 President is correct, to be listed as an incumbent you have to have 50% plus 1 interest shown of cards to placed on the ballot.  The TWU and IAM are claiming that this has already been done with the CWA and ibt when in fact it hasn't.  They (CWA and ibt) as 591 President Peterson has proven had an internal election to proceed with their 2 unions joining forces, the TWU and IAM have in fact NOT had any kind of an internal vote prior to trying to become an incumbent on a ballot to bring in a "new" representative union known as this alliance.    When reading these documents going back and forth with the NMB it all makes sense now why this whole thing is taking longer than usual.  It has now been over 6 weeks, when in the past these decisions have been made by 4 weeks or less.   Again, I think the NMB is seeing problems with this alliance to be allowed to go forward.   Again we will all wait and see, but now you all can start to see the loop holes in this alliance BS drummed up by the TWU/IAM just hoping some twisted words and perfectly placed phrases (just like 700 tries to do to keep the membership confused) to try and convince the NMB.   The NMB will rule to the letter of the law not just by what the TWU and IAM "thinks" should happen.   My hat off to Mr. Peterson President of TWU Local 591 for having the cahonies to stand up for his members.  Travis keep this info coming.  Notice all these letters are on 591's site, are they all also on IAM and the TWU international sites?  I doubt it...
 
   AMFA organizers be prepared, your time is coming to send in the cards.  If this does become a run off then AMFA will be givin a time frame to submit cards, and the cards required will be reduced (I think).  
 
  Notice in the IAM responding letter addressing Peterson's letter to NMB, that the IAM thinks a card collection for this alliance would be a complete waste of time and energy.  Why you ask?  Because he knows they will not be able to get the required amount needed of 50% plus 1 of the combined AA and US members.    I SMELL A RUN OFF between the TWU and IAM,  AMFA get your cards ready or be prepared to do a "write-in" campaign...
 
TRAVIS said:
Some good reading. and common sense LOL
 
 
http://www.local591.com/?zone=/unionactive/private_view_page.cfm&page=22TWU202F20IAM20Association20Info22
Click to expand...
One more point after reading these letters.  After you guys read all these letters, this is exactly what you guys (TWU and the IAM) can expect for representation by 2 different unions.  The TWU and the IAM can not agree 100% on anything and there will be all kinds of infighting thru-out your future if this alliance represents you guys.  This is only the beginning and they can't agree to represent you guys, hello???   This alliance hasn't even started at it is very clear how rough the future road will be for you guys while going back and forth with representation from the IAM then the TWU, you guys won't  be able to get anything done as one side will constantly rebut what the other side is doing, AND, just like right now with the "IN FIGHTING" going on right now, you guys will always be tied up with legal battles with letters always flying back and forth and no real progress getting completed.  This is how all the future nego's will go,  NO progress, and always tied up over issues that they will NEVER agree on.  It would take years for you guys to get to a joint contract with these kinds of games being played.  This alone should be enough reasons NOT to vote this BS alliance in.  It will be getting very interesting as we move forward and can't wait to tell 700 he has to eat his words.   Good luck guys...
 
swamt said:
One more point after reading these letters.  After you guys read all these letters, this is exactly what you guys (TWU and the IAM) can expect for representation by 2 different unions.  The TWU and the IAM can not agree 100% on anything and there will be all kinds of infighting thru-out your future if this alliance represents you guys.  This is only the beginning and they can't agree to represent you guys, hello???   This alliance hasn't even started at it is very clear how rough the future road will be for you guys while going back and forth with representation from the IAM then the TWU, you guys won't  be able to get anything done as one side will constantly rebut what the other side is doing, AND, just like right now with the "IN FIGHTING" going on right now, you guys will always be tied up with legal battles with letters always flying back and forth and no real progress getting completed.  This is how all the future nego's will go,  NO progress, and always tied up over issues that they will NEVER agree on.  It would take years for you guys to get to a joint contract with these kinds of games being played.  This alone should be enough reasons NOT to vote this BS alliance in.  It will be getting very interesting as we move forward and can't wait to tell 700 he has to eat his words.   Good luck guys...
Click to expand...
The key thing to this BS alliance is that the MEMBERS are to vote on it...
USE YOUR VOTE WISELY!
 
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  • #853
One additional point of interest to the TWU/IAM Alliance, I noticed they added Stores to their M&R Class Craft  representation request.
 
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