Teamsters "raiding" TWU?

[Anomaly]

LOL yeah amazing isn't it ?? Even you are questioning my pay as a mechanic cuz even you cannot believe I make that much. I guess your unions have never got to that level for AMT's so that wage is foreign to you. Really pathetic that unions other then Ibt at UPS can claim that. AMFA at SWA is pretty close.

Of course UPS is much more in line with you. Yes, I have read these threads. Unfortunately sarcasm is a bit hard to write in to a post, but I did get you to admit the points I wanted to focus on. Thanks.

 

[Anomaly]

Just think, if he is willing to give up $15/hr, settle for just one week of vacation for the next five years, with just 5 paid holidays, (but only paid at half pay if he is assigned to work), and settle for just five sick days he too can buy the right to call himself a Union Mechanic at American Airlines for only $700/year (after taxes). (In other words if he wanted to give up his non-union job and go work Union at AA as a mechanic he would neeed to accept at least a $32,000/year paycut, and thats if he was hired at Top Pay. Do you blame him for not wanting a Union? )

Once again Bob, your flip flop support of unions fails to surprise. Have you ever considered he support creating a union where he is? Even amfa?

 

[Anomaly]

Again Anomaly, not made up. Lived it. We had outsiders at the table as lead negos. CAL also had outsiders nego for them as well. With the closed door to negos that the teamsters always use while nego contracts is how and why the teamsters can work out "behind closed door deals" with the company in a private hotel room. This was in fact done (as we have already proven) and will more than likely be brought up in the webinar. The same shanigans were also played out over at CAL.

I can never get enough of your "TRUTHFUL" opinions....

For the 90th time, because you see things differently does not make you more right, or even sane.

Just as a point of example, both SWA and UAL are in negotiations.

This is the FULL list of voting negotiators at SWA

http://www.amfa18.or...ns Update 1.pdf

Earl Clark –Region 1 Director

Jack Coonrod – Region II Director

Bob Cramer – Airline Representative Local 18

Nino DiMaggio – Airline Representative Local 11

Mike Young – Airline Representative Local 32

Besides these 5 deciding AMFA International and Local Officers, rank and file members are invited to join and participate on a non voting basis at their own individual expense where adequate facilities and time are provided.

This is the FULL list of voting negotiators at UAL

http://www.teamster....eptember-6-2012

Bob Clever - IAH

Michael Nerren - IAH

Vinny Graziano - EWR

Steve Olsen - EWR

Paul Becerra - MCO

Mike Moats - CLE

Jay Koreny - IAD

Mitch Hunt - DEN

Mike Pecoraro - ORD

Mark DesAngeles- SFO

Joe Prisco - SFO

Anthony Ybarra - LAX

John Pangelian - GUM

These men are Stewards or rank and file members who will fall under and be bound by the terms of the agreement they decide on.

They are assisted by 12 Business Agents, 3 Airline Reps and a Legal Attorney present at each meeting. If there is a subject to be decided by vote, only the 13 members named above are allowed to vote. If there is a decision to be made among the 13 voting members, all other IBT reps are asked to leave the room while the voting members discuss or debate in private what the outcome will be. All members are provided transportation to and from the neutral negotiations site, offered per-diem and hotel as needed, and compensated for any lost time attributed for participating in the meetings.

With the IBT; rank and file members decide the contract and are assisted by the officers and staff. Not the other way around as it is practiced in amfa.

This system is not new to UAL, but has been in place for many years and practiced for many IBT contracts

Some of you guys are expressing if AMFA can handle the greiv. and arbitration cases when they take over at AA. Just to let you know; AMFA has handled numerous upon numerous arbitrations since the teamsters got fired. Matter fact, AMFA has done more arbitraded cases at SWA in under 10 years than the teamsters handled in there almost 30 years at SWA. What does that tell ya?? The teamsters would always just let the company do what it wants and never take a stand against them. At the time, the teamsters had company yes men at the helm for the teamsters, and there for awhile, nothing was grieved or challenged for many many years. These type of folks are currently in management positions for the company. It is built into AMFA's constitution that you cannot take a company position for at least 2 years after being a union rep or officer.

Per your own amfa organizing web page,

http://www.amfanatio...page=Organizing

the organizing ventures of amfa rely on grass roots and "fundamental philosophies." This can include any statement by any person in order to get you to sign a card. It does not have to be true or factual, but it can be the opinion of the grass roots "organizer." Even you, swamt, are immune from fact according to amfa history. You may or may not be correct on the argument that amfa has arbitrated more grievances in it's 10 years than the IBT did in it's 30, but I find it suspicious at best. Can you supply proof of this statement? Can you provide proof that the IBT did in fact ignore or refused to proceed with legitimately filed grievances?

Was there ever a complaint to the DOL filed for this refusal? But lets say you are correct, and there were few IBT grievances filed for the reasons you claim.

I do not argue that there may have been Stewards within your ranks that were friendly to and may have been looking for positions with management. This unfortunately has happened at every union I have been with (and amfa's constitution barring this action does nothing if not introduced in the contract, which it is not). Company YES men will always be around, but will only get away with their bad behavior if people like you allow them to. You can not hide behind a constitution in this. But do you have proof the IBT elected leadership, or International stood by and allowed violations of the negotiated contract? Did YOU try to point this out at the time?

Statements like what you said above more often than not tend to be from those who believe someone was not doing their job well enough, but refuses to step up themselves. Or, just as likely, these types of statements come from one who continual lives life from the sidelines careful to throw stones at the appropriate time while never getting his own hands dirty. Or maybe you are just angry because you felt ignored for one reason or another and none of what you said is actually true??

If you were there while the company was violating the contract, did YOU grieve or challenge? If you did, do you have a written record of this? If you did nothing.....WHY?

 

[TWU informer]

I can never get enough of your "TRUTHFUL" opinions....

For the 90th time, because you see things different;y does not make you more right, or even sane.

Just as a point of example, both SWA and UAL are in negotiations.

This is the FULL list of voting negotiators at SWA

http://www.amfa18.or...ns Update 1.pdf

Earl Clark –Region 1 Director

Jack Coonrod – Region II Director

Bob Cramer – Airline Representative Local 18

Nino DiMaggio – Airline Representative Local 11

Mike Young – Airline Representative Local 32

Besides these 5 deciding AMFA International and Local Officers, rank and file members are invited to join and participate on a non voting basis at their own individual expense where adequate facilities and time are provided.

This is the FULL list of voting negotiators at UAL

http://www.teamster....eptember-6-2012

Bob Clever - IAH

Michael Nerren - IAH

Vinny Graziano - EWR

Steve Olsen - EWR

Paul Becerra - MCO

Mike Moats - CLE

Jay Koreny - IAD

Mitch Hunt - DEN

Mike Pecoraro - ORD

Mark DesAngeles- SFO

Joe Prisco - SFO

Anthony Ybarra - LAX

John Pangelian - GUM

These men are Stewards or rank and file members who will fall under and be bound by the terms of the agreement they decide on.

What about the behind closed door negotiations? Who takes care of those? Like the local side letters of agreement that are happening at UAL and never voted on by the membership. Who is negotiating those?

 

[Anomaly]

What about the behind closed door negotiations? Who takes care of those? Like the local side letters of agreement that are happening at UAL and never voted on by the membership. Who is negotiating those?

Show me all the "local side letters of agreement that are happening at UAL and never voted on by the membership."

I will wait patiently.

 

[TWU informer]

Show me all the "local side letters of agreement that are happening at UAL and never voted on by the membership."

I will wait patiently.

No problem

http://www.mechanics...files/bp_07.pdf

Let's see you worm your way out of this one?

Maybe you could start with a big fat lie, or a personal attack to deflect attention away.

 

[enough already]

No problem

http://www.mechanics...files/bp_07.pdf

Let's see you worm your way out of this one?

Maybe you could start with a big fat lie, or a personal attack to deflect attention away.

Chirp....... Chirp...... Chirp............

 

[Flying low]

It's only been an hour. Give Anomaly time to come up with a story...

 

[Anomaly]

No problem



Let's see you worm your way out of this one?

Maybe you could start with a big fat lie, or a personal attack to deflect attention away.

Oh!? OK. You win. This changes everything I ever said. I had no idea the Teamsters were possible of such a deplorable act as establishing LOCAL guidelines for added work. One can only wonder why the mechanics for change which included amfa was not able to win back representation right then and there. Get me a card, quick.

 

[Anomaly]

TWU informer, now answer me this:

What about the negotiations description I mentioned before? Not one rank and file member on the negotiations committee? Can you answer the basic philosophy of the amfa organizer? One who has never been a member, like you, is expected to do all their campaigning, make all their promises and create a host of false expectations? What about the 2008 WN cost neutral contract amfa was able to make with a profitable company? There are dozens of issues and questions I point directly at you that never get answered.

The IBT has a web site and contact information to gain further information.

http://www.teamster.org/aamx

amfa has grass roots and philosophies

http://www.amfanational.org/index.cfm?zone=/unionactive/view_article.cfm&HomeID=250556&page=Organizing

amfa has IBT organizers on the ground in Tulsa who are willing to go door to door to listen to members questions and complaints. Where is amfa?

When all this campaigning is over, will you stand up as a leader in the union? Can you show leadership by answering at least some of the menay questions I have pointed at you??

 

[ThirdSeatHero]

On the subject of negotiations, its worthy to note that under AMFA the negotiators are ELECTED, Under the teamsters they are APPOINTED.

 

[Anomaly]

On the subject of negotiations, its worthy to note that under AMFA the negotiators are ELECTED, Under the teamsters they are APPOINTED.

This is true depending on the Local. Some are appointed and some elected. All negotiators are rank and file members.

 

[TWU informer]

What about the behind closed door negotiations? Who takes care of those? Like the local side letters of agreement that are happening at UAL and never voted on by the membership. Who is negotiating those?

Show me all the "local side letters of agreement that are happening at UAL and never voted on by the membership."

I will wait patiently.

No problem

http://www.mechanics...files/bp_07.pdf

Let's see you worm your way out of this one?

Maybe you could start with a big fat lie, or a personal attack to deflect attention away.

Oh!? OK. You win. This changes everything I ever said. I had no idea the Teamsters were possible of such a deplorable act as establishing LOCAL guidelines for added work. One can only wonder why the mechanics for change which included amfa was not able to win back representation right then and there. Get me a card, quick.

You are one damn good AMFA organizer.

Keep up the great work!

 

[Anomaly]

TWU informer, now answer me this:

What about the negotiations description I mentioned before? Not one rank and file member on the negotiations committee? Can you answer the basic philosophy of the amfa organizer? One who has never been a member, like you, is expected to do all their campaigning, make all their promises and create a host of false expectations? What about the 2008 WN cost neutral contract amfa was able to make with a profitable company? There are dozens of issues and questions I point directly at you that never get answered.

The IBT has a web site and contact information to gain further information.

http://www.teamster.org/aamx

amfa has grass roots and philosophies

http://www.amfanatio...page=Organizing

amfa has IBT organizers on the ground in Tulsa who are willing to go door to door to listen to members questions and complaints. Where is amfa?

When all this campaigning is over, will you stand up as a leader in the union? Can you show leadership by answering at least some of the menay questions I have pointed at you??

And you are doing wonders for the IBT as well.

Thanks

 

[Rogallo]

You are one damn good AMFA organizer.

Keep up the great work!

Yes he is!