TA reached for TWU dispatchers and Ops specialists at AA

[Bogey]

Thank you. I have not read your agreement and was not proposing that you should vote any way.
I am simply saying that some, in the past, have sold out the future generations for quick gains.
And Worldport, you speak just like all the scabs that set back the profession for a generation.
Just bend over and take what is offered, and enjoy. All while the corporation is making billions per quarter.

I understand and being a long term employee, I have seen what you are talking about. I as much as the next person would love to see everything we have had at one point or another in our careers.

We have had 12 sick days at one point. We have had 7 weeks of vacation. We had a retirement that was cut in half. I would love to have that all back in place, but I don't believe I wanted to risk what was on the table by potentially putting it in the hands of an arbitrator.

I had 5 sick days and I now will have 8. A gain of 3. How long should 375 people hold out on a 40 percent raise so that someone doesn't work here yet have 10?

Someone who started last year had 4 days vacations and now they have 10. I had 29 and now I have 30. How long do I hold out so someone who doesn't work here yet has 35 days 30 years from now.

I can assure you that we are making gains in many areas. We are not selling out the future at all. We were the lowest starting pay in our industry and after 30 years, we have finally done away with the B scale. I know the money was there anyway because Dougie promised Delta plus 3, but we have made gains in multiple areas. It may not be what we once had, but it's more then I had last week.

Glenn, I understand you are not accusing me or the dispatchers of selling out. Your concerns of that happening are valid based on history.

 

[WeAAsles]

I understand and being a long term employee, I have seen what you are talking about. I as much as the next person would love to see everything we have had at one point or another in our careers.

We have had 12 sick days at one point. We have had 7 weeks of vacation. We had a retirement that was cut in half. I would love to have that all back in place, but I don't believe I wanted to risk what was on the table by potentially putting it in the hands of an arbitrator.

I had 5 sick days and I now will have 8. A gain of 3. How long should 375 people hold out on a 40 percent raise so that someone doesn't work here yet have 10?

Someone who started last year had 4 days vacations and now they have 10. I had 29 and now I have 30. How long do I hold out so someone who doesn't work here yet has 35 days 30 years from now.

I can assure you that we are making gains in many areas. We are not selling out the future at all. We were the lowest starting pay in our industry and after 30 years, we have finally done away with the B scale. I know the money was there anyway because Dougie promised Delta plus 3, but we have made gains in multiple areas. It may not be what we once had, but it's more then I had last week.

Glenn, I understand you are not accusing me or the dispatchers of selling out. Your concerns of that happening are valid based on history.

Exactly Bogey. Great point of view.

What you seem to have gotten is at least a good solid return to form and maybe even a platform that can be built on in the next session 5 years from now.

On the wage rates you want to hope that your future raises at least keep up to the rise in inflation. So if inflation stays at or below 2% for the life of your contract, then you can concentrate more on restrengthening other language or items besides wages. And it's important to keep those old Union contract books to pass down to the next group of negotiators as a reminder of what was and what should be eventually gained back (Over time) 

We got clobbered by inflation from 2003 to 2012 but since then inflation has remained relatively low. 

http://useconomy.about.com/od/inflationfaq/a/US-Inflation-Rate.htm

On a side note. After everyone else gets their raises they really need to consider buying a property and getting out of the rental market.

http://fortune.com/2015/10/07/rents-rise-housing/

 

[Traymark]

Bogey, you gave a great explanation as to where we are today as a membership.
Im thankful my kids are in college and will have degrees so they one day may be on the winning side of the economy.
Management clearly has won the day, that's where today's youth should be striving to get into.

I would hope at this point, our NC shortens our deal to 3 yrs instead of 5 so we can chip away sooner.

 

[700UW]

I believe all deals have to be five years due to the .POR.

 

[Traymark]

Bogey
Forgot to ask one last thing,
Was this a "last best offer"
Or
A TA that is getting full throated support of the TWU leadership and NC?

Thank you for all the info.

 

[Bogey]

Bogey
Forgot to ask one last thing,
Was this a "last best offer"
Or
A TA that is getting full throated support of the TWU leadership and NC?

According to our negotiators from the local, that after 10 months, they reached the end. No more movement on either side. I don't think the international had any say in it. Unless it was behind closed doors which we all know they are capable of.

 

[Traymark]

Thanks Bogey, best of luck to you and your group.

 

[JABORD]

According to our negotiators from the local, that after 10 months, they reached the end. No more movement on either side. I don't think the international had any say in it. Unless it was behind closed doors which we all know they are capable of.

So for those of us looking for a comparison as to what the M&E contract might look like I believe this pretty much expresses it. Thanks buddy for your effort to pass us the info.
The company will continue to distract us with the $$ yet the analogy as to 'the devil is in the details' prevails. For those looking for AA to make right past pillaging of our standard of life, they need to be realistic. The decision makers who reside at the corporate castle put value on everything and the more those numbers favor their pockets, the less we can expect. 
I believe the top tier of the ASSociation Intl. has pretty much left the 12 negotiators to fend for themselves. Is this a good thing? That's debatable. I would expect any indication that we are not being supported by the 'mother ship' does not work in our favor through the company's eyes. 
So in the end, our ability to extend the point of "no more movement" and our ability to gain back the most remains the challenge for us as members to continue to express ourselves and find the tools necessary to give those negotiating on our behalf the leverage to convince AA to do us right and move forward.

 

[Worldport]

Thank you. I have not read your agreement and was not proposing that you should vote any way.

I am simply saying that some, in the past, have sold out the future generations for quick gains.

And Worldport, you speak just like all the scabs that set back the profession for a generation.

Just bend over and take what is offered, and enjoy. All while the corporation is making billions per quarter.

Given a scenario for arguments sake  all the airlines unions have taken large cuts to keep an airline afloat one union decides it won't take a cut a will strike if not given a raise. would you support that union and not cross their picket line  and if you do honor the picket your airline shuts down? If so' how noble,  what a guy, everyone will shake your hand at unemployment 

 

[conehead777]

Given a scenario for arguments sake  all the airlines unions have taken large cuts to keep an airline afloat one union decides it won't take a cut a will strike if not given a raise. would you support that union and not cross their picket line  and if you do honor the picket your airline shuts down? If so' how noble,  what a guy, everyone will shake your hand at unemployment

yes I would support that union. When the unions did not support the air traffic controllers. And when the pilots flight attendants and ground workers did not support AMFA NWA mechanics. Has allowed the company's upper management to give them selfs bonuses and pay increases . Because they know the unions have no support from other unions . So they know they will get pay cuts from employees. Do you think aa was right to go into bk with 4 are 5 billion dollars so they could cut our contracts more. I don't with your mentality why aren't you in management. Since you side with the company

 

[Worldport]

yes I would support that union. When the unions did not support the air traffic controllers. And when the pilots flight attendants and ground workers did not support AMFA NWA mechanics. Has allowed the company's upper management to give them selfs bonuses and pay increases . Because they know the unions have no support from other unions . So they know they will get pay cuts from employees. Do you think aa was right to go into bk with 4 are 5 billion dollars so they could cut our contracts more. I don't with your mentality why aren't you in management. Since you side with the company

I'll lay on my death bed thinking I should have spent more time with my family. You'll lay on your death bed thinking you should have done more for your union the same union that would stick it in your back first chance they got. My point is my  family is more important than any union or union supporters and I'll do what i can to support them. You're pretty naive if you think a union wouldn't screw you, heck they're screwing you right now but keep sticking up for them.

 

[Traymark]

When the talk is about supporting other unions that's fine, but when the air traffic controllers are brought up, I draw the line there.
Just to set the record straight, the air traffic controllers all signed an agreement that they would not strike, ever.
Their strike was illegal, I can't and won't support that, ever.

 

[Glenn Quagmire]

I'll lay on my death bed thinking I should have spent more time with my family. You'll lay on your death bed thinking you should have done more for your union the same union that would stick it in your back first chance they got. My point is my  family is more important than any union or union supporters and I'll do what i can to support them. You're pretty naive if you think a union wouldn't screw you, heck they're screwing you right now but keep sticking up for them.

I will lay my head down tonight knowing that I am not a scab. My family lays with me knowing that I am a man of convictions. I also turned the strike into a win for me. I had already planned on the event and had gone back to school and got an advanced degree. I decided that what NWA was offering was not enough for my skill and talent.

You will take what scraps are thrown to you and your family, until they outsource you. Then you will wonder why "your Union" screwed you.

When is the last time you went to a union meeting or voted on anything related to local matters?

 

[Worldport]

I will lay my head down tonight knowing that I am not a scab. My family lays with me knowing that I am a man of convictions. I also turned the strike into a win for me. I had already planned on the event and had gone back to school and got an advanced degree. I decided that what NWA was offering was not enough for my skill and talent.

You will take what scraps are thrown to you and your family, until they outsource you. Then you will wonder why "your Union" screwed you.

When is the last time you went to a union meeting or voted on anything related to local matters?

 A man of conviction that would let his family suffer with him. Well Glenn you landed on your feet and have been a successful  I'm glad for you I too have had a successful run and am quite happy  lets just say we had different priorities getting there

 

[bob@las-AA]

I will lay my head down tonight knowing that I am not a scab. My family lays with me knowing that I am a man of convictions. I also turned the strike into a win for me. I had already planned on the event and had gone back to school and got an advanced degree. I decided that what NWA was offering was not enough for my skill and talent.
You will take what scraps are thrown to you and your family, until they outsource you. Then you will wonder why "your Union" screwed you.
When is the last time you went to a union meeting or voted on anything related to local matters?

Try that same strike in front of homeless people under a bridge, or the line leading into the unemployment office.