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On 12/28/2002 8
26 PM oldiebutgoody wrote:
NO matter what they think pilots will make more than they do. I was working utility for a nonunion company at a major airport 25 years ago for minimum wage. I did everything U employees do; dumped lavs, loaded and unloaded bags, pushed back airplanes (727s and DC-8s) and even fueled. All for MINIMUM WAGE and NO BENEFITS. Then, I went to college, got a degree (in a very useful field, one in which I could have made FAR MORE than flying airplanes), served almost 8 years in the military, then got an airline job. ALL PILOTS TAKE SOMEWHAT SIMILAR PATHS. You know what? I think that if the company can train your replacement in an afternoon that you SHOULD ONLY BE MAKING MINIMUM WAGE. That's the way I see it, and it looks like the company sees it that way too. And all of you thinking that pilots will take a huge haircut if this thing goes under, think again. Those that want to work in aviation will quickly get hired at the surviving carriers when the economy recovers. Those that don't have many skills that will make them successful elsewhere. It seems to me that the only choice left for many groups at U is whether they want furlough and severance pay or not; the jobs will cease to exist no matter what you vote.
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1. I don't think I could teach even you what I do in one afternoon. And do you really want a minimum wage guy deicing you in a freezing precip? I've seen ASA do it, and I would not let anyone I cared about ride with them afterwards. How about catching CLP boo-booes? I do it all the time, and that's good for you. It helps when the plane rotates when and where the paperwork says it's supposed to, instead of still being heavy on the stick at VR.
2. Well gosh, even we ramp rats might have a skill set useful outside of aviation, and one or two of us even have degrees. Somehow, I'll be able to survive without a pilot guiding my life.
3. If you've read any of my posts, you know I don't have a gripe with pilots making a bunch more than I do. Where I draw the line is assymetrical outcomes. ALPA wouldn't stand for them either. Would you stand for a situation where RJ pilot slots were outsourced, but fleet mainline groundhandled them? I don't think so!
4. AS for severance, is ALPA willing to guarantee, in writing, that fleet will receive severance, under all circumstances, if we vote yes? I didn't think so.
Your post adds great insight into how at least one ALPA members views agents. Perhaps you could explain why WN agents make $25 an hour (the best U agents ever did was 21.66) and turns a profit? Could it be the problem lies elsewhere?
In closing, every group should get fully informed as to the consequences of Concessions, Round II, and then vote their interests.
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On 12/28/2002 8
26 PM oldiebutgoody wrote: NO matter what they think pilots will make more than they do. I was working utility for a nonunion company at a major airport 25 years ago for minimum wage. I did everything U employees do; dumped lavs, loaded and unloaded bags, pushed back airplanes (727s and DC-8s) and even fueled. All for MINIMUM WAGE and NO BENEFITS. Then, I went to college, got a degree (in a very useful field, one in which I could have made FAR MORE than flying airplanes), served almost 8 years in the military, then got an airline job. ALL PILOTS TAKE SOMEWHAT SIMILAR PATHS. You know what? I think that if the company can train your replacement in an afternoon that you SHOULD ONLY BE MAKING MINIMUM WAGE. That's the way I see it, and it looks like the company sees it that way too. And all of you thinking that pilots will take a huge haircut if this thing goes under, think again. Those that want to work in aviation will quickly get hired at the surviving carriers when the economy recovers. Those that don't have many skills that will make them successful elsewhere. It seems to me that the only choice left for many groups at U is whether they want furlough and severance pay or not; the jobs will cease to exist no matter what you vote.
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[/blockquote]
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1. I don't think I could teach even you what I do in one afternoon. And do you really want a minimum wage guy deicing you in a freezing precip? I've seen ASA do it, and I would not let anyone I cared about ride with them afterwards. How about catching CLP boo-booes? I do it all the time, and that's good for you. It helps when the plane rotates when and where the paperwork says it's supposed to, instead of still being heavy on the stick at VR.
2. Well gosh, even we ramp rats might have a skill set useful outside of aviation, and one or two of us even have degrees. Somehow, I'll be able to survive without a pilot guiding my life.
3. If you've read any of my posts, you know I don't have a gripe with pilots making a bunch more than I do. Where I draw the line is assymetrical outcomes. ALPA wouldn't stand for them either. Would you stand for a situation where RJ pilot slots were outsourced, but fleet mainline groundhandled them? I don't think so!
4. AS for severance, is ALPA willing to guarantee, in writing, that fleet will receive severance, under all circumstances, if we vote yes? I didn't think so.
Your post adds great insight into how at least one ALPA members views agents. Perhaps you could explain why WN agents make $25 an hour (the best U agents ever did was 21.66) and turns a profit? Could it be the problem lies elsewhere?
In closing, every group should get fully informed as to the consequences of Concessions, Round II, and then vote their interests.
