overhaul

[strikeforce]

WOW
And you voted NO on the T/A?
Amazing

I guess you can't read either!

I said if I "owned" AA, idiot! lol

Here's my real plan if I were in Jim Little's shoes.....which I'm not!

#1. Mirror Delta tech ops, Lufthansa Technik and others by doing lots of MRO work at AFW & TUL. One-time conversion AMT to OSM at bases, and farm out all OH. That's a no brainer and I think everyone is on board with the theory that OH is a losing battle for the union.

#2. Create a mandatory retirement age for mechanics....say 67. There must be a turnover system to bring in younger and more talented workers. Early outs only raises costs on the company.

#3. It's imperative that mechanics are held accountable for their work. Put a system in place where your pay increases are based on feedback from your peers.

#4 It's time to decertify the union. Like I said before, the union is only here to protect the slugs. In #3, the slugs would be gone! Create a one-time test of mechanics.....where the company can select the best qualified workers. And then, pay them accordingly. UPS, WN wages?????? maybe!


This is the real deal Informer, I don't believe AA is looking to reward anybody. I think the time has come where 3rd party aircraft maintenance has given the airlines an alternative by doing maintenance for less. Our own mechanics work second jobs at 3rd party outfits for less than what they make at AA, and no benefits. You think AA and others aren't aware of that. Our own guys are throwing ALL of us under the bus by working for less, thus forcing US to accept less because the alternative for AA is farming out our work to those contractors. WE are our own worst enemies!!

 

[TWU informer]

strikeforce, I guess you should begin by number one figuring out how to get the Railway Labor Act Amended to allow for union decertification, there currrently is none.

And we need a viable plan that might actually happen and we need it pretty quickly.
Neither the Judge nor the Majority will agree to go non-union at American Airlines.

Start Over

My plan allows for current employees to keep what they have and a conversion to MRO.
Your plan just cuts everyone's nuts and has no faith in the ability to become a profit center.

I assume this is your view because you do not work overhaul at a base.

Again, try to come up with a plan that could actually happen fairly quickly or you will just get the term sheet.

 

[Rogallo]

You guys got any time for working?? h34r: h34r:

 

[strikeforce]

WOW
And you voted NO on the T/A?
Amazing...."Brother"

I assume you have enough seniority to withstand those cuts, and as long as you are employed making $60-$70 with a bonus for doing your job, then you are good to go?

I'm actively looking for other employment with over 20 years of seniority.....tells you something Informer??? I think it's time to take the union hat off and start looking at things from a company's perspective, and it would probably be beneficial to all of US. I look at Delta for setting the bar. Their mechanics are much better off than we are and they're non-union. They could leave at anytime and come work in a union environment, but they choose not to......why??? They are regarded throughout the industry as "good" employees and "good" mechanics, and Delta recognizes that by paying them better than most. Maybe it's to keep the union out, but the guys themselves do not like the unions. If AA was non-union....you wouldn't have the slugs, loud mouths, and lazy a$$holes. Management wouldn't put up with that non-sense. Would you???

The union's lack of keeping people accountable has deminished our ability to negotiate for good wages and benefits. How many people would go on strike if the union called one????? That's right......zippo! That's how much credibility the union has from their own membership. And, AA knows that! That's why a company like AA can come out with a term sheet that basically rapes you and me of our bare necessities.....wages, medical & retirement. The only thing that prevents AA from getting a discrimination lawsuit is that they also raped their non-union employees, as well. But, I'm sure they thought about taking care of their own and finding out 10 million ways to sunday how they can screw us without screwing them. I'm sure of that!

I guess my previous local president was right when he said, "Tom Horton can't stand maintenance", and "he will get rid of maintenance if he has his way". Well, the time has come and Tom Horton is the leader. How lucky are we to have our worst enemy in power?? I don't know a worse case scenerio besides Frank Lorenzo at EA.

Best thing to do is ride out the storm and look for other employment........you're gonna have a grabber trying to convince me to vote yes to another raping!!!

 

[strikeforce]

You guys got any time for working?? h34r: h34r:

I work nights! looking for work while arguing with idiots! lol

 

[enough already]

Why is it the union's job to get rid of slugs?

 

[strikeforce]

strikeforce, I guess you should begin by number one figuring out how to get the Railway Labor Act Amended to allow for union decertification, there currrently is none.

And we need a viable plan that might actually happen and we need it pretty quickly.
Neither the Judge nor the Majority will agree to go non-union at American Airlines.

Start Over

My plan allows for current employees to keep what they have and a conversion to MRO.
Your plan just cuts everyone's nuts and has no faith in the ability to become a profit center.

I assume this is your view because you do not work overhaul at a base.

Again, try to come up with a plan that could actually happen fairly quickly or you will just get the term sheet.

The company has given the union their plan to make money. Do I believe in their plan....NO! Again, the only thing that will change over the next 6 years is our pay! That's their plan. The union has NO plan, even though they say they have a plan. Little the other night said, "we are looking at trade offs", another way of saying "pay cuts" for everyone to keep jobs in Tulsa. You guys have the majority....so, I guess my pay will be cut further to save your job....how wonderful is that!

I don't have any plans besides finding another job and getting out of the airline industry. I believe my qualifications are sufficient in finding a job with a utility or petroleum based company. We'll see!

 

[strikeforce]

strikeforce, I guess you should begin by number one figuring out how to get the Railway Labor Act Amended to allow for union decertification, there currrently is none.

And we need a viable plan that might actually happen and we need it pretty quickly.
Neither the Judge nor the Majority will agree to go non-union at American Airlines.

Start Over

My plan allows for current employees to keep what they have and a conversion to MRO.
Your plan just cuts everyone's nuts and has no faith in the ability to become a profit center.

I assume this is your view because you do not work overhaul at a base.

Again, try to come up with a plan that could actually happen fairly quickly or you will just get the term sheet.

Home

Decertification under the Railway Labor Act


[En español]
Under the Railway Labor Act, there is no procedure by which employees can simply get rid of the "union shop" forced unionism clause in the contract between a union and their employer.

However, railway and airline employees have the right to oust a union as their exclusive bargaining agent if a majority of the employees in a bargaining unit sign cards authorizing an employee in that bargaining unit to serve as their representative, and that employee files an application for “Investigation of Representational Dispute” with the National Mediation Board (NMB).

The NMB would then hold an election between the union and the independent representative. If the independent representative wins the election, he or she can disclaim the contract entirely or just the forced unionism clause.Detailed information about the NMB’s representation procedures can be found on its web site.

The case that established the right of railway and airline employees to opt for non-representation is Russell v. NMB, 714 F.2d 1332 (5th Cir. 1983), in which a Foundation attorney represented the employees who wanted no union representation.

Unfortunately, you will not find any reference to this decision on the NMB’s web site, but the procedures described on that web site do apply to a “decertification” election under Russell.


.....I guess you may still be able to oust the union. How about hiring a law firm to represent US?????

 

[strikeforce]

More specific then for those challenged.

#1 Significant Early out Retirement Option - Keeping ccurrent retirement medical should be sufficient, with a 15 month window.

#2 Allow currently employees to remain at current payscales and pay premiums

#3 Allow for less license pay/requirement in overhaul for new employees upgrading or hiring into overhaul. Only paying for license required by the Q.A.M.. New or recalled employess only. AA will be able to change Q.A.M. License Requirements, grandfathering current employees into their current status.

#4 New hires will be on new payscale and health plans that wiil allow a transition to MRO payrates/cost for overhaul.

#5 Line pay will then be transitioned to market rates of pay for that work duty.

#6 Hard Freeze the M&R pensions but do not terminate them. All employees transfer to 401K Match.

#7 Allow Overhaul to have an independent profit sharing plan from 3rd party work.

#8 Allow Line to have their own independent profit sharing plan from their 3rd party work.

#9 Both Independent Profit Sharing Plans for 3rd Party Maintenance will be in addition to the new company wide profit sharing plans.

#10 Create an independent review panel to insure proper calculations of 3rd party profits/cost outs.

#11 Recall of RIF's employees will be into new payscales and options, allowing current OSM's to come into full overhaul Maintenance.

#12 Create apprentice type of program to allow all employees without license to get their certificates via experience recognition. Include tuition and license testing reimbursement. This will crreate a new pool of employees that may want to transfer and move to the line stations for the higher pay. Or later advance to Crew Chief/Inspector positions in overhaul.

#13 Allow for full overhaul base 7 day coverage and shift work. Implementing a Bid Shift/Bid Days Off by seniority. This will prevent 20+ year employees from involuntarily being placed in undesireable shift and days off work. New and/or recalled employees will be informed in advance and placed into undesireable shift/days off schedules.


Reasoning, early out will create openings for hire and lower average cost. The more that hired, the more average cost drops.
Line and Overhaul will no longer be on the same payscale, but transfer and seniority list will remain together. Qualifications requires to bump, upgrade, or transfer. As older employees retire, the cost of overhaul reduces.


That is a simple rough start and will surely need tweaking to complete the transition.

OK Informer let's review your plan.......

#1. Twu just submitted early out plan......let's wait and see if AA bites.

#2. AA already proposed keeping remaining employees at current payscales, except for 500 or so amt's that downgrade to OSM's. The whole reason for layoffs is to lower the overall labor cost in order to be competative, right???

#3. They are eliminating the license premiums for downgrades to OSM. Any recalls to OH will come in as OSM's.

#4. "new hires"????? with 4600 + amt's on layoff, AA won't be hiring anytime soon.

#5. If your proposing WN or UPS wages......I don't see that happening with the TWU looking for alternative ways to save jobs!! Even with the 7.5% increases over 6 years will place us at the bottom. This may be detrimental to the other airline mechanics that just saw their wages rise.

#6. I don't see AA moving away from terminating the plans. It's definitely one of the reasons why they went BK. Unless the PBGC fights tooth and nail, the pensions are done.

#7, #8, #9, #10. I think you believe the company will just create all of these plans to appease OH. I think your days are numbered and AA will look to shrink OH, unless they create an MRO.

#11. You actually believe OSM's will eventually become AMT's??? They want more OSM's and less AMT's according to their term sheet.

#12. I don't believe AA is looking at creating more AMT's.

#13. TUL will be 24/7/365 very soon. I believe AA will look to very lengthy bid system.....maybe even permanent bids. Right now I elect to work nights....down the road I may not have a choice!

I hope your right Informer, but I just don't believe AA will look at any viable & alternative plan. I think AA has their own plans for OH, and it's not good. Sorry!

 

[Slopoke]

Yet, you hired in under some form of a "B-Scale" or something similar, and you have been at AA for how long?
Common sense says the employee that hires in under a "sellout" as it has been called, and stays for years, either likes the conditions of employment, or has the battered wife syndrome and needs help.

Yes I did hire on as a B-scale employee in 86. But the fact of the matter is that I will not vote for anything that dose not benefit current and future employees equally. It's the way I feel and nothing will change it. I am not a I've got mine or we got ours type of person. If you can't understand that, oh well.

 

[enough already]

Yes I did hire on as a B-scale employee in 86. But the fact of the matter is that I will not vote for anything that dose not benefit current and future employees equally. It's the way I feel and nothing will change it. I am not a I've got mine or we got ours type of person. If you can't understand that, oh well.

Fortunately you're in the minority, now.

 

[AA89]

Why is it the union's job to get rid of slugs?

Slugs bring the quality and efficiency of our workgroup down, thereby decreasing our bargaining power.
I will ask a question. Why is it the unions job to PROTECT slugs?
It's a JOB. Not a country club.

We are only worth what we can negotiate

 

[rifbound]

Slugs bring the quality and efficiency of our workgroup down, thereby decreasing our bargaining power.
I will ask a question. Why is it the unions job to PROTECT slugs?
It's a JOB. Not a country club.

We are only worth what we can negotiate

Jim Little needs to protect the income of the International. That's why they protect the slugs of AA. I totally agree, s h i t can the slugs and we will be better off.

 

[TWU informer]

Jim Little needs to protect the income of the International. That's why they protect the slugs of AA. I totally agree, s h i t can the slugs and we will be better off.

The Union protects slugs on the Local level because we keep electing slugs via the good o'le boy system.

Demand debates and open Q&A of your candidates in front of voters and then participate in those events.

You will then see a change in your Local Union.

Slugs will protect Slugs

 

[enough already]

Slugs bring the quality and efficiency of our workgroup down, thereby decreasing our bargaining power.
I will ask a question. Why is it the unions job to PROTECT slugs?
It's a JOB. Not a country club.

We are only worth what we can negotiate

The compAAny has to try to fire them for being a slug first. I've never heard of an attempted termination for lack of production.