overhaul

[enough already]

Don't just piss and moan about my plan idiot.

Submit your own.

Umm, that would take intelligence and balls; a combination of which is apparantly lacking...

 

[TWU informer]

I did!

and, you call me an IGM idiot! You better look in the mirror and face the hard facts that AA is serious about farming out OH. AFW is just the start, and 2100 amt's in TUL should send a message to y'all. AA is extremely pissed and wants to send the unions a message about who's in charge! I hope AA is truly serious about competing because lots of families are going to be hurting the next 6 years.

That is exaclty why there needs to be a viable alternative plan submitted.
Is that over your head?

AA does not want to lose control of their overhaul maintenance.
They want to be able to do it competetively.
My plan provides that.

 

[MCI transplant]

Uh, I don't have the ability to submit any plan. I have been prevented from running for Local Union Office due to my involvement in AMFA Organizing.

<_< ------- Well, maybe Bob will pick up on some of your points! Although we haven't heard much from him since AA filed! Wounder if the International has put a gag order out on him?

 

[dfw gen]

Informer, your plan has merit but the biggest obstacles are selling out the next generation. And mostly the way you propose it, your history of posting clearly shows that when someone disagrees with you they are automatically "idiots". Again the situavtion requires thinking out of the box, but as in the example of the rejected ta how you refuse to realize that an overwhelming majority rejected it. It's pretty clear that you are the most intelligent person in this board. Did you ever ask yourself why you were not successful?

 

[TWU informer]

<_< ------- Well, maybe Bob will pick up on some of your points! Although we haven't heard much from him since AA filed! Wounder if the International has put a gag order out on him?

Maybe he will, or maybe one of the paid firms of management monitors of these forums will send them in.

Bob is on the Creditor sub-committee and cannot speak as openly as in the past.
Hopefully this Bankruptcy filing has opened his eyes to the need for a different strategy than he was presenting.

 

[TWU informer]

Informer, your plan has merit but the biggest obstacles are selling out the next generation. And mostly the way you propose it, your history of posting clearly shows that when someone disagrees with you they are automatically "idiots". Again the situavtion requires thinking out of the box, but as in the example of the rejected ta how you refuse to realize that an overwhelming majority rejected it. It's pretty clear that you are the most intelligent person in this board. Did you ever ask yourself why you were not successful?

We were all "sold out" in 1983 also, but for some strange reason, in spite of that sellout, we hired in and have stayed around for over 20 years. That is a strange sellout is it not?

I do realize the majority voted NO on the T/A. I just believe that they were not properly understanding that C11 filing was not a bluff, nor what that really meant if it did happen. Everyone knows the facts now. So, like others have convinced me, time to move on.

I am not even close to the most intelligent and success means different things to different people. To me, given my past, how I was raised, and the fact that I am still alive, and the great gift of forgiveness has given me a second chance in what really matters, I do feel successful, for someone like me. Do you?

 

[Slopoke]

I will not vote yes on an agreement that has a B-scale attached to it. I just won't do it!!

 

[rifbound]

Uh, I don't have the ability to submit any plan. I have been prevented from running for Local Union Office due to my involvement in AMFA Organizing.

Hell, send it to me and I'll submit it. I haven't been laid off yet. Why not, someone is at least putting an idea or two out there, whether or not it'll be turned in, considered or whatever else, at least informer has the foresight of the reality that is headed our way!

Several people on here ####, piss and moan about the TWU. There has been several chances to RID of the TWU but for some reason they're still around. And nobody should put the blame on the "but they added people to our classification" B.S.
Lets see, there is @ 9616 people in title 1. 1200 or so of them are the OSM, PW, and AC. How would those affect the vote to put another union in here? Someone was lying their a$$es off if they said "yeah, vote for AMFA or now AMP." It's OUR FAULT that the TWU is still here. US THE AMT'S. Tulsa has pretty much had the majority of the vote everytime for along time and i'm not saying it's all their fault. Don't get me wrong there are AMFA and AMP guys there too. But really, when I remember the AMFA drive pretty much everyone at the line stations were on board, a majority of AFW and a hand full in Tulsa, yet it still never amounted to a thing. Now there's AMP. So what's it gonna be...now that we're in BK are you gonna keep the TWU or VOTE to put a new union in here? TWU stays, that mean shut the F up and take it cause you asked for it! Or are you willing to accept change and go with someone else or non-union? It couldn't be anyworse. Half of us are going to be on the streets anyway, so those that remain, nut up and get someone else in here.

 

[TWU informer]

I will not vote yes on an agreement that has a B-scale attached to it. I just won't do it!!

Yet, you hired in under some form of a "B-Scale" or something similar, and you have been at AA for how long?
Common sense says the employee that hires in under a "sellout" as it has been called, and stays for years, either likes the conditions of employment, or has the battered wife syndrome and needs help.

 

[TWU informer]

Hell, send it to me and I'll submit it. I haven't been laid off yet. Why not, someone is at least putting an idea or two out there, whether or not it'll be turned in, considered or whatever else, at least informer has the foresight of the reality that is headed our way!

Feel free to use the copy/paste function. Edit the plan as you wish, and send to anyone and everyone that may help you out!!
And hurry!!

 

[strikeforce]

Don't just piss and moan about my plan idiot.

Submit your own.

You and others wouldn't like my plan!

If I owned AA......farm out all OH, B-checks, dayline maintenance, fleet service, plant maint., auto shop, facilities maint., taxi-crews, park crews. Use AMT's on RON and OTS. Use AFW & TUL to bring in $$$$ doing MRO work. All amt's convert to OSM's if you want a job. $23 max rate.

Reward Line stations amt's for clearing placards, doing more checks and reducing OTS time. In other words, more pay based on tangible results regarding dependability and reliabilty. I would even pay amt's more than WN....say $60-70/hr because less amt's would be needed. In addition, farm out all flying & terminal operations to 3rd party pilot, f/a & agents to staffing agencies. Throw out all unions.

Convert qualified tech chiefs to tech foreman....management position, and get rid of all crew chiefs, supervisors & managers. All work under direction of Tech foreman's including QA. TF reports to station manager. Eliminate all managing directors. Station manager reports to one VP Line. Tech foreman gets base pay $125K + incentives based on results. Amt's and TF provided with zero cost medical, 401K with 20% match. But, you better be ready to work.....or you're gone!!!!! Only the best of the best survive!

The bottom line here is our customers expect our planes to be ready at dawn, and even with in-house maint.....they're not!!! Something has to change!!!

Then again, I don't own AA!!!! lol

 

[Duke787]

You're right about the highlighted area. It's people that will work for FREE that have destroyed our profession. AA is setting the terms because the laws enacted by the same people standing side by side with John Hewitt on that podium asking you to pledge support to save jobs, are the ones that allowed AA to defer contributions to OUR pensions, and stripped you of your rights to fight back under the RLA.

I'm getting tired of listening to the union's non-sense.....I'm starting to believe the republicans that unions destroy jobs! Unions protect the slugs and the lazy.....period! Going non-union would definitely rid ourselves of the slugs, lazy, and sharpshooters. The non-union mechanics at Delta must obviously have a better working relationship with their management because I don't see Delta going out of their way to destroy their profession. Those mechanics have enjoyed more raises than you and I, and they've saved $600 a year in dues. Let the term sheets show AA managements discontent with labor.....destroying the TWU, APA, and APFA are in the works, but, in the process WE are the ones suffering. WE can't stop workers that decide to work for free, and if you believe that working for free will help AA, have at it! I'm not accepting those terms, and will vote down anything that deminishes my wages or benefits to support jobs in TUL. In the mean time, I'm looking to get out of this industry altogether....this industry has destroyed my childrens future!!

I couldn't agree more, between taking less money during our contracts because we have "OH" and the know nothing, loud mouth, vote no coalition who will accept nothing less then the 2001 contract. It's time to go non-union.

I think I might do better if I don't have people I don't vote for ( presidents from other locals ) negotiating my contract. Delta and FedEx are perfect examples of non-union shops with good pay and good working conditions.

 

[Duke787]

You and others wouldn't like my plan!

If I owned AA......farm out all OH, B-checks, dayline maintenance, fleet service, plant maint., auto shop, facilities maint., taxi-crews, park crews. Use AMT's on RON and OTS. Use AFW & TUL to bring in $$$$ doing MRO work. All amt's convert to OSM's if you want a job. $23 max rate.

Reward Line stations amt's for clearing placards, doing more checks and reducing OTS time. In other words, more pay based on tangible results regarding dependability and reliabilty. I would even pay amt's more than WN....say $60-70/hr because less amt's would be needed. In addition, farm out all flying & terminal operations to 3rd party pilot, f/a & agents to staffing agencies. Throw out all unions.

Convert qualified tech chiefs to tech foreman....management position, and get rid of all crew chiefs, supervisors & managers. All work under direction of Tech foreman's including QA. TF reports to station manager. Eliminate all managing directors. Station manager reports to one VP Line. Tech foreman gets base pay $125K + incentives based on results. Amt's and TF provided with zero cost medical, 401K with 20% match. But, you better be ready to work.....or you're gone!!!!! Only the best of the best survive!

The bottom line here is our customers expect our planes to be ready at dawn, and even with in-house maint.....they're not!!! Something has to change!!!

Then again, I don't own AA!!!! lol

I wouldn't go to that extreme, but I would have accountability. If a plane wasn't ready for the kickoff flight, there had better be an excellent reason. I certainly wouldn't have c/c's that the only reason they got the bid was because they had seniority, that would be an interview and past work performance position only.

I would do what AA is doing rite now, having OH vote down a contract because they have to work a 24/7 schedule, I would do away with OH too. I think OH over played their hand, and the company wasn't bluffing.

Instead of picking up a 6 day at TUL on sat morning those OH guys will be picking up 6 days on tues midnight shift in JFK. They should have been more flexible.

 

[TWU informer]

You and others wouldn't like my plan!

If I owned AA......farm out all OH, B-checks, dayline maintenance, fleet service, plant maint., auto shop, facilities maint., taxi-crews, park crews. Use AMT's on RON and OTS. Use AFW & TUL to bring in $$$$ doing MRO work. All amt's convert to OSM's if you want a job. $23 max rate.

Reward Line stations amt's for clearing placards, doing more checks and reducing OTS time. In other words, more pay based on tangible results regarding dependability and reliabilty. I would even pay amt's more than WN....say $60-70/hr because less amt's would be needed. In addition, farm out all flying & terminal operations to 3rd party pilot, f/a & agents to staffing agencies. Throw out all unions.

Convert qualified tech chiefs to tech foreman....management position, and get rid of all crew chiefs, supervisors & managers. All work under direction of Tech foreman's including QA. TF reports to station manager. Eliminate all managing directors. Station manager reports to one VP Line. Tech foreman gets base pay $125K + incentives based on results. Amt's and TF provided with zero cost medical, 401K with 20% match. But, you better be ready to work.....or you're gone!!!!! Only the best of the best survive!

The bottom line here is our customers expect our planes to be ready at dawn, and even with in-house maint.....they're not!!! Something has to change!!!

Then again, I don't own AA!!!! lol

WOW
And you voted NO on the T/A?
Amazing...."Brother"

I assume you have enough seniority to withstand those cuts, and as long as you are employed making $60-$70 with a bonus for doing your job, then you are good to go?

 

[Buck]

You and others wouldn't like my plan!

If I owned AA......farm out all OH, B-checks, dayline maintenance, fleet service, plant maint., auto shop, facilities maint., taxi-crews, park crews. Use AMT's on RON and OTS. Use AFW & TUL to bring in $$$$ doing MRO work. All amt's convert to OSM's if you want a job. $23 max rate.



Reward Line stations amt's for clearing placards, doing more checks and reducing OTS time. In other words, more pay based on tangible results regarding dependability and reliabilty. I would even pay amt's more than WN....say $60-70/hr because less amt's would be needed. In addition, farm out all flying & terminal operations to 3rd party pilot, f/a & agents to staffing agencies. Throw out all unions.

Convert qualified tech chiefs to tech foreman....management position, and get rid of all crew chiefs, supervisors & managers. All work under direction of Tech foreman's including QA. TF reports to station manager. Eliminate all managing directors. Station manager reports to one VP Line. Tech foreman gets base pay $125K + incentives based on results. Amt's and TF provided with zero cost medical, 401K with 20% match. But, you better be ready to work.....or you're gone!!!!! Only the best of the best survive!

The bottom line here is our customers expect our planes to be ready at dawn, and even with in-house maint.....they're not!!! Something has to change!!!

Then again, I don't own AA!!!! lol

But you hold a disdain for your profession and the A&P Mechanic.