New Vote o Video from Local Presidents

[Buster CRC]

This Lawyer namedrops all these airline unions that she has represented. Sounds like she has an BIG 0 ZERO ion the win column.

 

[AC Tynker]

This Lawyer namedrops all these airline unions that she has represented. Sounds like she has an BIG 0 ZERO ion the win column.

Maybe that should tell you something. My opinion is she probably knows the process and outcome a little bit better than the Aircraft Mechanic/Union President and the Welder that are arm chair lawyering the process. Almost anyone can read about working on an aircraft for months and seem they might know a little bit about it and be able to somewhat hold a conversation but in the end it is just that a conversation. I'm thinking history and a lawyer should be who and what one should put their true faith in. The two individuals that seem to have the most advice are going to be well protected for now by seniority and have not ever had to experienced layoff as most will. In my opinion if Sharon Levine was speaking anything but the truth trying to put an AA or a TWU biased spin on what she talked about the forum would be full of video clips, links and copied and pasted quotes from lawyers, reporters and officials from other unions. Before buying into a revolt or a hold out plan it might be wise to scour the net to try and find out the underling reason the Pilots Union and the FA Union are not rallying to stand and fight.

All the past talk of having to have a consensual agreement for the company to exit bankruptcy was finally cleared up because I could have sworn I seen that point argued repeatedly in past threads on here and I'm kind of curious as to who it was that was so sure that we had to have one.

All the FEAR crap being thrown around on here I think is being mislabeled to an extent. Yes people have a level of fear about losing everything they have or any of the many other examples just take your pick but at the end of the day it can also be labeled "Common Sense" and "Preservation". Like I said the rally leaders that scream the loudest on here are the ones that are well into the safe zones of seniority and will see some effects but not experience the ultimate product of all this ie unemployment . There are those that know they will be affected that are falling into line with the ones spouting all the numbers and contractual speculation. So much more can be said but there is only so much time to be able to type it.

 

[TWU informer]

Welder says VOTE NO!!!
A large group of machinist and other welders I know are voting NO also! Better send the Hewitt/Cirri vote no posse into the north end of the turbine building. Come prepared though! They are solid!

 

[AC Tynker]

Welder says VOTE NO!!!
A large group of machinist and other welders I know are voting NO also! Better send the Hewitt/Cirri vote no posse into the north end of the turbine building. Come prepared though! They are solid!

I liked it better when you had me on ignore. So you guys have an opinion and a vote that's democracy. I'm not sure you are going to see a posse as you termed it, You should see a meeting in the turbine building I think scheduled this week. From what I have seen they will tell you what they know and answer questions if you have them and if asked tell you how they are voting but as far as begging for your yes vote I have not seen that. That is the way the hangar 6 meeting went anyway.

 

[strikeforce]

Maybe that should tell you something. My opinion is she probably knows the process and outcome a little bit better than the Aircraft Mechanic/Union President and the Welder that are arm chair lawyering the process. Before buying into a revolt or a hold out plan it might be wise to scour the net to try and find out the underling reason the Pilots Union and the FA Union are not rallying to stand and fight.

It doesn't take meetings & video's from BK attorney's to tell you that you're screwed, and that BK is one-sided. The arm-chair quaterbacks are trying to save you from decimating the amt profession. All the vote NO supporters are telling you is....the company and union are just shuffling the deck around, and however you look at it, the company is getting the same $$$$ amounts from M&R. LBO 2 isn't better than LBO 1...the money was just shuffled around to make it look like YOU are getting a raise. If you voted down LBO1....why would you vote in LBO2....it's the same thing. Has the overall dollar amount changed that AA was seeking from M&R??? I highly doubt it.

The AA pilots will save their profession.....they got a much better deal than you did. The F/A's have larger nads than the amt's....maybe the amt's should be wearing the skirts.

 

[AC Tynker]

It doesn't take meetings & video's from BK attorney's to tell you that you're screwed, and that BK is one-sided. The arm-chair quaterbacks are trying to save you from decimating the amt profession. All the vote NO supporters are telling you is....the company and union are just shuffling the deck around, and however you look at it, the company is getting the same $$$$ amounts from M&R. LBO 2 isn't better than LBO 1...the money was just shuffled around to make it look like YOU are getting a raise. If you voted down LBO1....why would you vote in LBO2....it's the same thing. Has the overall dollar amount changed that AA was seeking from M&R??? I highly doubt it.

The AA pilots will save their profession.....they got a much better deal than you did. The F/A's have larger nads than the amt's....maybe the amt's should be wearing the skirts.

I agree and the video addressed it as have many posts. Bankruptcy favors the company so how anyone that is trying to save our profession thinks they are going to accomplish anything that even edges in our favor past what is already out there or trying to do it outside normal (and I use that term loosely) labor contract negotiations is beyond me, but that is my opinion as you have yours and hopefully we can agree to disagree. The chatter about the threat of outsource and then you read from the "armchair Industry Analyst" on here that the MRO capabilities are not out there and there is a shortage of A&Ps and then almost in then same keyboard session the same person types that if this TA goes through that the outsourcing will start and replace many jobs anyway. I am no expert but that seems to be a MAJOR CONTRADICTION. True AA pilots will save their profession for one reason they are a little harder to do without than we are. It takes more than 18-27 months to earn their qualifications as it did for us. The FAs can't just be outsourced either in my opinion. Maybe if there were 100 or so of them then yes I believe they would be on the same shaky ground because they could be replaced quickly and efficiently but there are a few more of them than that and in my opinion can effect an aircrafts location whether it be on the ground or in the air. Like I said just my opinion with a side of common sense.

 

[MCI transplant]

I agree and the video addressed it as have many posts. Bankruptcy favors the company so how anyone that is trying to save our profession thinks they are going to accomplish anything that even edges in our favor past what is already out there or trying to do it outside normal (and I use that term loosely) labor contract negotiations is beyond me, but that is my opinion as you have yours and hopefully we can agree to disagree. The chatter about the threat of outsource and then you read from the "armchair Industry Analyst" on here that the MRO capabilities are not out there and there is a shortage of A&Ps and then almost in then same keyboard session the same person types that if this TA goes through that the outsourcing will start and replace many jobs anyway. I am no expert but that seems to be a MAJOR CONTRADICTION. True AA pilots will save their profession for one reason they are a little harder to do without than we are. It takes more than 18-27 months to earn their qualifications as it did for us. The FAs can't just be outsourced either in my opinion. Maybe if there were 100 or so of them then yes I believe they would be on the same shaky ground because they could be replaced quickly and efficiently but there are a few more of them than that and in my opinion can effect an aircrafts location whether it be on the ground or in the air. Like I said just my opinion with a side of common sense.

"Commen sense"? What does that have to do with anything? Commen sense, in my book, tells my no company with "$5+ billion" cash money, in the bank, and can efford to finance it's own DIP, should not be able to go into BK!!! The system is broke!!! ------ But yet here you are!!!

 

[strikeforce]

I agree and the video addressed it as have many posts. Bankruptcy favors the company so how anyone that is trying to save our profession thinks they are going to accomplish anything that even edges in our favor past what is already out there or trying to do it outside normal (and I use that term loosely) labor contract negotiations is beyond me, but that is my opinion as you have yours and hopefully we can agree to disagree. The chatter about the threat of outsource and then you read from the "armchair Industry Analyst" on here that the MRO capabilities are not out there and there is a shortage of A&Ps and then almost in then same keyboard session the same person types that if this TA goes through that the outsourcing will start and replace many jobs anyway. I am no expert but that seems to be a MAJOR CONTRADICTION. True AA pilots will save their profession for one reason they are a little harder to do without than we are. It takes more than 18-27 months to earn their qualifications as it did for us. The FAs can't just be outsourced either in my opinion. Maybe if there were 100 or so of them then yes I believe they would be on the same shaky ground because they could be replaced quickly and efficiently but there are a few more of them than that and in my opinion can effect an aircrafts location whether it be on the ground or in the air. Like I said just my opinion with a side of common sense.

I agree to disagree.....the vote NO coalition is trying to keep the status quo by voting NO. And, as long as the CBA stays status quo....you continue to enjoy system protections. I guess we'll have to see if AA really wants a war with the aircraft mechanics. Although AA may not respect the amt's....I'm absolutely sure that AA doesn't want any disruptions to it's operations. I'm guessing that LBO 3, 4, & 5 will come before abrogation. The only way the judge will not grant abrogation is if he's absolutely sure that abrogation will result in a revolt by the M&R group. With ops running pretty smooth, abrogation is a certainty.......unless the obvious happens, right?? Believe it or not....you control your own destiny. Vote yes, and screw yourself...or vote NO, do your job accordingly, and maybe AA will be forced to negotiate. You get my drift?

 

[MCI transplant]

This Lawyer namedrops all these airline unions that she has represented. Sounds like she has an BIG 0 ZERO ion the win column.

If you listen to her, she doesn't really say which side of the table she sat on with those other Airlines!----- And by the way, I hate to say it, but, she looks like hell!!!

 

[700UW]

Dont you all realize there is no winner on labor in Chapter 11?

The laws are against labor and all in favor of the creditors and management.

 

[High Speed Steel]

Their counter video attempt

I would like to thank her for this video presentation explaining the facts. I showed it to several people today and they said all should see this. I especially liked her reference to the 9 point test for contract rejection for the judge to consider. See those points below and see if you can say any of those have not been met....


Nine Point Test for Contract Rejection
The Bankruptcy Courts have generally read Sec. 1113 to set forth nine (9) requirements which
must be met for the court to approve rejection of a collective bargaining agreement. As stated in
the lead case of In re American Provision Co., 44 B.R. 907, 909 (Bk.D.Minn 1984), those nine
requirements are as follows:
“1. The debtor in possession must make a proposal to the Union to modify the collective
bargaining agreement.
2. The proposal must be based on the most complete and reliable information available
at the time of the proposal.
3. The proposed modifications must be necessary to permit the reorganization of the
debtor.
4. The proposed modifications must assure that all creditors, the debtor and all of the
affected parties are treated fairly and equitably.
5. The debtor must provide to the Union such relevant information as is necessary to
evaluate the proposal.
6. Between the time of the making of the proposal and the time of the hearing on
approval of the rejection of the existing collective bargaining agreement, the debtor
must meet at reasonable times with the Union.
7. At the meetings the debtor must confer in good faith in attempting to reach mutually
satisfactory modifications of the collective bargaining agreement.
8. The Union must have refused to accept the proposal without good cause.
9. The balance of the equities must clearly favor rejection of the collective bargaining
agreement.”
Id. at 909.

 

[whatajoke]

At least we know she didnt get where she is by her looks.

 

[BigMac]

I only clicked on the video cause I thought it was Ronnie James Dio. All kidding aside I posted it cause I found it interesting hearing from an attorneys pov. Made my NO vote that much more easy.

 

[Gman10]

[sub]I thought it was Steve Vai....I was waiting for the guitar solo.[/sub]

 

[High Speed Steel]

At least we know she didnt get where she is by her looks.

Instead of being rude and distasteful about a person who is someone's daughter and possibly some childs mother why don't you try and understand the points of her message and see if you can discount what she has said....