MEC CODE-A-PHONE UPDATE - May 19, 2007

[CV580ETOPS]

A noble sentiment, that "what I brought to the merger is all I should expect from the merger". Unfortunately, shared by all too few. Most seem to approach mergers caring only about what they can get out of it at someone else's expense....

Jim

Bet you're glad you're retired.

 

[donttouchthebeauty]

Dumb and a waste of time.

You seem to spend about 70% of your daily time on here babbling back and forth, trying to wet down the fire that is blazing at the company in regards to the pilots award, and that stems from fear from what "could" "might" and "probably will" happen.. The award will not change but MANY MANY other things can and you are very afraid of that - otherwise you would not be on here all day saying "its not going to work" "dont waste your time" etc etc., if you knoew that was the case you wouldn't be on here trying to flood the boards with "just accept it" posts...

 

[BoeingBoy]

you wouldn't be on here trying to flood the boards with "just accept it" posts...

As opposed to those grasping at straws and thus flooding the boards with "you better do what we want or else" posts.....

Jim

 

[N905TW]

WOW! Your former TWA and would make a statement like that? Astonishing and sounds like something that would come from an AA employee.

Exactly which statement are you referring to? The fact that as a furloughee I would not expect to leap ahead of active employees? Or is it the statement that I realize that what I brought to the merger is exactly where I should be after the merger?

Don't let your emotions carry you away.

 

[beachboy]

No emotions as this has no immediate effect on me. I am just calling your statement ironic. The day AA tries to assimilate me I will quit on the spot. They are infectious in a nasty way ya know.
Cheers

 

[Mr Furlough]

With all due respect, seniority means nothing if you do not bring a JOB to the table.

I was furloughed in the past, so I feel your pain, and do not wish this post to be a slam to you or anyone else who has had to endure a furlough. I do understand just how rough that is. In my case, I picked myself up and started over back at my old commuter, once again earning food stamp type F/O wages, before coming out west to AWA.

To be realistic and put this in perspective, if AA were to merge with CO/UA/DL/AS etc tomorrow, where would I expect to be on the combined list based on my AA "seniority" number? I am quite certain that I would be below ALL WORKING PILOTS, and would expect nothing more. I am not currently flying for AA, so why would I expect to be on a list above someone who currently does have a job?

Mr. N905TW,

But I did bring a job to the table. As well as attrition. As did thousands of my fellow employees. What makes that anyone elses to have?

 

[Tim Nelson]

There in is where the EAST has its power 700UW. The language in the transition agreement prevents the use of a single seniority list, until a joint contract has been ratified. Everything points that the cost of such an agreement or the items the EAST would now want as a part of agreeing to one making it not palatable to the west negotiators and pretty much make obtaining it DOA. In the meanwhile, both parties are administrated to separately under their respective agreements with some items(new flying, etc.) controlled by the transition agreement, and this looks like it could be a very long time.

Bingo!!! Even though it is hard to question 700's "Top Notch" legal integrity because, after all, he took leadership 101 and a few other courses at a school that actually has a few of its courses recognized for real college credit at various community colleges in the area.

Maybe that is why the I'll Ask Management Union doesn't provide attorneys in some of its arbitration cases, because they have trained professional law students who used to be cleaners to handle the cases.

regards

 

[USA320Pilot]

Today in a Chairman's message to the pilots, Jack Stephan said, "Your solidarity during this stressful time has been overwhelming."

Jack is dead-on accurate in his statement and as I have said over-and-over, I believe the Nicolau Award will likely not be implemented for maybe as long as another decade and there will not be a joint pilot contract for many, many years, unless there is a negotiated seniority settlement, which could be fences.

Furthermore, I have heard from an ALPA EVP that th EC is discussing a settlement and I was asked about a specific fence timeframe.

Will it happen? I do not know, but it apparently is being discussed, which could be a good sign and possibly save ALPA on this and maybe the AWA property.

Regards,

USA320Pilot

 

[PITbull]

Waste of time, you are all being told what you want to hear.

Bottom line is binding arbitration is BINDING, there is nothing you can do to change that. The award will be implimented and that is all.

Changing unions won't change it.

Binding arbitration is precedent setting.

700,

I think the East pilots have an argument that must be made, regardless, the arb. ruling is in conflict with the ALPA merger policy.

I understand that the ruling is enforcable, but through a subsequent negotiations, provisions can and do change.

Foremost, any merger tentative must be ratified by all the pilots, both East and West....that's where the East has control over whether the company will merge the operation...OR not. At this juncture, the East pilots are better off not ratifiying...ever.

 

[PITbull]

Although 700UW's general legal knowledge may be rudimentary, he has been generally correct about the binding nature of an arbitration such as this one.

Parties are free to agree (beforehand) that an arbitration decision will not be binding and will be appealable. But here the parties (note, not ALPA, but THE PARTIES, i.e., the East and West MEC's, if I understand the history correctly) agreed to BINDING arbitration.

ALPA as a body above the East and West MECs doesn't have much say in a case like this, and it seems as though its own constitution and bylaws legally obligate it to defend the arbitration decision should it be challenged.

Bear,

No doubt, the ruling is binding, however, outside of this ruling, there is a merger negotiations at hand. And guess what? East pilots will have the upper hand on whether they will ratify any tentative merger agreement.

Being that this ruling has a direct financial effect on about 1700 East pilots (West having about 1500 total active pilots) there is nothing to compell the East to ratify and merge the operation whereby the ruling may never go into effect.

If there was not a merger negotiations in progress, then I would agree that the ruling would definitely go into effect. But, this is not the case in this instance.

 

[BoeingBoy]

At this juncture, the East pilots are better off not ratifiying...ever.

PITbull,

I'm not sure that I'd stake my career on that if I were an East pilot, although that's what they are being led to believe.

Jim

 

[luvthe9]

This is MEC Chairman Jack Stephan with a Chairman's message to the pilots for Saturday, May 19th.



This past week Communications and other union volunteers have worked in supporting the grassroots efforts of our pilots in response to the inequities of the Nicolau award. The Pilot to Pilot initiative along with the call center have been working in assisting the pilots in all their efforts. The MEC has also convened twice this past week through conference call meetings. We have received reports from the Merger Committee on the presentation we will provide to the Executive Council this Monday.



Many of you have expressed a strong desire to attend our presentation to the Council. We have made arrangements to provide transportation to and from the ALPA Herndon Office. Council 41 is also providing round trip bus transportation from PHL to Herndon that day. The MEC will be in session on Monday morning at 10:00 a.m. at the ALPA Herndon office. We will recess for the presentation then reconvene providing you with a chance to ask questions of the Merger Committee as well as members of the MEC. We have made arrangements with the National Officers to have the presentation broadcasted to a larger room in Herndon that can accommodate more pilots. We have also asked that additional personnel be available to assist in checking pilots into the building. After the Merger Committee has made their presentation, we will post that information on the pilots only website.



It is important that you know that your MEC is singularly focused on righting the wrong of the Nicolau award. We fully understand the magnitude of the career destruction it would bring. I along with your representatives have spent considerable time communicating our issues to the Executive Council members. I tell them that this is not just a matter of the AAA pilots not getting what we wanted. This is a case of a total disregard of many tenets of our Merger Policy. I also remind them that it is their responsibility to uphold our policies. Many of you have also contacted members of the council to state the same. Among other flagrant irregularities in the award, you have helped me send the message that uninterrupted years of union service cannot be dismissed, regardless of an airline’s financial condition.



Your solidarity during this stressful time has been overwhelming. I have told the EC to expect many of our pilots to be there on Monday. We have been through some difficult times together, but the Nicolau award is the biggest slap in the face. I look forward to seeing many of you in Herndon on Monday to help deliver the message to Captain Prater and the Executive Council that if they are serious about taking this union back, they cannot leave any pilot behind. Your presence is crucial in delivering that message.



Continue to look out for each other out there. And as always, fly safe and thanks for listening.

 

[PITbull]

PITbull,

I'm not sure that I'd stake my career on that if I were an East pilot, although that's what they are being led to believe.

Jim

You know all too well that when a contact becomes amendable, it takes 3-5 years to negotiate and ratify. With the East, may take much longer.

I would bet my career that there will be a serious negotiations regarding this ruling if the company needs a ratification to merge operations. That's the East's trump card and leverage to argue this ruling's non-implementation. I know that if I were and East pilot I would be "done" with giving more concessions through such an award, and would utilize my vote on NOT agreeing to any ratification.

 

[BoeingBoy]

if the company needs a ratification. That's the East's trump card.

As you yourself said - if the company needs ratification. There are lots of possible futures that can result from the East's "trump card".

At best, for the East pilots, future growth goes to them. They advance, make Captain, the furloughees all come back, life is swell.

At the other end, East withers on the vine over 5-10 years as far as the pilot's are concerned. New airplanes, growth, advancement - all go to the West pilots while the East pilots attrit themselves out of existence.

Which course the future takes is in Doug Parker and Jerry Glass' hands. The East pilots may think they hold the trump cards, but they're hoping to draw to an inside royal straight flush and thereby win all the chips. Problem is, Parker owns the house and Glass is the dealer. As you well know, Glass is perfectly willing to deal from the bottom of the deck to get the outcome he wants.

Jim

 

[700UW]

Come on preacher man you can do better than that.

The IAM does bring attornies to the major arbitration cases.

Bob Bush and is parnter Ira Gottlieb help prepare the Airbus, the 401k and HMO arbitrations and were present.

And funny thing is I never seen the classification cleaner in the IAM/US M&R CBA, can you show me where it is?

And I was Stock Clerk when I left US.

And like I said before and you keep choosing to ignore and refute what does someone's job classification have to do with their ability to educate themselves and represent people?

And by the way the classes at Placid Harbor are accredited by the a National College Association and now are part of a four year degree program that numerous reps have obtained their degrees now.

Hate to burst your bubble but they are University classes, not a Community College class.

Hey by the way, Don't Let The Facts Get In Your Way!

But hey we all know what you are about a sore loser as you tried three times to start your own union and failed, at US and AA when you tried to raid.

We know it is all about you Timmy. Post anything on the Big Picture to get yourself in trouble again?