Local 514 Officers - Make Fools of Themselves at AFW
- Thread starter RV4
- Start date
Here CIO. Read how NWA unions will give NO CONSESSIONS for the rest of the year.
http://biz.yahoo.com/djus/030716/1014000994_1.html
twu SUCKS!
http://biz.yahoo.com/djus/030716/1014000994_1.html
twu SUCKS!
----------------
On 7/22/2003 5:29:01 AM RV4 wrote:
----------------
That's a good question. I can't say that I would have but it wasn't very productive in the "point" you were trying to make. What on earth would possess anyone to use The Wizard of Oz when trying to be taken seriously. Go ahead respond. . .explain to me who is the wizard and who is from Oz etc, etc, etc! Blah, blah blah. You do need to do a bit better than that RV4! Got that transcript yet? On 7/22/2003 5:29:01 AM RV4 wrote:
----------------
On 7/22/2003 12:29:40 AM twuer wrote:
Toto?!? Oh boy! Or should I say "oh my!" That's way too easy!! You set yourself up again RV4. But, I'll be nice this time. Ruff ruff!!
Just a word of advice. . .don't use sound bites from old movies to try to prove a point. It doesn't work!! Just makes you look like you have way too much time on your hands!
----------------
Why then have you responded to the soundbite in such a way? If it truly wasn't working, would you have responded at all?On 7/22/2003 12:29:40 AM twuer wrote:
Toto?!? Oh boy! Or should I say "oh my!" That's way too easy!! You set yourself up again RV4. But, I'll be nice this time. Ruff ruff!!
Just a word of advice. . .don't use sound bites from old movies to try to prove a point. It doesn't work!! Just makes you look like you have way too much time on your hands!
----------------
----------------
Oh, just a simple question for you. . .why didn't Dan take the stand in his own defense? You are putting a really good spin on what took place and the testimony that was given. Les did attend the meeting that day. The same one Dan (and you) did, just not at the same time. How hard is that to understand??? Duh!! You guys had meetings all day long. Not a big turnout from what I understand, but that's another story. The issue (as I see it) is that Dan holds an elected postion with the TWU and is organizing and attending AMFA meetings. Just admit it already!! Now, if the shoe was on the other foot, you guys would probably send out a possee to pick up the AMFA guy who was advocating for the TWU, ready with the noose to hang the poor fellow. Tell me if I'm at all close. If anything, look at it ethically (if you are capable of doing so). I don't care what union you represent, you CAN'T hold an elected position then propogate for another. THAT'S WRONG!!!!!!!!!! I don't know Dan personally so I am not here to knock him but what he is doing is just not right. I personally didn't vote for him either but what about those who did. They voted him as an officer for the TWU not AMFA. He should resign his position. Or does he like the extra income he gets from the union (the one he claims to hate)?? It's not at all hard to figure out RV4. There was a legitmate reason for the trial in the first place. Wells didn't ask to be bumped to AFW. You can't knock a man for doing what he thinks is in the best interest of his union and its' members. Isn't that what you claim AMFA is all about? Taking care of the members. There are a lot of people who wish they had the balls to do what he did. On both sides.
----------------
On 7/22/2003 11:38:07 PM RUM@AA wrote:
NWA limit is 35% of labor dollars. TWU at AA is 49.9%.
AMFA now represents more mechanic and related than the TWU.
NWA has been sending 747 and DC10 heavy maint to Singapore for 8 years. AMFA has been there for 4.
What rights are you talking about? The right to vote on consessions or the right of Jim Little and Sonny the bus driver to DICTATE consessions?
Don''t sign a card and give away your pay and benifits!
The TWU of old let layoffs happen in 72, 81, 93 and 100% of those laid off got called back to the high wages they left behind. The tw-useless of today screwed us all forever. We will NEVER get back what they gave away and the people that hit the street, even if they ever come back will come back to lower wages and fewer benifits. CAN YOU DENY ANY OF THAT CIO? NO.
Maybe I drank Kool-aid, but you''ve been drinking ipicak syrup. Everything you spew is pure vomit.
If you think your saving unionism, think again.
For every one NWA mech you dredge up with an AMFA horror story, I can find 10 with no love for the TWU.
TWU Solidarity is non-existant. Seen the card count lately?
----------------
Stop the press!! You mean to tell me that an OSM (who probably has a mortgage and 2 1/2 kids) got to keep his job and you didn''t get a week of vacation??? What a tragedy!! The typical "in it for me" AMFA attitude. That''s a good example of watching out for your union brothers and sisters. Good point RUM! Give me a break. . .On 7/22/2003 11:38:07 PM RUM@AA wrote:
----------------
On 7/22/2003 7:35:40 PM Checking it Out wrote:
We AMFA guys believe the union''s job is to protect wages and benifits. It''s called unionism.
RUM@AA I think you have been drinking some of your Kool-aid again.
If you do not have members who is amfa representing? with unlimited farmout language at 5 or 6 airlines now amfa does not contest this issue they just let it happen. That is when you have Real Estate agents fighting for your rights. make a commission with nothing in return?
Sign a Card and give your Job away! What a track record to be proud of?
TWU SOLIDARITY!
----------------
Ok. Name the "5 or 6" airlines with "unlimited farmout language".On 7/22/2003 7:35:40 PM Checking it Out wrote:
We AMFA guys believe the union''s job is to protect wages and benifits. It''s called unionism.
RUM@AA I think you have been drinking some of your Kool-aid again.
If you do not have members who is amfa representing? with unlimited farmout language at 5 or 6 airlines now amfa does not contest this issue they just let it happen. That is when you have Real Estate agents fighting for your rights. make a commission with nothing in return?
Sign a Card and give your Job away! What a track record to be proud of?
TWU SOLIDARITY!
----------------
NWA limit is 35% of labor dollars. TWU at AA is 49.9%.
AMFA now represents more mechanic and related than the TWU.
NWA has been sending 747 and DC10 heavy maint to Singapore for 8 years. AMFA has been there for 4.
What rights are you talking about? The right to vote on consessions or the right of Jim Little and Sonny the bus driver to DICTATE consessions?
Don''t sign a card and give away your pay and benifits!
The TWU of old let layoffs happen in 72, 81, 93 and 100% of those laid off got called back to the high wages they left behind. The tw-useless of today screwed us all forever. We will NEVER get back what they gave away and the people that hit the street, even if they ever come back will come back to lower wages and fewer benifits. CAN YOU DENY ANY OF THAT CIO? NO.
Maybe I drank Kool-aid, but you''ve been drinking ipicak syrup. Everything you spew is pure vomit.
If you think your saving unionism, think again.
For every one NWA mech you dredge up with an AMFA horror story, I can find 10 with no love for the TWU.
TWU Solidarity is non-existant. Seen the card count lately?
----------------
- Joined
- Aug 20, 2002
- Messages
- 7,319
- Reaction score
- 1,555
twer said:
Stop the press!! You mean to tell me that an OSM (who probably has a mortgage and 2 1/2 kids) got to keep his job and you didn''t get a week of vacation??? What a tragedy!! The typical "in it for me" AMFA attitude. That''s a good example of watching out for your union brothers and sisters. Good point RUM! Give me a break. . .
So you are suggesting that items such as vacation that labor has fought for in negotiated contracts are not worth the effort? But the TWU''s record of wage give backs since the 1983 B-scale has had no bearing on any members mortgage or there ability to improve themselves. Every contract I have been through has had one thing in mind, wheres my retirement. Screw those younger employees and those that are not employees yet. That is the way of the TWU. Speaking for watching out for union brothers and sisters, twuer, why don''t you spin your crap to the mechanic that started with a 17.5% wage cut and ended with a 38% cut when you advocated that their license pay be removed. The TWU speaks of seniority then throws it out. The TWU speaks of unionism and cuts the mechanics wages and benefits more than the other work groups. Your form of unionism is hypocritical.
Stop the press!! You mean to tell me that an OSM (who probably has a mortgage and 2 1/2 kids) got to keep his job and you didn''t get a week of vacation??? What a tragedy!! The typical "in it for me" AMFA attitude. That''s a good example of watching out for your union brothers and sisters. Good point RUM! Give me a break. . .
So you are suggesting that items such as vacation that labor has fought for in negotiated contracts are not worth the effort? But the TWU''s record of wage give backs since the 1983 B-scale has had no bearing on any members mortgage or there ability to improve themselves. Every contract I have been through has had one thing in mind, wheres my retirement. Screw those younger employees and those that are not employees yet. That is the way of the TWU. Speaking for watching out for union brothers and sisters, twuer, why don''t you spin your crap to the mechanic that started with a 17.5% wage cut and ended with a 38% cut when you advocated that their license pay be removed. The TWU speaks of seniority then throws it out. The TWU speaks of unionism and cuts the mechanics wages and benefits more than the other work groups. Your form of unionism is hypocritical.
----------------
On 7/23/2003 12:25:51 AM twuer wrote:
Stop the press!! You mean to tell me that an OSM (who probably has a mortgage and 2 1/2 kids) got to keep his job and you didn''t get a week of vacation??? What a tragedy!! The typical "in it for me" AMFA attitude. That''s a good example of watching out for your union brothers and sisters. Good point RUM! Give me a break. . .
----------------
twuer,On 7/23/2003 12:25:51 AM twuer wrote:
Stop the press!! You mean to tell me that an OSM (who probably has a mortgage and 2 1/2 kids) got to keep his job and you didn''t get a week of vacation??? What a tragedy!! The typical "in it for me" AMFA attitude. That''s a good example of watching out for your union brothers and sisters. Good point RUM! Give me a break. . .
----------------
How low of pay and benefit package are you willing to work for to save that man and his mortgage? Truth is, the OSM''s are paid so little thanks to the TWU, that they could easily replace their income while on layoff.
Be sure and tell the company that your priority is to save jobs and you fear layoffs, I am sure that when AA files BK anyway, the corporate greeders will like to know you are not currently at your "concessions for jobs" limit. Could you please inform everyone else what that limit of yours is, because some have signed mortgages based on AMFA at NWA pay and might not be able to keep that house, once you are finished saving everyone a job.
- Joined
- Aug 20, 2002
- Messages
- 7,319
- Reaction score
- 1,555
----------------
On 7/22/2003 10:52:02 PM Kevin Hammack wrote:
Buck,
You are so very witty and quick to spin! I welcome all the crafts that the NMB decides to align with the “craft and classâ€. Not including them is not my M.O., it’s AMFA’S! The question was posed to Dave since he organizes for an association who’s national director has professed in the past to advance the AMT profession. It’s clear that your AMFA has a problem with workers who have been assigned to our “craft and classâ€.
AMFA National Director removed the only Cleaner from the Northwest Airlines negotiating committee after she complained about what was being negotiated for the Cleaner classification. The Cleaner Representative, Kathy Lulek, was forced to obtain a Temporary Restraining Order to remain on the negotiating committee.
----------------
If you welcome all crafts that the NMB chooses to align with the “craft and classâ€, then you are retracting your statement made on this board. Thank You. By stating that you are retracting your statement, prevents me from getting in trouble with the moderator, because of my statement.On 7/22/2003 10:52:02 PM Kevin Hammack wrote:
Buck,
You are so very witty and quick to spin! I welcome all the crafts that the NMB decides to align with the “craft and classâ€. Not including them is not my M.O., it’s AMFA’S! The question was posed to Dave since he organizes for an association who’s national director has professed in the past to advance the AMT profession. It’s clear that your AMFA has a problem with workers who have been assigned to our “craft and classâ€.
AMFA National Director removed the only Cleaner from the Northwest Airlines negotiating committee after she complained about what was being negotiated for the Cleaner classification. The Cleaner Representative, Kathy Lulek, was forced to obtain a Temporary Restraining Order to remain on the negotiating committee.
----------------
Be careful because youe quoted post will either make you a liar or show that you despise welders, machinists etc...
I am not interested in what happened to this lady. I am interested in your position concerning those you are representing (or the failure thereof) at American Airlines.
James T. Kirk
Senior
- Joined
- Apr 9, 2003
- Messages
- 301
- Reaction score
- 0
----------------
On 7/22/2003 10:02:22 PM RV4 wrote:
From the-mechanic.com
http://the-mechanic.com/mainbb.html
Received: 07/22/03 02:41:34 EDT
Name: Dan Cunningham
E-Mail:
Employer: AA
Location: AFW
Message:
----------------
Received: 07/22/03 02:41:34 EDTOn 7/22/2003 10:02:22 PM RV4 wrote:
From the-mechanic.com
http://the-mechanic.com/mainbb.html
Received: 07/22/03 02:41:34 EDT
Name: Dan Cunningham
E-Mail:
Employer: AA
Location: AFW
Message:
To Whom it May Concern:
I would like to thank all the folks that took the time out of their Saturday, July 19, 2003 to come witness Justice being served at AFW Local 567. Our bretheren from the north (Tulsa) seem somewhat confused about the events of the day, but I''m sure someday soon, perhaps within 4 months, they''ll better understand reality. I take exception at some of the comments I''ve read here and at usaviation.com, but I consider the sources.
I have given the twu every chance to prove their worth as the bargaining agent for Mechanic & Related workers at AA and they have failed miserably. Instead, the twu international coaches punks, drunks and cowards to do their dirty work for them by assailing dues paying reps that are intent on defending the membership, both from the company and their own union.
Character assassinations do not bother me in the least for I know the character of the cowards involved. To Kevin Hammack I say; "I am not required to prove my guilt for I did not charge myself. Simple thought, Kevin, for an obviously simple mind. If you cannot understand that concept you''ll be a wanna believer/I got miner like your ole buddy, Kirk (in it for me) Wells for eternity. Perhaps Mein Kampf meant more to you than it did for me, Kevin.
I pity anyone that has ever had Matt Lorenzi represent them in a serious issue. God help them, because Matt could not/cannot/will not, ever! I feel badly that K. Hammack indicates that I have lied about anything regarding my efforts in gaining true, just, democratic representation! I did not avoid calling myself to the stand to refute anything for I did not need to. Mr. Wells was all I thought he was intellectually! I knew I would be vindicated. To say Mr. Lorenzi could not "object" to questioning is also a misstatement, for I was the first to be denied the right to object by the Trial Committee.
The Trial Committee failed to pay homage to our great Arbitor and conducted a legitimate proceeding. Mr. Lorenzi failed the anti Dan Tulsa troupe by calling a seemingly blind, deaf, and dumb buffoon to the stand after his "Star" witness, the guy with no corroborating testimony or evidence, Mr. Kirk Wells. I wish now to thank Les Howard for turning the tide for the defense. Les, you made Gary''s and my day with your blatherings. I knew you seemed confused when I was in Tulsa, but I thought it was just a show. I know better now, dude! How do you represent anyone as an e-board member? I pity them, too! The Trial Committee did not refuse to allow Lorenzi to call other witnesses, he was just too confused by then to know what to do!
Mr. Lorenzi blew the case for the prosecution. I hope he bought ya''ll dinner or some booze to forget the day quicker. Perhaps he already had enough for the whole gang of ya in his supply locker in the back of the suburban🙂 Glad to hear you guys from Tulsa were able to remember the way back to Tulsa, or did you have to use an onboard Mapsco to see you through the confusion of I-35 to the turnpike. I know Les Howard didn''t drive. Do you car pool to work, Les?, on the short bus?
Thanks for the Memories Matt, Kirk Wells, Kevin Hammack, Les Howard and the supporting cast. Next time you Tulsa twu believers are in town stop by and say hi, we at Local 567 will role out the Welcome Matt for you anytime.
Its all about the Love, and don''t forget,
"Tough Love is Better than No Love at All!"
God Bless all those represented by the twu, for they will need it!!
Concensual Agreement 2003
twu Run by a person found guilty of Violating Workers Rights! Now that says Something doesn''t it!
I would like to thank all the folks that took the time out of their Saturday, July 19, 2003 to come witness Justice being served at AFW Local 567. Our bretheren from the north (Tulsa) seem somewhat confused about the events of the day, but I''m sure someday soon, perhaps within 4 months, they''ll better understand reality. I take exception at some of the comments I''ve read here and at usaviation.com, but I consider the sources.
I have given the twu every chance to prove their worth as the bargaining agent for Mechanic & Related workers at AA and they have failed miserably. Instead, the twu international coaches punks, drunks and cowards to do their dirty work for them by assailing dues paying reps that are intent on defending the membership, both from the company and their own union.
Character assassinations do not bother me in the least for I know the character of the cowards involved. To Kevin Hammack I say; "I am not required to prove my guilt for I did not charge myself. Simple thought, Kevin, for an obviously simple mind. If you cannot understand that concept you''ll be a wanna believer/I got miner like your ole buddy, Kirk (in it for me) Wells for eternity. Perhaps Mein Kampf meant more to you than it did for me, Kevin.
I pity anyone that has ever had Matt Lorenzi represent them in a serious issue. God help them, because Matt could not/cannot/will not, ever! I feel badly that K. Hammack indicates that I have lied about anything regarding my efforts in gaining true, just, democratic representation! I did not avoid calling myself to the stand to refute anything for I did not need to. Mr. Wells was all I thought he was intellectually! I knew I would be vindicated. To say Mr. Lorenzi could not "object" to questioning is also a misstatement, for I was the first to be denied the right to object by the Trial Committee.
The Trial Committee failed to pay homage to our great Arbitor and conducted a legitimate proceeding. Mr. Lorenzi failed the anti Dan Tulsa troupe by calling a seemingly blind, deaf, and dumb buffoon to the stand after his "Star" witness, the guy with no corroborating testimony or evidence, Mr. Kirk Wells. I wish now to thank Les Howard for turning the tide for the defense. Les, you made Gary''s and my day with your blatherings. I knew you seemed confused when I was in Tulsa, but I thought it was just a show. I know better now, dude! How do you represent anyone as an e-board member? I pity them, too! The Trial Committee did not refuse to allow Lorenzi to call other witnesses, he was just too confused by then to know what to do!
Mr. Lorenzi blew the case for the prosecution. I hope he bought ya''ll dinner or some booze to forget the day quicker. Perhaps he already had enough for the whole gang of ya in his supply locker in the back of the suburban🙂 Glad to hear you guys from Tulsa were able to remember the way back to Tulsa, or did you have to use an onboard Mapsco to see you through the confusion of I-35 to the turnpike. I know Les Howard didn''t drive. Do you car pool to work, Les?, on the short bus?
Thanks for the Memories Matt, Kirk Wells, Kevin Hammack, Les Howard and the supporting cast. Next time you Tulsa twu believers are in town stop by and say hi, we at Local 567 will role out the Welcome Matt for you anytime.
Its all about the Love, and don''t forget,
"Tough Love is Better than No Love at All!"
God Bless all those represented by the twu, for they will need it!!
Concensual Agreement 2003
twu Run by a person found guilty of Violating Workers Rights! Now that says Something doesn''t it!
----------------
Name: Dan Cunningham
E-Mail: mailto:
Employer: AA
Location: AFW
Message:
To Whom it May Concern:
I would like to thank all the folks that took the time out of their Saturday, July 19, 2003 to come witness Justice being served at AFW Local 567. Our bretheren from the north (Tulsa) seem somewhat confused about the events of the day, but I''m sure someday soon, perhaps within 4 months, they''ll better understand reality. I take exception at some of the comments I''ve read here and at usaviation.com, but I consider the sources.
I have given the twu every chance to prove their worth as the bargaining agent for Mechanic & Related workers at AA and they have failed miserably. Instead, the twu international coaches punks, drunks and cowards to do their dirty work for them by assailing dues paying reps that are intent on defending the membership, both from the company and their own union.
Character assassinations do not bother me in the least for I know the character of the cowards involved. To Kevin Hammack I say; "I am not required to prove my guilt for I did not charge myself. Simple thought, Kevin, for an obviously simple mind. If you cannot understand that concept you''ll be a wanna believer/I got miner like your ole buddy, Kirk (in it for me) Wells for eternity. Perhaps Mein Kampf meant more to you than it did for me, Kevin.
I pity anyone that has ever had Matt Lorenzi represent them in a serious issue. God help them, because Matt could not/cannot/will not, ever! I feel badly that K. Hammack indicates that I have lied about anything regarding my efforts in gaining true, just, democratic representation! I did not avoid calling myself to the stand to refute anything for I did not need to. Mr. Wells was all I thought he was intellectually! I knew I would be vindicated. To say Mr. Lorenzi could not "object" to questioning is also a misstatement, for I was the first to be denied the right to object by the Trial Committee.
The Trial Committee failed to pay homage to our great Arbitor and conducted a legitimate proceeding. Mr. Lorenzi failed the anti Dan Tulsa troupe by calling a seemingly blind, deaf, and dumb buffoon to the stand after his "Star" witness, the guy with no corroborating testimony or evidence, Mr. Kirk Wells. I wish now to thank Les Howard for turning the tide for the defense. Les, you made Gary''s and my day with your blatherings. I knew you seemed confused when I was in Tulsa, but I thought it was just a show. I know better now, dude! How do you represent anyone as an e-board member? I pity them, too! The Trial Committee did not refuse to allow Lorenzi to call other witnesses, he was just too confused by then to know what to do!
Mr. Lorenzi blew the case for the prosecution. I hope he bought ya''ll dinner or some booze to forget the day quicker. Perhaps he already had enough for the whole gang of ya in his supply locker in the back of the suburban🙂 Glad to hear you guys from Tulsa were able to remember the way back to Tulsa, or did you have to use an onboard Mapsco to see you through the confusion of I-35 to the turnpike. I know Les Howard didn''t drive. Do you car pool to work, Les?, on the short bus?
Thanks for the Memories Matt, Kirk Wells, Kevin Hammack, Les Howard and the supporting cast. Next time you Tulsa twu believers are in town stop by and say hi, we at Local 567 will role out the Welcome Matt for you anytime.
Its all about the Love, and don''t forget,
"Tough Love is Better than No Love at All!"
God Bless all those represented by the twu, for they will need it!!
Concensual Agreement 2003
twu Run by a person found guilty of Violating Workers Rights! Now that says Something doesn''t it!
Love,
"Company Man" Dan Cunningham
Now amfa Dave when you put someones posting up lets be sure to put all of it up. As it was posted on the other web site.
I would like to thank all the folks that took the time out of their Saturday, July 19, 2003 to come witness Justice being served at AFW Local 567. Our bretheren from the north (Tulsa) seem somewhat confused about the events of the day, but I''m sure someday soon, perhaps within 4 months, they''ll better understand reality. I take exception at some of the comments I''ve read here and at usaviation.com, but I consider the sources.
I have given the twu every chance to prove their worth as the bargaining agent for Mechanic & Related workers at AA and they have failed miserably. Instead, the twu international coaches punks, drunks and cowards to do their dirty work for them by assailing dues paying reps that are intent on defending the membership, both from the company and their own union.
Character assassinations do not bother me in the least for I know the character of the cowards involved. To Kevin Hammack I say; "I am not required to prove my guilt for I did not charge myself. Simple thought, Kevin, for an obviously simple mind. If you cannot understand that concept you''ll be a wanna believer/I got miner like your ole buddy, Kirk (in it for me) Wells for eternity. Perhaps Mein Kampf meant more to you than it did for me, Kevin.
I pity anyone that has ever had Matt Lorenzi represent them in a serious issue. God help them, because Matt could not/cannot/will not, ever! I feel badly that K. Hammack indicates that I have lied about anything regarding my efforts in gaining true, just, democratic representation! I did not avoid calling myself to the stand to refute anything for I did not need to. Mr. Wells was all I thought he was intellectually! I knew I would be vindicated. To say Mr. Lorenzi could not "object" to questioning is also a misstatement, for I was the first to be denied the right to object by the Trial Committee.
The Trial Committee failed to pay homage to our great Arbitor and conducted a legitimate proceeding. Mr. Lorenzi failed the anti Dan Tulsa troupe by calling a seemingly blind, deaf, and dumb buffoon to the stand after his "Star" witness, the guy with no corroborating testimony or evidence, Mr. Kirk Wells. I wish now to thank Les Howard for turning the tide for the defense. Les, you made Gary''s and my day with your blatherings. I knew you seemed confused when I was in Tulsa, but I thought it was just a show. I know better now, dude! How do you represent anyone as an e-board member? I pity them, too! The Trial Committee did not refuse to allow Lorenzi to call other witnesses, he was just too confused by then to know what to do!
Mr. Lorenzi blew the case for the prosecution. I hope he bought ya''ll dinner or some booze to forget the day quicker. Perhaps he already had enough for the whole gang of ya in his supply locker in the back of the suburban🙂 Glad to hear you guys from Tulsa were able to remember the way back to Tulsa, or did you have to use an onboard Mapsco to see you through the confusion of I-35 to the turnpike. I know Les Howard didn''t drive. Do you car pool to work, Les?, on the short bus?
Thanks for the Memories Matt, Kirk Wells, Kevin Hammack, Les Howard and the supporting cast. Next time you Tulsa twu believers are in town stop by and say hi, we at Local 567 will role out the Welcome Matt for you anytime.
Its all about the Love, and don''t forget,
"Tough Love is Better than No Love at All!"
God Bless all those represented by the twu, for they will need it!!
Concensual Agreement 2003
twu Run by a person found guilty of Violating Workers Rights! Now that says Something doesn''t it!
Love,
"Company Man" Dan Cunningham
Now amfa Dave when you put someones posting up lets be sure to put all of it up. As it was posted on the other web site.
Buck (Larry),
Wow, be careful there, you''re gonna get dizzy!! Mr. Hammack asked a question of Dave (RV4), he wasn''t taking a position. However, he did answer your question. Let me see if I can get this right, he said, "I welcome all that the NMB assign", is that pretty close? You and Dave are obviously swapping spit because you spew the same lies and deceit! Obviously you don’t want to talk about how this woman was removed from the negotiating committee, because AMFA has an issue with who is considered “craft & classâ€, and the TWU doesn’t.
Wow, be careful there, you''re gonna get dizzy!! Mr. Hammack asked a question of Dave (RV4), he wasn''t taking a position. However, he did answer your question. Let me see if I can get this right, he said, "I welcome all that the NMB assign", is that pretty close? You and Dave are obviously swapping spit because you spew the same lies and deceit! Obviously you don’t want to talk about how this woman was removed from the negotiating committee, because AMFA has an issue with who is considered “craft & classâ€, and the TWU doesn’t.
----------------
On 7/23/2003 5:28:28 AM RV4 wrote:
How low of pay and benefit package are you willing to work for to save that man and his mortgage? Truth is, the OSM's are paid so little thanks to the TWU, that they could easily replace their income while on layoff.
Be sure and tell the company that your priority is to save jobs and you fear layoffs, I am sure that when AA files BK anyway, the corporate greeders will like to know you are not currently at your "concessions for jobs" limit. Could you please inform everyone else what that limit of yours is, because some have signed mortgages based on AMFA at NWA pay and might not be able to keep that house, once you are finished saving everyone a job.
----------------
That's the difference between you and me. . .I care about the others in my union. You don't!! There will be plenty more to lose their jobs if we go AMFA! Can you say out-sourcing?? You know that as well as I do. CIO prints the truth about AMFA. Have you read it?? Go ahead and reply with more stats you have regarding outsourcing. I know the truth. . .you just fail to see it. On 7/23/2003 5:28:28 AM RV4 wrote:
----------------
On 7/23/2003 12:25:51 AM twuer wrote:
Stop the press!! You mean to tell me that an OSM (who probably has a mortgage and 2 1/2 kids) got to keep his job and you didn't get a week of vacation??? What a tragedy!! The typical "in it for me" AMFA attitude. That's a good example of watching out for your union brothers and sisters. Good point RUM! Give me a break. . .
----------------
twuer,On 7/23/2003 12:25:51 AM twuer wrote:
Stop the press!! You mean to tell me that an OSM (who probably has a mortgage and 2 1/2 kids) got to keep his job and you didn't get a week of vacation??? What a tragedy!! The typical "in it for me" AMFA attitude. That's a good example of watching out for your union brothers and sisters. Good point RUM! Give me a break. . .
----------------
How low of pay and benefit package are you willing to work for to save that man and his mortgage? Truth is, the OSM's are paid so little thanks to the TWU, that they could easily replace their income while on layoff.
Be sure and tell the company that your priority is to save jobs and you fear layoffs, I am sure that when AA files BK anyway, the corporate greeders will like to know you are not currently at your "concessions for jobs" limit. Could you please inform everyone else what that limit of yours is, because some have signed mortgages based on AMFA at NWA pay and might not be able to keep that house, once you are finished saving everyone a job.
----------------
Oh, by the way, you didn't respond to my other post. Let me remind you. . .
Oh, just a simple question for you. . .why didn't Dan take the stand in his own defense? You are putting a really good spin on what took place and the testimony that was given. Les did attend the meeting that day. The same one Dan (and you) did, just not at the same time. How hard is that to understand??? Duh!! You guys had meetings all day long. Not a big turnout from what I understand, but that's another story. The issue (as I see it) is that Dan holds an elected postion with the TWU and is organizing and attending AMFA meetings. Just admit it already!! Now, if the shoe was on the other foot, you guys would probably send out a possee to pick up the AMFA guy who was advocating for the TWU, ready with the noose to hang the poor fellow. Tell me if I'm at all close. If anything, look at it ethically (if you are capable of doing so). I don't care what union you represent, you CAN'T hold an elected position then propogate for another. THAT'S WRONG!!!!!!!!!! I don't know Dan personally so I am not here to knock him but what he is doing is just not right. I personally didn't vote for him either but what about those who did. They voted him as an officer for the TWU not AMFA. He should resign his position. Or does he like the extra income he gets from the union (the one he claims to hate)?? It's not at all hard to figure out RV4. There was a legitmate reason for the trial in the first place. Wells didn't ask to be bumped to AFW. You can't knock a man for doing what he thinks is in the best interest of his union and its' members. Isn't that what you claim AMFA is all about? Taking care of the members. There are a lot of people who wish they had the balls to do what he did. On both sides.
Like to hear from you on this one.
I must say you are a fighter!! Just fighting to save your self I'm afraid. I know I can't save the world but the reality is that the company was in trouble, the company you work for. My union as well as the other two did what was best (with the majority vote) to save it and our jobs. (you obviously voted to put the company into bankruptcy which would have been an even bigger mess) Unfortunately some had to loose theirs. It happens. Is it right. . .no, but it happens. AMFA or the TWU can't save everyone. We try but reality rears it's wicked head. Those AMFA people at NWA are probably jumping right into the frying pan. They are not my concern. . .they are yours aren't they??
I'll be anxiously awaiting for your response from the previous post. After all that is the issue of your original post isn't it???
Where did the screaming Kevin Hammack go?
He showed up here ready to debate, and then ducks out faster than he left the Local 567 Union Hall being chased by an observer wearing a Kangaroo Pelt and Police Officer ready to haul him to jail.
He must be really tired from all that work he accomplishes at work!
You guys are not defending a UNION, the union is divided, non-existant, and we need a reconciliation election. You are defending a name and/or a tradition, not a union.
What is more important?
Defending the name of TWU while your union is dismanteled by division, or re-establishing a union on AA's property to defend the profession?
The only way to put the union back into the mechanic and related class or craft at AA is through a democratic vote of preference. This negative campaigning is making us weaker, and more divided.
If the TWU supporter thinks the TWU is superior, then why fear the vote? Tulsa TWU supporters will NEVER convince the line and AFW mechanic to support the TWU, the line mechanic will never convince those like Hammack, Howard, and Mullings to support AMFA. Thus the membership is divided and there is a result of NO UNION on the property.
Sign your cards boys, bring Art Luby, Sanford Dennison, the AFL-CIO, ECLAT and anyone else you can muster and convince the voting majority you are correct, the TWU is best for us, and the entire industry of mechanic and related is wrong. I am sure a debate for the members to get "INFORMED" can be arranged, and if you are truely defending the superior organization, then you have nothing to fear?
You claim to want to communicate to the members, you claim to want to inform them and then provide links to biased, one sided websites. If you really want to protect the members, call for the vote, hold the debate, and let the members decide!
THE MEMBERS DON'T NEED YOU TO SAVE THEM FROM THEMSELVES, THEY NEED YOU TO HELP US CALL FOR THE VOTE AND PUT THE UNION BACK INTO THE MEMBER!
He showed up here ready to debate, and then ducks out faster than he left the Local 567 Union Hall being chased by an observer wearing a Kangaroo Pelt and Police Officer ready to haul him to jail.
He must be really tired from all that work he accomplishes at work!
You guys are not defending a UNION, the union is divided, non-existant, and we need a reconciliation election. You are defending a name and/or a tradition, not a union.
What is more important?
Defending the name of TWU while your union is dismanteled by division, or re-establishing a union on AA's property to defend the profession?
The only way to put the union back into the mechanic and related class or craft at AA is through a democratic vote of preference. This negative campaigning is making us weaker, and more divided.
If the TWU supporter thinks the TWU is superior, then why fear the vote? Tulsa TWU supporters will NEVER convince the line and AFW mechanic to support the TWU, the line mechanic will never convince those like Hammack, Howard, and Mullings to support AMFA. Thus the membership is divided and there is a result of NO UNION on the property.
Sign your cards boys, bring Art Luby, Sanford Dennison, the AFL-CIO, ECLAT and anyone else you can muster and convince the voting majority you are correct, the TWU is best for us, and the entire industry of mechanic and related is wrong. I am sure a debate for the members to get "INFORMED" can be arranged, and if you are truely defending the superior organization, then you have nothing to fear?
You claim to want to communicate to the members, you claim to want to inform them and then provide links to biased, one sided websites. If you really want to protect the members, call for the vote, hold the debate, and let the members decide!
THE MEMBERS DON'T NEED YOU TO SAVE THEM FROM THEMSELVES, THEY NEED YOU TO HELP US CALL FOR THE VOTE AND PUT THE UNION BACK INTO THE MEMBER!
- Joined
- Aug 20, 2002
- Messages
- 7,319
- Reaction score
- 1,555
----------------
On 7/23/2003 9
19 AM jake wrote:
Buck (Larry),
Wow, be careful there, you''re gonna get dizzy!! Mr. Hammack asked a question of Dave (RV4), he wasn''t taking a position. However, he did answer your question. Let me see if I can get this right, he said, "I welcome all that the NMB assign", is that pretty close? You and Dave are obviously swapping spit because you spew the same lies and deceit! Obviously you don’t want to talk about how this woman was removed from the negotiating committee, because AMFA has an issue with who is considered “craft & classâ€, and the TWU doesn’t.
----------------
But first he said that welders ride the coat tails of the mechanics.On 7/23/2003 9
19 AM jake wrote:Buck (Larry),
Wow, be careful there, you''re gonna get dizzy!! Mr. Hammack asked a question of Dave (RV4), he wasn''t taking a position. However, he did answer your question. Let me see if I can get this right, he said, "I welcome all that the NMB assign", is that pretty close? You and Dave are obviously swapping spit because you spew the same lies and deceit! Obviously you don’t want to talk about how this woman was removed from the negotiating committee, because AMFA has an issue with who is considered “craft & classâ€, and the TWU doesn’t.
----------------
No two men swapping spit would be more along the lines of the politics you and the TWU support.
I do not want ot discuss anything about this women because I have no facts and my guess is that you are not fully informed either. AMFA does have an issue with craft and class. I have never denied that. However the TWU allows through their form of socialistic unionism that Fleet Service ride the coat tails of skilled labor.
Kevin Hammack
Newbie
- Joined
- Jul 21, 2003
- Messages
- 7
- Reaction score
- 0
Buck (Larry),
Here''s is the question from Mr. Hammack''s post.
Oh, one more thing, being as you are a "welder", does that mean that YOU are riding the coat tails of the A&P mechanics or aren''t you thankful to the NMB for placing "welders" in with "Mechanic & Related"?
One more time....slowly...
He didn''t make a statement,(note the question mark at the end???) he asked a question to Dave. Okay, no spinning, just have your buddy, Dave, not shy away or re-direct, it''s very simple. Just answer the question and all the previous questions that you failed to answer. It''s okay if you don''t want to play, it just helps the readers here understand that you are, in fact dishonest, and that''s okay because no one wants to be in "MO, Larry and Curly''s spit swapping club!"
Here''s is the question from Mr. Hammack''s post.
Oh, one more thing, being as you are a "welder", does that mean that YOU are riding the coat tails of the A&P mechanics or aren''t you thankful to the NMB for placing "welders" in with "Mechanic & Related"?
One more time....slowly...
He didn''t make a statement,(note the question mark at the end???) he asked a question to Dave. Okay, no spinning, just have your buddy, Dave, not shy away or re-direct, it''s very simple. Just answer the question and all the previous questions that you failed to answer. It''s okay if you don''t want to play, it just helps the readers here understand that you are, in fact dishonest, and that''s okay because no one wants to be in "MO, Larry and Curly''s spit swapping club!"
----------------
On 7/23/2003 9:30:56 PM Kevin Hammack wrote:
Buck (Larry),
Here's is the question from Mr. Hammack's post.
Oh, one more thing, being as you are a "welder", does that mean that YOU are riding the coat tails of the A&P mechanics or aren't you thankful to the NMB for placing "welders" in with "Mechanic & Related"?
----------------
I believe that given the fact that welders can make more money than A&P's do, if they are employed in underwater, pipline, and code pressure vessel welding that maybe the welder doesn't really "ride the coat tail" of the A&P.On 7/23/2003 9:30:56 PM Kevin Hammack wrote:
Buck (Larry),
Here's is the question from Mr. Hammack's post.
Oh, one more thing, being as you are a "welder", does that mean that YOU are riding the coat tails of the A&P mechanics or aren't you thankful to the NMB for placing "welders" in with "Mechanic & Related"?
----------------
However, given the 46 mile radius mentality of folks like Kevin Hammack, if we are going to tunnel vision to Tulsa only, then it would appear that the welder is riding the coat tail. However, it seems the welder and machinist in Tulsa have little difficulty working on Hammack's Dock doing his job, and even has to lose $2.45 per hour to do so, while Hammack wonders mindlessly around the base saving us from ourselves, yet not one A&P cannot just move into welding and work in that skill. This is why the labor agreement splits the type of work and provides a so-called "red circle" for welder and machinist.
Besides that it is a moot point, the National Mediation Board includes the welder and machinist into the craft and class and I don't see that changing. Kevin, can you say the same about the $25 per hour bag smasher?
Kevin, how many of your own E-board have their license? Are you claim your higher ranking Local Officers are "riding your coat tails", even after they reward you with an appointment? Better go tell that to the McDonald brothers Kevin.
----------------
On 7/23/2003 8
38 PM Buck wrote:
However the TWU allows through their form of socialistic unionism that Fleet Service ride the coat tails of skilled labor.
----------------
One problem with that statement. Fleet service did not vote on our contract. As mechanics we have to accept that our condition is the product of our own collective actions (or lack of). On 7/23/2003 8
38 PM Buck wrote:However the TWU allows through their form of socialistic unionism that Fleet Service ride the coat tails of skilled labor.
----------------
Fleet service made an easy scapegoat for years. Its time to stop blaming them. Blaming them will not help us.
I believe our Fleet Service is the highest paid in the industry. I believe they get more than SWA. However we get less than SWA. The real problem for mechanics is that Tulsa overwhelmingly accepts concessionary contracts one after the other. Has Tulsa ever seen a concessionary contract they did not like? Now that we know what the problem is, we have to work on a solution. How do we get Tulsa to be willing to fight for more, or, if they are really content, at least let the line guys try and get more?
