List all TWU accomplishments

[Bob Owens]

So because "no union in the industry" has negotiated a snap-back clause, you view that as an excuse not to even try?

You and the TWU deserve each other. You're both pathetic.

He leaves out the fact that both the TWU and APA gave up 25% of their compensation, however the pilots got back 10% the first year then 1.5% thereafter.

So the pilots negotiated a partial snapback.

1.5% is less than half the average rate of inflation, so the TWU in fact negotiated a running concesion, 25% up front then a 1.5% cut each year thereafter till 2009. That became the standard for the industry. So the TWU really put in a 34% cut in compensation whereas the pilots 10% snapback the first year leaves them with only a 24% cut, counting inflation.

 

[laughing@u]

Yes and we saw the TWUs union building skills in action over at Continental didnt we? What did they spend on that failed drive, another $2million like the failed drive at Delta? All that money and they lost by around the same amount as they did the last failed election, it seems that my efforts to give them the facts about the TWU were a lot more effective than all your money was. I know at least one pro-TWU Continental ramper said he changed his mind after reading my posts.

Pretty sad isnt it? Despite the fact that those workers took deep pay cuts they still chose not to go with the TWU. Once they found out what the TWU was all about thats not suprising. I would bet that well over 90% of current TWU members never voted for the TWU and if given the chance would likely vote for somebody, anybody else. Who in their right mind would want to belong to a union run by a former member of AA management who lies about having college degrees in order to impress people and conceal the facts that he has no real accomplishments as a unionist?

So how does the TWU ATD grow? Well at Eagle the company just recognized a card count, in other words the majority of the workers did not vote for the TWU THE COMPANY welcomed them in without a vote. AMRs purchase of TWA gave them another 7000 members. Eagle and AA have the same parent company, AMR, and since AMR was so happy with the industry leading concessions that the TWU had been giving AA for years then why not get them into Eagle? Better to bring in the TWU than take the risk that the workers join a real union.

What happened to the TWU drive at USAIR? That fizzled.As bad as the IAM is the TWU didnt have a chance over there. We also found out from a little incident in PHL that the TWU doesnt know how to fight the IAM. Well anyway, it seems that the TWU can only get members through some sort of default, winning elections has not been their strong point. The TWU is better at scheming with the company to prevent elections than winning them.
"the company made an offer at the table to close down heavy maintenance"
Sounds more like a threat than an offer. They could have simply said no, since we had a contract in place. Besides from the documents I saw it said layoffs of around 2000 mechanics, it did not say "overhaul".


Did they vote against outsourcing or layoffs? The fact is that not only did the company get the dollar figure they sought directly through paycuts and the elimination of benifits they went on to eliminate more than the figure they presented to the Concessions committee. So as a group we alraedy doubled the concessions because the company got both, straight concessions and job eliminations. The pilots got credit for the additional savings and got back 10% the first year, what did we get? We got the TWU telling us we have to give the company even more without asking for anything in return!!!

Dont call it a negotiations committee because negotiations are give and take, in this situation the only proposed purpose of the committee was to decide how they were going to meet the companies demands for savings which was non-negotiable.



He was thinking like a unionist. What is the purpose of a union? To establish through collective bargaining adequate wage standards, shorter hours of work and improvents in the conditions of employment for the workers in the industry.

Unionists accept there will be occasional layoffs but they must preserve the quality of the job. It was obvious that AA had overhired in the years prior to 2003, using the excuse of claiming to protect those positions, which were lost anyway, as the reason for giving away hard fought for and long standardized benifits was inexcusable. The eefects of the TWUs concessions are even more severe than what happens when a union is successfully decertified through corporate actions.


Once again, the company made the offer to meet the savings objective through job eliminations, which they later withdrew because they claimed if they went that route they could not operate their business, as it turns out that was another lie because through layoffs and attrition they have surpassed that number.
We make less than Continental and SWA. SWA is AMFA and they make around $15,000 a year more than we do.



More twisted logic from the TWU.
Hows that? Please present one iota of fact to back that statement up. We took our concessions two years prior to the AMFA battle at NWA. How is AMFA resposible for the TWUs industry leading concessions?

The fact is as far as unions go and the sad state of airline workers no organization is more at fault than the TWU.
It was the TWU that agreed to B-scale.

It was the TWU that first agreed to transferring Recieve and Dispatch to lower paid ramp workers.

It was the TWU that agreed to 12 year progressions for ground workers.

It was the TWU that agreed to replacing A&P mechanics with much lower paid SRPs.

It was the TWU that agreed to Junior Fleet Service Clerks.

It was the TWU that agreed to part timers.

It was the TWU that agreed to 25% compensation cuts, and they did so outside of BK which promted all the carriers that were in BK to seek yet another round of concessions in order to try and catch up with AA.

So, the TWUs destructive effect has not been limited to TWU members, members of other airlines have suffered thanks to the TWU since long before AMFA reemerged.

The post 9-11 collapse of the airline labor movement was in no way connected to AMFA. Clearly, when one looks at the long history of TWU industry leading concessions that eroded the foundation from every other unionized, and even non-union truck carrier out there, there is the actions of one union that stands out as a leading cause in the erosion of standards for airline workers-the TWU. When USAIR went BK in 2002 many of the concessions they sought were things the TWU had given to AA in 1983, nearly two decades earlier. For two decades unions like the IAM resisted the TWUs concessionary strategy for union growth, they paid for it. What they should have done was raid the TWU at AA twenty years ago when this all started and then today the overwhelming majority of airline workers would have been united in one union.



The AMFA boys at SWA are still doing pretty well arent they?



Who is making money?Maybe TWU officers such as yourself and AA are but TWU members arent.



And when might that time be? Jim Little claimed that we put the openers in so we could get it back in 2006, well we can see that isnt going to happen. Lets say in 2009 you get us back to where we were in 2006, well its still a paycut, in fact it comes out to about an 18% paycut thanks to inflation. Now lets compare that to a dues funded TWU International pension. Over that same period of time wher the best we could hope for is restoration of our 2003 wage in 2009 as a TWU member retired TWU officials will see their pension increased by 30%, so even after figuring in inflation they would see a real inrease of 12%.

So, now we know your motivation for coming here under the alias of Laughing@u and spreading lies and disinformation. Because as a TWU officer thats exactly what you do to the ventire membership, laugh at them as you get them paycuts and get yourself pay raises, laugh at them when you say "the union is you". Laugh at them for accepting the excuse "Well thats what the members voted for, dont blame me". Go ahead and laugh, someday will come a day of reckoning.

Bob, I was wondering when you would wade in with one of your long boring fairy tales. You did not disappoint me. Do you really spend all that time thinking each letter up or are you cut and pasting crap from a year ago. I got news for you Bob no one believes you any more. Do not waist your time on such meaningless tasks. It’s getting you nowhere. Nice guess first you guys thought I was Linda and now a TWU officer. I will give you a hint I am a TWU member. No Title.

Laughing@u

 

[AMFAMAN]

As far as Linda ... If you ask her what her pay is she will probably tell you.

I did one better, I've requested this information through the DOL along with the wages of Donny V., David M., Cris S., and others that are employees of the ATD and are not showing on the LM-2. They are curious themselves now.

 

[TWU-GOTTA-GO]

Well after everyone was laughing@bill, he re-appears with another alias.

AMFAMAN, let us know the results of the DOL inquiry.

 

[laughing@u]

I did one better, I've requested this information through the DOL along with the wages of Donny V., David M., Cris S., and others that are employees of the ATD and are not showing on the LM-2. They are curious themselves now.

Oh so now you all admit that Linda is not a TWU officer I thought you guys were all upset because you could not elect her.
What about that 800,000 dollar a year contract signer that worked for AMFA did they get to vote on him. Not! Oh and the next post is wrong also I am not Bill. Do not lose sleep over it though. You won't figure it out and after today I probably wont bother to look at this crap again.

 

[Hopeful]

Oh so now you all admit that Linda is not a TWU officer I thought you guys were all upset because you could not elect her.
What about that 800,000 dollar a year contract signer that worked for AMFA did they get to vote on him. Not! Oh and the next post is wrong also I am not Bill. Do not lose sleep over it though. You won't figure it out and after today I probably wont bother to look at this crap again.

AMFA is not on AA's property. AMFA is a non issue here This is about the TWU/AA lovefest!

 

[laughing@u]

AMFA is not on AA's property. AMFA is a non issue here This is about the TWU/AA lovefest!

Duck and run.

 

[Hackman]

Duck and run.

It really matters not who you are, because in the end, your just another cornfused twu bubba believer. Without the stones to state your name here or anywhere else. h34r:

Mr. Owens laid out another excellent post and all you can do is show your twu blatant ignorance and call it "crap". What a empty retort.

Now run along, your whipped..... and the man needs you in the corner office.

 

[TWU informer]

It is not hard to notice that CIO has returned to the board under a new alias.

 

[TWU informer]

Bob, I was wondering when you would wade in with one of your long boring fairy tales. You did not disappoint me. Do you really spend all that time thinking each letter up or are you cut and pasting crap from a year ago. I got news for you Bob no one believes you any more. Do not waist your time on such meaningless tasks. It’s getting you nowhere. Nice guess first you guys thought I was Linda and now a TWU officer. I will give you a hint I am a TWU member. No Title.

Laughing@u

Long boring fairy tale? His post was factual!

So you think "nobody believes" Bob anymore? I do!

I read the post again that Bob made, and I find it to be quite factual. And not only factual but depressingly true.

Why is that you cannot answer one single instance that demonstrates TWU failure, and instead use AMFA as a means to change the subject matter?

It is true that TWU at Eagle was recognized without an NMB ballot.

It is true that TWU has failed recently when a ballot is placed in a workers hands to accept or reject the TWU.

It is true that the 2003 concessions are much larger than anyone was told. Both in loss of thousands of jobs and destruction of our standard of living.

The list of historical concession first that Bob listed were indeed negotiated by the TWU.

SO how is it exactly that you can make the statement that nobody believes Bob? You may not believe Bob, but that is only because you refuse to accept any mention of factual TWU failures, but that sure as hell doesn't mean the rest of us have a problem believing the truth when it is posted.

You were asked to provide one single accomplishment of the TWU, and the first thing you posted was that 2003 concessions were a positive accomplishment for the TWU. That my friend leaves you as the guy everyone likely thinks has a twisted brain, low I.Q., and by far hard to believe.

And that along with other transparent clues have "CIO" written all over it!

 

[777 fixer]

Tell that to the guys at LGA
:down:

There are stations other than LGA. Stations like DFW, LAX, ORD, AUS, BOS, MIA etc where this did not happen.

 

[TIME FOR CHANGE]

There are stations other than LGA. Stations like DFW, LAX, ORD, AUS, BOS, MIA etc where this did not happen.

But it did happen
:unsure:

You were just lucky enough to be in a station where it did not affect you

 

[Ken MacTiernan]

AMFA has not negotiated a snap back clause that actually has any value, no union in the industry has. That argument does not work any more. So you keep acting as if what you do makes a difference. I guess it makes you happy.

Laughing@u

So by your argument then the twu should simply ignore fighting to get any snapback clause because "no union in the industry has". What's wrong, the twu afraid of fighting?

What I do does make a difference and yes, it makes me happy. Kinda like your defending an UNdemocratic industrial union pretending to protect our craft all the while not having enough fortitude to identify yourself. If THAT makes you happy you should change your alias to "Laughing@myself".

Bob, I was wondering when you would wade in with one of your long boring fairy tales. You did not disappoint me. Do you really spend all that time thinking each letter up or are you cut and pasting crap from a year ago. I got news for you Bob no one believes you any more. Do not waist your time on such meaningless tasks. It’s getting you nowhere. Nice guess first you guys thought I was Linda and now a TWU officer. I will give you a hint I am a TWU member. No Title.

Laughing@u

Typical twu union officer, can't read the facts as they are presented to you. Come on smart guy, how is it the pilots got back so much and they twu got us what? 39 cents a year raise? LOL!

Let's see: Facts = Fairy Tale.

laughing@u = Pathetic = Ignorant

The only people who don't "believe" Bob are cowards such as yourself. The twu despises the truth and facts when they do not fit their way of looking at reality.

 

[MCI transplant]

Wrong
TWA AMTS got 25 percent of thier seniority. So if you had less than 5 years with AA you got bumped to the street
Another TWU screw job

<_< ---- Which in turn destroyed the vary bases of Unionism! A thing called "The concept of Seniority!"--- Seniority in one's Craft in Trade, should be recognized throughout one's Industry! That concept, at least in this Industry, has now, and forever more, been destroyed!!! Good show TWU!----- :down:

 

[Wretched Wrench]

<_< ---- Which in turn destroyed the vary bases of Unionism! A thing called "The concept of Seniority!"--- Seniority in one's Craft in Trade, should be recognized throughout one's Industry! That concept, at least in this Industry, has now, and forever more, been destroyed!!! Good show TWU!----- :down:

As with so many things, it depends on whose ox has been gored. You are only looking at your own individual situation. TWU members' seniority was mostly protected. TWA seniority mostly was not. But some junior AA mechs were laid off and TWAers stayed, so nothing is all that clear cut. Kasher did a Solomon and cut the baby in half.

And, there is not a lot of industry-wide seniority. I know several auto workers who changed employers and had to start over.