JCBA Negotiations and updates for AA Fleet

[WeAAsles]

Ya gotta do what ya gotta do
Shame the banter has been put on suspension, it was somewhat entertaining at times

It’s part of my new Happy, Happy, Joy, Joy Dave mantra.

Kill em all with kindness.

 

[Tim Nelson]

thank cb appreciate the answer

Tim even if he not in the same room I would believe that Regan keeps them informed of everything and I mean every thing pertatining to the talks

It really doesnt matter until the iam stops treating the twu with lepracy. Management wont be serious until then. The discussion ok n here today was productive. CB gave the twu credit. His members need to see him walking around a twu union boss cuz our members think the twu wants to strip us of our health care.

 

[Kev3188]

Don't forget the non-skid tape at the doors of the 757, ahh yes good times.

Wait, what?

Like right at the door sill?!

 

[NYer]

Isn't the TWU paying the highest percentage of any union on property?

APFA language (2014): "Aggregate employee contributions for the Standard and Core medical options for 2015 will be twenty percent (20%), and 2016 and thereafter will be twenty-one percent (21%) of the total projected cost of each forecasted year of healthcare expenses for these two (2) medical options (which include medical/prescription and administrative expenses) as calculated by the Company."

APA language (2015): "Aggregate employee contributions for the Standard and Core medical options for 2013 will be 18%, 2014 will be 19%, 2015 will be 20% and 2016 and thereafter will be 21% of the total projected cost of each forecasted year of healthcare expenses for these two medical options (which include medical/prescription and administrative expenses) as calculated by the Company."

CWA-IBT language (2015): "Aggregate employee contributions for the Standard and Core medical options for 2015 are twenty percent (20%), and 2016 and thereafter will be twenty-one percent (21%), of the total projected cost of each forecasted year of healthcare expenses for these two (2) medical options (which include medical/prescription and administrative expenses) as calculated by the Company."

TWU language (2012): "Aggregate employee contributions for the Standard and Core medical options for 2013 will be 18%, 2014 will be 19%, 2015 will be 20% and 2016 and thereafter will be 21% of the total projected cost of healthcare expenses (which include medical/Rx and administrative expenses) for the Standard and Core medical plan options."

 

[WeAAsles]

The IAM has kept their percentage expenses for Medical through two bankruptcies and three rounds of concessions, one JCBA with the HP merger and the 2014 Section 6 stand-alone Contract. All while every other group both represented and not were paying higher percentages.

I think some TWU Members better begin to understand that this Medical issue is an issue they take very seriously and obviously aren’t prepared to just automatically or easily roll over on.

What’s the old saying? “Just because everyone else jumps off a bridge”

 

[Steve Walegir]

APFA language (2014): "Aggregate employee contributions for the Standard and Core medical options for 2015 will be twenty percent (20%), and 2016 and thereafter will be twenty-one percent (21%) of the total projected cost of each forecasted year of healthcare expenses for these two (2) medical options (which include medical/prescription and administrative expenses) as calculated by the Company."

APA language (2015): "Aggregate employee contributions for the Standard and Core medical options for 2013 will be 18%, 2014 will be 19%, 2015 will be 20% and 2016 and thereafter will be 21% of the total projected cost of each forecasted year of healthcare expenses for these two medical options (which include medical/prescription and administrative expenses) as calculated by the Company."

CWA-IBT language (2015): "Aggregate employee contributions for the Standard and Core medical options for 2015 are twenty percent (20%), and 2016 and thereafter will be twenty-one percent (21%), of the total projected cost of each forecasted year of healthcare expenses for these two (2) medical options (which include medical/prescription and administrative expenses) as calculated by the Company."

TWU language (2012): "Aggregate employee contributions for the Standard and Core medical options for 2013 will be 18%, 2014 will be 19%, 2015 will be 20% and 2016 and thereafter will be 21% of the total projected cost of healthcare expenses (which include medical/Rx and administrative expenses) for the Standard and Core medical plan options."

As long as you've got numbers out, what is the percentage for the value out of curiosity

 

[NYer]

As long as you've got numbers out, what is the percentage for the value out of curiosity

The Value plan isn't contractual. They have the ability to amend that plan in any way they choose, including to eliminate it.

As you can see, if we get any language that is different than the others it will open an opportunity for those other groups to make a stand. That being the case, what are chances they will agree to have the last group without that language remain without that coverage.

To me, they would go along with the fight as long as it takes in order to save themselves from having to relitigate the issue with all the other groups.

 

[Steve Walegir]

The IAM has kept their percentage expenses for Medical through two bankruptcies and three rounds of concessions, one JCBA with the HP merger and the 2014 Section 6 stand-alone Contract. All while every other group both represented and not were paying higher percentages.

I think some TWU Members better begin to understand that this Medical issue is an issue they take very seriously and obviously aren’t prepared to just automatically or easily roll over on.

What’s the old saying? “Just because everyone else jumps off a bridge”

And then all their unions got schooled up on the clause of Me Too. Wonder if that was ever even considered by the other work groups because that might have been a game changer for them as they are now facing. I'd fight tooth and nail if I were in their shoes, but being a realists I'd try to formulate a trade-off that would make losing the sacred cow more palatable. And imo the only trade-off for losing money is getting more money in return but that's when Dougie will lose his awe shucks mentality and the vampire emerges

 

[Steve Walegir]

The Value plan isn't contractual. They have the ability to amend that plan in any way they choose, including to eliminate it.

I actually didn't know that it wasn't contractual. So the best coverage plan, at least imo, but most expensive plan could be gone without notice if they choose. Not to beat a dead horse but do you know the % for value

 

[AANOTOK]

The IAM has kept their percentage expenses for Medical through two bankruptcies and three rounds of concessions, one JCBA with the HP merger and the 2014 Section 6 stand-alone Contract. All while every other group both represented and not were paying higher percentages.

I think some TWU Members better begin to understand that this Medical issue is an issue they take very seriously and obviously aren’t prepared to just automatically or easily roll over on.

What’s the old saying? “Just because everyone else jumps off a bridge”

I've said it once and I will say it again, I want the medical LUS has and so do many I talk to.
But as I have stated, my medical not going down to theirs is NOT a non starter for me. It alone
will not prevent me from voting yes on a JCBA. Of the many folks I talk to, most are in my boat and
surprisingly many don't even know it's an issue or know anything about their cheaper medical. I will also go on record as saying I disagree with W when he says there will be an agreement with ours going down and theirs going up. OURS will not be going down. That IS a non starter with AA in my opinion. Can the IAM leadership prevent there ever being a JCBA vote without getting the medical price they want, don't know, I would assume they can.
Finally, with the lack of support we (TWU) have seen from the IAM leadership in regards to pressuring AA with around the country picketing and nothing being publicly published by them about the upcoming "huge" HDQ demonstration, it takes the sting out of the medical issue being a non starter for me, unfortunately.

 

[bob@las-AA]

Wait, what?

Like right at the door sill?!

Yes, this happened in 2009, they also switch blue juice around the same time, needlessly to say the lavs stunk like a outhouse, and in turn they said we weren’t dumping the lavs the right way.

 

[NYer]

And then all their unions got schooled up on the clause of Me Too. Wonder if that was ever even considered by the other work groups because that might have been a game changer for them as they are now facing. I'd fight tooth and nail if I were in their shoes, but being a realists I'd try to formulate a trade-off that would make losing the sacred cow more palatable. And imo the only trade-off for losing money is getting more money in return but that's when Dougie will lose his awe shucks mentality and the vampire emerges

That could very well be. If we were in their shoes, we'd expect our representatives to take a stand on the medical and try to keep it even if it meant having these negotiations get extended.

That expectation may be why they have the NMB involved so any idea of getting a better deal or having an ally within the mediation during the Section 6 process can be addressed in real time. Facing the reality of their ability to succeed, it could at least open the idea or possibility of getting maximum value for the medical now, which may not be available in 2018 and beyond.

Apparently, they can't tell their members that because it may be interpreted as them not fighting and just giving in. That's a tricky position to be in.

 

[NYer]

I actually didn't know that it wasn't contractual. So the best coverage plan, at least imo, but most expensive plan could be gone without notice if they choose. Not to beat a dead horse but do you know the % for value

If you find someone that has that plan, see what the value may be by checking the insurance declaration on the W-2 and then just do the math.

 

[WeAAsles]

I've said it once and I will say it again, I want the medical LUS has and so do many I talk to.
But as I have stated, my medical not going down to theirs is NOT a non starter for me. It alone
will not prevent me from voting yes on a JCBA. Of the many folks I talk to, most are in my boat and
surprisingly many don't even know it's an issue or know anything about their cheaper medical. I will also go on record as saying I disagree with W when he says there will be an agreement with ours going down and theirs going up. OURS will not be going down. That IS a non starter with AA in my opinion. Can the IAM leadership prevent there ever being a JCBA vote without getting the medical price they want, don't know, I would assume they can.
Finally, with the lack of support we (TWU) have seen from the IAM leadership in regards to pressuring AA with around the country picketing and nothing being publicly published by them about the upcoming "huge" HDQ demonstration, it takes the sting out of the medical issue being a non starter for me, unfortunately.

#1 some of you guys would make absolutely TERRIBLE Negotiators.

#2 I have so far read only ONE person claiming that the crappy more expensive Medical costs are a “non starter” and that person is on here and NOT in any of our negotiations.

AANOTOK find me ANYTHING in writing where a PMAA Company Negotiator has spoken about the Medical in any way shape or form publicly or especially that STUPID “non starter” phrase?

Just like FAKE MEDIA you say something enough times and people start to buy into it. Not me bro.

 

[NYer]

I actually didn't know that it wasn't contractual. So the best coverage plan, at least imo, but most expensive plan could be gone without notice if they choose. Not to beat a dead horse but do you know the % for value

Article 41: "The Company will provide two medical plan options, a Standard medical plan option and a Core medical plan option...Plan design features and other plan provisions in the Core medical plan option (which are not incorporated into this agreement) may change at Company discretion and advance notice of any changes will be provided to the TWU prior to implementation."