JCBA Negotiations and updates for AA Fleet

[Tim Nelson]

I have been telling you guys this for years now. Not sure why you didn't have this info already (it was available you know) The other IAM motor fund I brought up not long ago and I even stated that this fund was not the same as the IAMPF but was the same management folks from the IAM. At least the company is aware on how bad it is as they want nothing to do with the IAMPF. Yes Tim, you guys need to run to the hills away from this pension they are trying to get in. They continue to get cut, some for the 3rd time. Just look over at the teamsters pension at UPS.

You can check this site way back to 2003 and i have been telling my brothers and sisters that they will continually get hosed with the iam pension due to the new laws, structure, and age or the participants that simply cant sustain the plan. Half of my pension was already cut and more will be cut soon. People just dont listen cuz they would rather listen to the union boss salesmen who have to sell it to continue getting their union salary commission. Now im gonna have to be forced to bail out my own pension again because most people dont listen and rent out thrir brain to others who exploit them. In about 18 months or less, lus members will realize they got lied to and hosed when they no longer have good health care and have no pension or 401 and have to work till they are 65. So sad.

 

[Tim Nelson]

Actually I was somewhat shocked to find out that my postings that the IAM pension plan was a $47 million concession was actually lower than the actual concession.
The dreadful IAM pension plan was a $48.2 million dollar concession from the 401k that the company contributed to.

I'm not sure why you mention the 401k unless you are talking about the passenger service group. The IAM agreed with the company to suspend all contribution in fleet's 401k and make only small % contributions to the IAM pension fund. It's truly the worst retirement situation on the property & one of the worst retirement contribution plans in the industry or America in general.

Most work groups have upgraded to definded contribution plans, while the IAM has stuck its fleet workers members with a defined benefit plan that has a tiny contribution going into it. The IAM pension plan is the equivalent of driving a model T ford today. It just doesn't make 'good sense' to keep an outdated plan that isn't even considered a good defined benefit plan.

Workers I have spoke with see the IAM pension plan as a very strong reason to vote against the IAM.
Workers want retirement options that give portability, access to funds for mortgage & college or health related things, cash outs, etc.
The alternative is to have a plan [IAM plan] that lacks portability, heavy restrictions, and a real risk of suspended payouts.

When the election is ordered, true scenerios will be shown to unpack the IAM BS on this matter.

regards,

That is one quote from 2003.

 

[Traymark]

It survived 2 bankruptcies, and 2 more CBA's after that.

And there it is, the same lame circular argument.
It's been explained, repeatedly.
You are welcome to vote "no", good luck with that.

 

[WeAAsles]

I look at it differently. This isnt an "accumulation? Our 2014 was a stand alone. Our wage loa was stand alone. The 2014 contract wasnt 1A and this 1B.

So i dont look at it as an accumlation of benefits/ concessions since 2014. I dont feel i owe any quid pro.. to the company or any kind of tax for ratifying 2014.
Obviously you look at it differently as its your turn now. As twu, i cant deny it looks like a goodie. As lus, i dont like the tradeoff and cost neutral feel. Not sure of the language regarding pt rules/limits but that changed.
Other lus may like this contract, im sure many will. Just speaking for myself from ord. If i were in jax and was grandfathered then maybe it would have a better feel.

Wrong Tim. It is 1A and 1B. You NEVER would have gotten 1A without the AA Merger. I/We/LAA also would NOT be where we are now without the merger as well.

BTW Tim. I firmly believe your "handlers" at Ford and Harrison (Jerry Glass) are using you. I don't think all the items you posted have been agreed to yet. F & H is providing that info to you so "THEY" can negotiate directly with the Members on the outstanding (Final) pieces of the puzzle.

Well nothing anyone can do about it anyway, so might as well see where it goes?

(And BTW no I would NOT sell your side out just so I can capitalize. I'm not really built that way)

 

[Tim Nelson]

Wrong Tim. It is 1A and 1B. You NEVER would have gotten 1A without the AA Merger. I/We/LAA also would NOT be where we are now without the merger as well.

BTW Tim. I firmly believe your "handlers" at Ford and Harrison (Jerry Glass) are using you. I don't think all the items you posted have been agreed to yet. F & H is providing that info to you so "THEY" can negotiate directly with the Members on the outstanding (Final) pieces of the puzzle.

Well nothing anyone can do about it anyway, so might as well see where it goes?

(And BTW no I would NOT sell your side out just so I can capitalize. I'm not really built that way)

I dont think you would either. I think you are an ahole but so am i. I just believe you are biased since you are not iam.

 

[AANOTOK]

Looking over what Tim posted, I would agree on the face of it, the T/A would pass fairly easily on the TWU side in my opinion. It's obviously and enhancement in almost every area. I personally would like to have more clarity on the use of part time, and exactly how many they would carry. I know to some, OT rules such as the rumor PT is offered and exhausted before FT gets their turn might be a non starter for some, as will a significantly altered CS Policy. Will those change enough minds to swing an approval to a no vote, don't know. There is going to be some unhappy folks on both sides as NYer noted earlier, but from that posting, much will be on the IAM side.

 

[robbedagain]

Tim lets hypothetically say 2 bucks for each of the LUS employees goes into the IAMPF and say next yr the IAMPF slices chunk off it off to me that would pretty much be a waste of all that money the company would put into it at 2 bucks for every hr each individual LUS works?

 

[Traymark]

Robbed, you might as well have built a camp fire and used that money for kindling, same thing.

 

[Talos]

Looking over what Tim posted, I would agree on the face of it, the T/A would pass fairly easily on the TWU side in my opinion. It's obviously and enhancement in almost every area. I personally would like to have more clarity on the use of part time, and exactly how many they would carry. I know to some, OT rules such as the rumor PT is offered and exhausted before FT gets their turn might be a non starter for some, as will a significantly altered CS Policy. Will those change enough minds to swing an approval to a no vote, don't know. There is going to be some unhappy folks on both sides as NYer noted earlier, but from that posting, much will be on the IAM side.

Word is the company wanted a large increase in PT workers. To give PT priority over FT will not go over at all. Also to increase PT by any large margin will not be accepted. The CS policy will also be a strong consideration by many. I don't think anyone wants to pay for the contract with other concessions. I hope they don't give us a contract proposal that just restores much of what we have and takes in other areas.

 

[NYer]

Looking over what Tim posted, I would agree on the face of it, the T/A would pass fairly easily on the TWU side in my opinion. It's obviously and enhancement in almost every area. I personally would like to have more clarity on the use of part time, and exactly how many they would carry. I know to some, OT rules such as the rumor PT is offered and exhausted before FT gets their turn might be a non starter for some, as will a significantly altered CS Policy. Will those change enough minds to swing an approval to a no vote, don't know. There is going to be some unhappy folks on both sides as NYer noted earlier, but from that posting, much will be on the IAM side.

Tim's "hot news" seems to have some of the things the TWU Members are looking for but the details will determine the level of support.

--I guess the wages will be popular, hopefully, the percentages in the coming years is also attractive.

--The LUS medical piece is not a surprise.

--The Scope on the cities doesn't sound promising but then again this information is from a LUS perspective.

--A bump in holidays is not a surprise either.

--Double-time is nice to have, but not something that has historically hasn't been abundant when it is about OT but beneficial if it extends to holidays.

--We already get paid suspensions (a plus for IAM).

--We already get OT bypasses paid (a plus for IAM).

--Shift differential will be a plus.

--A bump in lead pay may be the IAM leads to bring them to $2.09 of the TWU premium (a plus for IAM).

--Any "fuzzy" PT language could be detrimental.

--A signing bonus is a plus.

--More sick days is not a surprise.

 

[Albert]

Traymark,
Please tell me who the "other folks they would have to change" are? Please define "only slightly less costly". It survived 2 bankruptcies, and 2 more CBA's after that. Why is it a must have now for the company? We may have been about $10 less than everybody else, but in 2014 we were brought to the same as you and kept our insurance in that CBA. Why wasn't our insurance plans put in line with LAA's with that agreement? I just do not agree that because everybody else has this insurance that we HAVE to accept it. That to me is BS. It's like saying that everybody else has a crap sandwich for lunch so we have to have one also. Bullcrap.

Where the heck do you get $10 we were at $20.56 at merger was AA (and everyone else) getting 30 an hour? Wow

 

[Albert]

Tim's "hot news" seems to have some of the things the TWU Members are looking for but the details will determine the level of support.

--I guess the wages will be popular, hopefully, the percentages in the coming years is also attractive.

--The LUS medical piece is not a surprise.

--The Scope on the cities doesn't sound promising but then again this information is from a LUS perspective.

--A bump in holidays is not a surprise either.

--Double-time is nice to have, but not something that has historically hasn't been abundant when it is about OT but beneficial if it extends to holidays.

--We already get paid suspensions (a plus for IAM).

--We already get OT bypasses paid (a plus for IAM).

--Shift differential will be a plus.

--A bump in lead pay may be the IAM leads to bring them to $2.09 of the TWU premium (a plus for IAM).

--Any "fuzzy" PT language could be detrimental.

--A signing bonus is a plus.

--More sick days is not a surprise.

Do you remember if the other groups received a signing bonus?If they didn't cross that off. Also $32 sounds kind of on the high end, maybe if you include differential.

 

[Albert]

Did the question confuse you bob@las-AA?

Maybe the answer would validate what I said earlier, that you washed out.

Take all the time you need.

Leave Bob alone, while the rest of the country braces for the eclipse Bob sits in the Strip club parking lot waiting for the club to open pretty much oblivious to whats going on outside.

 

[AANOTOK]

Do you remember if the other groups received a signing bonus?If they didn't cross that off. Also $32 sounds kind of on the high end, maybe if you include differential.

I may be wrong but I don't recall the other groups receiving a signing bonus. I THOUGHT the LUS F/A's got a supplement check to help offset the increase in healthcare premiums.

 

[robbedagain]

If the company wanted to have large number of PT esp for OT whats to stop FT from basically dropping to PT for the purpose of doing OT