JCBA Negotiations and updates for AA Fleet

[charlie Brown]

That is why I asked if this could possibly be why a mediator or arbitrator was brought in to consult.
Will AA planners be merged seniority wise or under LUS planners??
 
But yes, I'm speaking TWU.

No, that's not why. The AA planners have already been acreeted into the current LUS contract. If you want my opinion, they will be done the same way the IAM has done all work groups. They will take the seniority list that the company currently has, and they will be integrated by that date. Like I stated before. This is how the IAM claims they have always done. If someone knows of a group they have done differently? Please let me know.

 

[P. REZ]

Many of those tower peeps havent even been in fleet service, while others have been in management....but me thinks the iam will agree with management to give them full blown doh and will blow by several of you on the system seniority.

That is exactly what happened when US merged with AW. AW Tower was non Union at the time and they got their full seniority. What is the right thing to do? Have them put in and start day one? Seniority is like politics and religion, if you speak about it, an argument is sure to ensue.

P. Rez

 

[AANOTOK]

No, that's not why. The AA planners have already been acreeted into the current LUS contract. If you want my opinion, they will be done the same way the IAM has done all work groups. They will take the seniority list that the company currently has, and they will be integrated by that date. Like I stated before. This is how the IAM claims they have always done. If someone knows of a group they have done differently? Please let me know.

Obviously I don't know if the IAM has done it any differently, but as you stated, the TWU has. Appreciate the replies and your opinion.
Thanks
 
Let me add, being same job, two airlines merging, I don't have a problem with the way it was done.

 

[robbedagain]

thx CB   thats pretty much what I thought as well  

 

[charlie Brown]

Obviously I don't know if the IAM has done it any differently, but as you stated, the TWU has. Appreciate the replies and your opinion.
Thanks
 
Let me add, being same job, two airlines merging, I don't have a problem with the way it was done.

Well I have always personally been one to argue date of entry into classification. The problem now is, that AA is made up of soo many different mergers and acquisitions they aren't going to change anything now. They will do what they have always done with seniority. This is so no groups from the past can have a new argument. I know a lot of TWA folks out there that would love to go back and retain all of their time, but I just don't see it happening.

 

[Ramp Rogue]

Roque
Just wondering if you can name me a work group that has been non union that ever came into the IAM and started with day one seniority?

 
If someone from stores, maintenance, passenger service, or management decided that they wanted to come to the ramp, their classification seniority would start the first day they work on the ramp. That is why only very junior people transfer. They don't want to lose their bidding seniority.
There was a woman in cargo recently that was forced to the ramp. She didn't want to work the ramp. She wanted to transfer to passenger service. She was allowed to go, but she had to start with zero bidding seniority. But she did keep her vacation bidding date.
 
Rogue…..

 

[Ramp Rogue]

That is exactly what happened when US merged with AW. AW Tower was non Union at the time and they got their full seniority. What is the right thing to do? Have them put in and start day one? Seniority is like politics and religion, if you speak about it, an argument is sure to ensue.

P. Rez

 
That is where the problem lies. If you give one person their full seniority, you have to give it to everyone. If you don't, you're going to have animosity running rampant on the ramp. Morale will be lower than it already is, because some will feel cheated, and rightfully so. 
 
Rogue…..

 

[charlie Brown]

If someone from stores, maintenance, passenger service, or management decided that they wanted to come to the ramp, their classification seniority would start the first day they work on the ramp. That is why only very junior people transfer. They don't want to lose their bidding seniority.
There was a woman in cargo recently that was forced to the ramp. She didn't want to work the ramp. She wanted to transfer to passenger service. She was allowed to go, but she had to start with zero bidding seniority. But she did keep her vacation bidding date.
 
Rogue…..

This post is different from your other. First management has never been able to carry their seniority into a unionized work group. And as for the others above, that is going from one union shop to another. You stated the IAM always has had non union groups coming into the IAM start at day one seniority. I can't think of any, and I was hoping you knew of some since you posted that post. Just like fleet when we came into the union. We carried whatever seniority the company had given us. Same with the Aw merger. And now they are doing the same with this merger. My point is, when you argue your point to treat all the same. They will tell you that's exactly what they are doing. They let everyone carry the date the company has given them.

 

[JFK Fleet Service]

The IAM wanted them in the fleet service classification,deal with it.
 
The tower people weren't exactly overjoyed they got crammed into the IAM.Now you think they should get new hire seniority dates? 
 
One issue poster has one issue.

 

[JFK Fleet Service]

 
That is where the problem lies. If you give one person their full seniority, you have to give it to everyone. If you don't, you're going to have animosity running rampant on the ramp. Morale will be lower than it already is, because some will feel cheated, and rightfully so. 
 
Rogue…..

 
$30.17 an hour can buy some good therapy.

 

[La Li Lu Le Lo]

If someone from stores, maintenance, passenger service, or management decided that they wanted to come to the ramp, their classification seniority would start the first day they work on the ramp. That is why only very junior people transfer. They don't want to lose their bidding seniority.

That is exactly why the seniority system is so busted.
 
Take my experience for example.
 
I started in Fleet Service with the intention of transferring to electrical maintenance (I was an electrician before working for American Airlines). So instead of working a skilled job I was qualified to do I got "stuck" working in Fleet Service due to seniority "entrapment" resulting from consequences of Sept 11th. 
 
That is why I have strong feelings that seniority should be date of hire...... period. You should be able to go wherever you want IF you are qualified to do the job. 
 
I know not many agree with that opinion but I will tell you it sucks feeling "seniority locked" into a job and not being able to pursue other opportunities. 

 

[AANOTOK]

That is exactly why the seniority system is so busted.
 
Take my experience for example.
 
I started in Fleet Service with the intention of transferring to electrical maintenance (I was an electrician before working for American Airlines). So instead of working a skilled job I was qualified to do I got "stuck" working in Fleet Service due to seniority "entrapment" resulting from consequences of Sept 11th. 
 
That is why I have strong feelings that seniority should be date of hire...... period. You should be able to go wherever you want IF you are qualified to do the job. 
 
I know not many agree with that opinion but I will tell you it sucks feeling "seniority locked" into a job and not being able to pursue other opportunities. 

That total comment is a mess and worthless!

 

[charlie Brown]

The IAM wanted them in the fleet service classification,deal with it.
 
The tower people weren't exactly overjoyed they got crammed into the IAM.Now you think they should get new hire seniority dates? 
 
One issue poster has one issue.

If that's a question to me? My opinion they should keep their time like all other work groups coming into the IAM. Just asking roque if he knew of any work groups that had lost their time. If he does, then I would like to know about it.

 

[Kev3188]

That total comment is a mess and worthless!

Consider the source...

 

[JFK Fleet Service]

If that's a question to me? My opinion they should keep their time like all other work groups coming into the IAM. Just asking roque if he knew of any work groups that had lost their time. If he does, then I would like to know about it.

Not you at all CB.The poster in question only posts in regard to seniority.