JCBA Negotiations and updates for AA Fleet

[WeAAsles]

Substitute David Cassidy for Neal Cassidy. (I’m just not right, sick)

 

[NYer]

Not only do I know because I was there. I told the truth about how its all bullshit. They me be sitting there going through the motions but its all bullshit. The company put a figure on the table and lets the union figure out how to split it up. That is why Fleet service and Maintenance and Stores all split the money up different ways. But it all came down to the same thing. We took the money and lost the 8 hours pay for the the 1st to sick days. Stores kept there vacations but didn't get the money. Fleet divided theirs up and got what ever their people wanted. But in the long run. Each group ended up with the same money just spilt the baby to get there people to vote or it.

I bet you believe that there is really a legit vote for the contract too.

Absolutely. That's the process.

They have a value they want to maintain and it's up to the negotiators to prioritize. At the same time, they have must haves that cannot be bought.

 

[The Truth Will Set U Free]

Larry it’s not bullshit. What you experienced was a totally different set of circumstances.

This is not concessionary Negotiations
This is not cost neutral Negotiations
This is not AMR
This is not the same Management
This is not the same Union Leaders
This is not the same Economy
This is a transformed Airline Industry
This is not our Granpappy’s days

The figure on the table is never how much they’re reallly willing to sell you the car for either. You got to haggle.

If all that you just said is true. Then why won't they show you what was offered. Why keep the old ways of hiding it from you. Maybe because there is only a figure passed across the table buy the company. That is why they can show it to you. The NC is the one that make the rest up for each group. The company could care less how it divided up. All they car about it the cost. When this is all done. The entire NC won't even be in the room. They just don't know it yet. I will be JUST the International guys and they will strong arm the rest of the NC to take it back. The reason I was not scared to tell people the truth was because I NEVER wanted to kiss the international butt so I could one day get invited to join them. Hell I didn't even want to be there. I like being Home with my family not being in hotels drinking and eating off the backs of our local members money. These guys love spending someone else money. Take the time to look at all of your NC members expense accounts. you will be sick to see what some of them is charging. But NO ONE ever checks. I did. It made me sick.

 

[Tom Talbert 1888]

Absolutely. That's the process.

They have a value they want to maintain and it's up to the negotiators to prioritize. At the same time, they have must haves that cannot be bought.

Wrong

 

[WeAAsles]

If all that you just said is true. Then why won't they show you what was offered. Why keep the old ways of hiding it from you. Maybe because there is only a figure passed across the table buy the company. That is why they can show it to you. The NC is the one that make the rest up for each group. The company could care less how it divided up. All they car about it the cost. When this is all done. The entire NC won't even be in the room. They just don't know it yet. I will be JUST the International guys and they will strong arm the rest of the NC to take it back. The reason I was not scared to tell people the truth was because I NEVER wanted to kiss the international butt so I could one day get invited to join them. Hell I didn't even want to be there. I like being Home with my family not being in hotels drinking and eating off the backs of our local members money. These guys love spending someone else money. Take the time to look at all of your NC members expense accounts. you will be sick to see what some of them is charging. But NO ONE ever checks. I did. It made me sick.

What exactly do you want to see was offered? That thing on Jetnet? Or do you want to see what they’ve passed back and forth to each other? Seems like you’d be looking at a hell of a lot of stuff from the last 2 years.

And not all the Presidents can afford to spend the money you’re talking about. They don’t have the membership to do it. For Fleet only DFW is represented as a very large Local who has cash resources.

Besides out of curiosity where should they stay and eat? Soup and crackers at the Roach Motel? Yea that’s how I want the Company to see us. Not.

Oh and the Negotiating Committee is not in the room now so huh?

 

[The Truth Will Set U Free]

What exactly do you want to see was offered? That thing on Jetnet? Or do you want to see what they’ve passed back and forth to each other? Seems like you’d be looking at a hell of a lot of stuff from the last 2 years.

And not all the Presidents can afford to spend the money you’re talking about. They don’t have the membership to do it. For Fleet only DFW is represented as a very large Local who has cash resources.

Besides out of curiosity where should they stay and eat? Soup and crackers at the Roach Motel? Yea that’s how I want the Company to see us. Not.

Oh and the Negotiating Committee is not in the room now so huh?

You miss EVER point I was saying. Have you ever taken the time to look at how your money is being spent. If the answer to that question is no. then you should stop right there. I always checked. That is why people that know me trust me the way they do. I didn't EVER have anything to hide from our members.

As far as where they eat.I think they should eat the same way as if the money was coming out of their own pocket. Going out EVERY night and not only eating a VERY expensive meal but also making the member pay for 100 dollar drinking tab.

The reason you dont understand is because you have NEVER been there or you dont take the time to check.

As far as you caring how the company see us.. Staying in a Expensive Hotel is not going to make the company respect you. They will NEVER respect you until you learn how to take away what means the most to them. The Pilot used the log book to force the company to there knees. WE are to stupid to understand that.

Wake up people. or not. stay sleep. But stop crying if you dont have the balls to do what it takes.

 

[Tom Talbert 1888]

First of all your a mechanic posting in a fleet thread, your making accusations you cant back up.

Every penny spent that is reimbursable is on an expense report approved by the officers and members, and is made available to any member who wants to see it.

Also every penny a union spends is on public record with the DOL on the LM2.

Sounds like sour grapes to me and a red herring, this is JCBA negotiations, not concessionary bargaining.

Hotel is reimbursable and they get per diem, so they cant write off meals and drinks.

 

[swamt]

Yaawwwnnnnn

Take note that Gary is saying what I have said from the get go. That the company has promised an industry leading JCBA. As well as he notes that scope and economics will be the most contentious, which means be patient it will take the longest. This also the same guy that has in fact also promised to bring out an industry leading contract offer to the membership, we will see won't we?

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

November 21, 2017


The Executive Negotiating Committee will be meeting with American Airlines over the weeks of November 27 & December 4; in an attempt to close out open, non-economic, items specific to the groups within M&R. The expectation out of these sessions is to move into Scope & Economics for M&R and Stores, as well as continue Fleet Service, the week of December 11.



If American Airlines is serious about their promise of giving the members the “best contract” in the industry, then the week of December 11 should prove to be instrumental in bringing these negotiations closer to closure; if not bring them to a closure.



While this letter provides a perspective of what sounds like positive movement, I caution all members to remember that no agreement can be reached, until every article is closed. Historically, Scope and Economics are the most contentious areas of any airline negotiation and if I were to leave you with any other thought I would be doing you a disservice. The only way to reach the conclusion of these negotiations, with a Tentative Agreement that our members will ratify, is if American’s leaders come to the bargaining table ready and willing to negotiate the contract they promised their employees and one our members deserve.



Fraternally,

Gary Peterson

 

[WeAAsles]

You miss EVER point I was saying. Have you ever taken the time to look at how your money is being spent. If the answer to that question is no. then you should stop right there. I always checked. That is why people that know me trust me the way they do. I didn't EVER have anything to hide from our members.

As far as where they eat.I think they should eat the same way as if the money was coming out of their own pocket. Going out EVERY night and not only eating a VERY expensive meal but also making the member pay for 100 dollar drinking tab.

The reason you dont understand is because you have NEVER been there or you dont take the time to check.

As far as you caring how the company see us.. Staying in a Expensive Hotel is not going to make the company respect you. They will NEVER respect you until you learn how to take away what means the most to them. The Pilot used the log book to force the company to there knees. WE are to stupid to understand that.

Wake up people. or not. stay sleep. But stop crying if you dont have the balls to do what it takes.

Yes. I look at the LM2 for my Local every year not to mention the LM2 of other Local’s and the International. And I also have looked at expense reports and monthly expenditures in the past.

When these people are out they are not eating expensive meals every night. They’re eating a meal. People need to eat. $100 drinking tabs? Every night? I think they’d croak. Anyway alcohol is not supposed to be paid on the members dime but I’m not naive that that hasn’t been fudged here and there. But I did hang with the Negotiators one time and I saw cash being exchanged with the Bartender. (Honestly) Anyway if you don’t drink at all don’t criticize those who do.

While I’ve never been there, I talk to a few of them who are there and others who have been there in the past. I think I got a pretty good grip on it all. (Not sure if it’s something I’d ever want to do from what I know now? Certainly doesn’t sound like fun)

I think I get the rest of what you’re saying? Stop bitching and moaning if you’re not going to do what it takes. But that’s what they do don’t they. They won’t ever really put their necks on the line Larry. NYC would I think. Here in MIA, nope. We have no real leaders here.

 

[Tom Talbert 1888]

SWAMT, We?

You arent at AA, there is no We.

Stick to WN, we dont need your nose in our business at AA, when you have zero idea of what you talk about.

Worry about how in five years, you still dont have an agreement, and no talk nor end in sight.

We have four articles left in Maintenance, and I believe three in Fleet.

Take notes, thats how its done in just over two years.

 

[swamt]

If all that you just said is true. Then why won't they show you what was offered. Why keep the old ways of hiding it from you. Maybe because there is only a figure passed across the table buy the company. That is why they can show it to you. The NC is the one that make the rest up for each group. The company could care less how it divided up. All they car about it the cost. When this is all done. The entire NC won't even be in the room. They just don't know it yet. I will be JUST the International guys and they will strong arm the rest of the NC to take it back. The reason I was not scared to tell people the truth was because I NEVER wanted to kiss the international butt so I could one day get invited to join them. Hell I didn't even want to be there. I like being Home with my family not being in hotels drinking and eating off the backs of our local members money. These guys love spending someone else money. Take the time to look at all of your NC members expense accounts. you will be sick to see what some of them is charging. But NO ONE ever checks. I did. It made me sick.

You guys should be seeing everything that is offered and passed across the table. A well informed membership could support or not support the NC when they are fully informed and not let the rumors get out of control as we have all seen in the past. I agree with all you say. Just wait until T/A day and these guys will be amazed at everything that was kept from them. They will be, WTF???

First of all your a mechanic posting in a fleet thread, your making accusations you cant back up.
And how does that feel?

Every penny spent that is reimbursable is on an expense report approved by the officers and members, and is made available to any member who wants to see it.
Wrong. Approved by the officers. NOT approved by the membership. Show us anywhere that the "membership" approved the expenses been spent by officers. At union meetings the members simply approve of the minutes being "read" about expenses, not approve the amount they spent, big difference.

Also every penny a union spends is on public record with the DOL on the LM2.
Wrong. I have been on trips and seen the reports from said trips and this statement is NOT true. It is all dependant on on if all the info was entered onto the LM2. Been there done that.

Sounds like sour grapes to me and a red herring, this is JCBA negotiations, not concessionary bargaining.
The membership will make this decision on T/A day.

Hotel is reimbursable and they get per diem, so they cant write off meals and drinks.

Depends how it is written. Usually the international will pick up all the meals and drinks, so the NC members will get per diem and the international as the represenative of the business meetings held wil be able to write off all expenses tied to such "meetings". To have a meeting you simply have to talk about the nego's for a mere 5 minutes to be considered bus. meetings, that simple...

 

[swamt]

SWAMT, We?

You arent at AA, there is no We.

Stick to WN, we dont need your nose in our business at AA, when you have zero idea of what you talk about.

Worry about how in five years, you still dont have an agreement, and no talk nor end in sight.

We have four articles left in Maintenance, and I believe three in Fleet.

Take notes, thats how its done in just over two years.

Your not done. You will see on T/A day for you.

 

[Tom Talbert 1888]

You guys should be seeing everything that is offered and passed across the table. A well informed membership could support or not support the NC when they are fully informed and not let the rumors get out of control as we have all seen in the past. I agree with all you say. Just wait until T/A day and these guys will be amazed at everything that was kept from them. They will be, WTF???


Depends how it is written. Usually the international will pick up all the meals and drinks, so the NC members will get per diem and the international as the represenative of the business meetings held wil be able to write off all expenses tied to such "meetings". To have a meeting you simply have to talk about the nego's for a mere 5 minutes to be considered bus. meetings, that simple...

Once again, stick to things you know.

You couldnt be more wrong, in the IAM the District pays the cost of negotiations, directly to those on the committee, not the International.

I believe in the TWU the local pays the costs.

Everything is on the expense reports turned in, restaurant receipts arent paid for, that is what Per Diem is for.

Stick your nose back into your failed negotiations at WN, and not spread misinformation, when you have no idea how the process works with the IAM and TWU.

Things so bad and boring at WN your occupy yourself here?

You remind me of 45 and his Twitter.

 

[Tom Talbert 1888]

Your not done. You will see on T/A day for you.

Did I say WE were done?

And my TA day is around the corner, how many more years away is yours?

Nope, I clearly stated what my Negotiators have informed us of what is left, Scope, Retirement, Insurance and Premium Seniority.

Our negotiators have more dates in this month and next than you have had at WN in six months.

I suggest you concentrate on your negotiations, or lack of, and not worry about MY negotiations.

And please stop posting misinformation, when you have zero idea of what is going on, your not an AA mechanic, I have 28 years at LUS as a mechanic, you have zero years.

Things so bad at WN, you come here with misinformation and try to stir crap?

 

[swamt]

Once again, stick to things you know.

You couldnt be more wrong, in the IAM the District pays the cost of negotiations, directly to those on the committee, not the International.

I believe in the TWU the local pays the costs.

Everything is on the expense reports turned in, restaurant receipts arent paid for, that is what Per Diem is for.

Stick your nose back into your failed negotiations at WN, and not spread misinformation, when you have no idea how the process works with the IAM and TWU.

Things so bad and boring at WN your occupy yourself here?

You remind me of 45 and his Twitter.

No. Actually we are very well informed and know exactly what is going on, and the membership agrees to sit and wait. Status quo is the better of the 2. That why you hear nothing from the SWA membership. They know as they are informed, not kept in the dark.