JCBA Negotiations and updates for AA Fleet. **New and improved 2.0 version**

[ALUS78]

Weez is sending things right in the gutter. At United, the AFA took years and years and years after the UA/CO merger even though there was no cross utilization agreement. Unlike our HP/LUS Pilot situation which cost the company mightedly and may have even placed the seeds for this merger, the TWU/IAM gave up most of their leverage by agreeing to the cross utilization agreement that NYer claimed may come back to haunt us.

To be sure, I supported the Association, due to seniority that LUS all would have been hosed by these people like Weez. They cornholed TWA and tried to cornhole AirTran and would have cornholed us. So, the association served LUS well. Now that we have seniority locked in, it appears that this thing may part like the Red Sea, especially if the TWU can't hold out for 3-5 years. Make no mistake, if it goes to section 6, then it is most certainly 3-5 years.

And I also supported the cross utilization. While a massive concession, it was more than fair because it gave us a fair wage upfront and didn't subject us to these tedious talks.

But the reality that Weez is pushing is only as good as him standing with LUS for 3-5 years. My money is that weez isn't willing to make that commitment, neither the TWU. Nothing against weez since, to be sure, my perspective wouldn't be a LUS perspective if I wasn't LUS. But I am, so for us to turn down the "Take it or Leave it" that means standing with LUS for 3-5 years. Any buckle and it doesn't make any sense because a buckle would mean we actually would get less than what we are offered now. (Hint: where have we seen this before????) And therein lies the problem with Sito. Dude F's this and F's that and talks real big but once the company announces a closure of some stations and hits him in dues, he runs to the table faster than Hayes. Thus, I don't believe the TWU is willing to stand 5 years, and if that is true then serious pressure may cause a meltdown between the two unions. I mean what else can we do other than just say no? We can't strike. We will not be in mediation for at least 3 years, we have a current contract. We can picket, rally, stomp our feet but with all of the rallies in this nation, nobody really seems to care or listen anymore.

But the wise thing for the TWU is to stand with LUS for up to 5 years. That's the smart money. But the IAM has NEVER stood and flipped like a pancake after station closures. To be sure, TWU stations will close and there will be a cost to stand with the IAM. Mark my words. Always a sacrifice when standing. But we need to stand steadfast and persevere, even at the 5 year mark.

Go IAM!

Weez you're such a mess

 

[Jester]

that's a lot of money. if you can get by, more power to you.

fidelity manages my account and it warms my heart that a few guys that throw bags for a living beat fidelity by 2%-3% last year.

Just a personal peeve and possible point of correction on the matter of beating the S&P 500 or some other financial yardstick. Whenever I heard such claims I ask myself, "But with what level of risk and what transaction (commission) costs?" As a person who leans towards index funds like S&P 500 with low fees, I accept that I am taking moderate risks with a volatility of a Beta of 1. However, recently those who invest heavily in tech firms have done a few percentage points better than the S&P 500, but typically with Betas having twice as much market risks.

While higher returns are great, when bear markets happen those higher risks stocks fall much harder and the small extra gains will not offset the difference.

 

[ALUS78]

Just a personal peeve and possible point of correction on the matter of beating the S&P 500 or some other financial yardstick. Whenever I heard such claims I ask myself, "But with what level of risk and what transaction (commission) costs?" As a person who leans towards index funds like S&P 500 with low fees, I accept that I am taking moderate risks with a volatility of a Beta of 1. However, recently those who invest heavily in tech firms have done a few percentage points better than the S&P 500, but typically with Betas having twice as much market risks.

While higher returns are great, when bear markets happen those higher risks stocks fall much harder and the small extra gains will not offset the difference.

Yeah,yeah ,yeah you are still responsible for this healthcare debacle you and Rat.According to some you left your brains home that day

 

[Jester]

Tim what these AA guys dont realize is that the Us and HP pilot group never had a joint contract amd the company did fine

The Company did more than "fine"... paying the US pilots, by far, the lowest rates in the industry resulting from two trips through bankruptcy allowed Management to "polish the turd" with the books and making US more attractive as a merger partner.

 

[ALUS78]

The Company did more than "fine"... paying the US pilots, by far, the lowest rates in the industry resulting from two trips through bankruptcy allowed Management to "polish the turd" with the books and making US more attractive as a merger partner.

Indeed,... my point is they are not above letting this go on for years

 

[gulfcoast1]

Would really like to see all or most of our TWU/IAM negotiators/leaders/presidents go to DFW for the earnings meeting that will be broadcast to all our employees. Maybe PRez, CharlieBrown, and NY'er can respond to this?

I also would like to see those of us who have been here longer, and been through more of the setbacks, receive a larger signing bonus when we receive an acceptable offer. Note: the companies latest offer is not acceptable imo. The potential job loss is the main drawback for me. Does anyone have any thoughts on what a signing bonus should look like for say those with more than 25 years and those with less. How would you break it down and what do you think is reasonable for those with less time than that?

 

[WeAAsles]

To be sure airline unions are in a much better negotiating position than 10-15 years ago, but I seriously question if they are stronger than ever before. It is a different era now than the days of the CAB setting fares with a guaranteed cost-plus profits. Not to mention, the legitimate strike threat which was exercised in decades past are now all but certain to be nullified by a court injunction or Presidential order.

Yes, the massive profits are available to fund generous contracts, but the political attitudes have changes on the national level towards organized labor and strikes which affect the entire transportation network.

Again because they don’t coordinate their efforts due to a myriad of different reasons most of which have to do with interpersonal Politics and past History that divided them that they focus too much on.

Just like here people dredge up the past only to continue to keep us divided.

 

[WeAAsles]

Weez you're such a mess

I noticed Al. It’s all me again. Or it’s all me and Sito? Or Alex? Or Mike and the rat? It’s Rez, Baskett and Jester. Or maybe it’s you and Bob?

Musical chairs.

 

[ALUS78]

I noticed Al. It’s all me again. Or it’s all me and Sito? Or Alex? Or Mike and the rat? It’s Rez, Baskett and Jester. Or maybe it’s you and Bob?

Musical chairs.

Nope its YOU and I don't know how you did it

 

[WeAAsles]

Would really like to see all or most of our TWU/IAM negotiators/leaders/presidents go to DFW for the earnings meeting that will be broadcast to all our employees. Maybe PRez, CharlieBrown, and NY'er can respond to this?

I also would like to see those of us who have been here longer, and been through more of the setbacks, receive a larger signing bonus when we receive an acceptable offer. Note: the companies latest offer is not acceptable imo. The potential job loss is the main drawback for me. Does anyone have any thoughts on what a signing bonus should look like for say those with more than 25 years and those with less. How would you break it down and what do you think is reasonable for those with less time than that?

I think a reasonable signing bonus should be ZERO!! Nil, nada, squat, zippo, nothing.

I want a contract where we don’t have to have a Scooby snack thrown at us to make us jump around like a pauper chasing a dollar in the wind.

 

[ALUS78]

I noticed Al. It’s all me again. Or it’s all me and Sito? Or Alex? Or Mike and the rat? It’s Rez, Baskett and Jester. Or maybe it’s you and Bob?

Musical chairs.

Thoughts on the Weez and Rat making a You Tube video apologizing for being responsible for dumping our heathcare

 

[WeAAsles]

Nope its YOU and I don't know how you did it

Oh ok. I guess I’m just a genius man. Master of disaster, agent of chaos.

A damn little Asshat.

 

[WeAAsles]

Thoughts on the Weez and Rat making a You Tube video apologizing for being responsible for dumping our heathcare

Nah.

 

[ALUS78]

I noticed Al. It’s all me again. Or it’s all me and Sito? Or Alex? Or Mike and the rat? It’s Rez, Baskett and Jester. Or maybe it’s you and Bob?

Musical chairs.

Nope weez the only thing I'm responsible for is Inbevs stock going up and a Korean hooker buying an expensive purse

 

[La Li Lu Le Lo]

I think a reasonable signing bonus should be ZERO!! Nil, nada, squat, zippo, nothing.

I want a contract where we don’t have to have a Scooby snack thrown at us to make us jump around like a pauper chasing a dollar in the wind.

I have to agree with WeAAsles on this one. If they have to pay you off to sign a contract then the contract is not worth ****.

The value should be in the contract not in signing it.