Giving Up The Seniority Fight!

[PITbull]

PITbull - That is my point.  As reserves quit - spots open in Phoenix.  But like I've been told, we'll just have to get used to playing in the big leagues.  We've been very comfortable in our little world and it's certainly scary to think about all the changes we'll have to go through.  Everyone handles change differently.  Many are scared and, as a result - they point fingers and assess blame on the big guys.  We have no idea how this 7 bases thing even works (or at least I don't) and it took me forever to master OUR bidding system.  I can't imagine getting a handle on yours!  Hopefully, there will be a lot of information sessions and, as we learn, we'll relax a little.  Please don't take the harsh words from some of our posters personally.  Everyone at America West is so closely-knit and the unknown is frightening!  We've been treated so well by Doug, Jeff and Scott and we'd like to think that nothing bad is going to happen to us in this merger.

[post="299206"][/post]​

We as U employees feel very guarded as well with new managment. We've been abused, mistreated, and have disconnect with our managment. Our members look forward to a new managment, however, we won't just won't blindly trust like we had in the past.

This seniority thing will work out. We don't even know how the senioirty will end up in 18 months or 2 years when the fences are projected to come down. We have many, many f/as leaving this profession.

What AWA f/as need to focus on since your management is really great as you have implied, is preparing for improvements to the contract provisions. We have been thrusted with 3 major concessions that has left many of our f/as impoverished, unable to afford medical bills and medications for illnesses or to even see a physcian and tests for new dx for new illnesses. The work conditions are poor and so is our discipline program instituted in 2003. YOUR CEO sees no point in finishing your section 6 negotiations as he said to our MEC at a meeting last month. I think he must be delusional if he thinks the US Airways f/as who will have another opportunity to vote on a new merged agreement will settle for where we are now. There will be no BK to threaten or liquidation threats. They have no power or influence on our group any more. And he must be really delusional if he thinks that AWA fa/s who have kept their company out of bk, haven't had a new contract since 1999 should settle for the worst contract in the industry. Plus US Airways f/as contract is not amendable until 2012.

Don't you agree?

 

[Busdrvr]

They also have made snide remarks regarding the age of HP...asking me how long we've been around and then before I can answer spitting out "10 years or so?".

HPFlyGirl,
You've got to have a quicker wit if you're to survive this merger. the obvious answer is "About as long as you've been Bankrupt...." That's a sure fire conversation ender .

Just curious on this seniority integration, lets pretend that 'newco" see's the potential for more flying and recalls some of those furloughed U F/A's. Then right after that, there is a downturn and the furloughs start again (I know, it would NEVER happen... <_< ). Who gets the pink slip? Is the AWA F/A group the new found furlough fodder?

 

[ItsNotThatSerious]

They also have made snide remarks regarding the age of HP...asking me how long we've been around and then before I can answer spitting out "10 years or so?".

HPFlyGirl,
You've got to have a quicker wit if you're to survive this merger. the obvious answer is "About as long as you've been Bankrupt...." That's a sure fire conversation ender .

Just curious on this seniority integration, lets pretend that 'newco" see's the potential for more flying and recalls some of those furloughed U F/A's. Then right after that, there is a downturn and the furloughs start again (I know, it would NEVER happen... <_< ). Who gets the pink slip? Is the AWA F/A group the new found furlough fodder?

[post="299722"][/post]​

As an FA hired by US in 1999 and still on furlough, I must say the only fair answer to that question is the most junior FAs on property be it HP or US. Im sure all would agree.

 

[hpflygirl]

Busdrver....when one of the f/a's, with 32 yrs seniority, arrogantly told me she was soooo happy that in the near future she would only have to commute to PHX it was all I could do to not reply "dream on, girl....we're building those fences high".

 

[Busdrvr]

As an FA hired by US in 1999 and still on furlough, I must say the only fair answer to that question is the most junior FAs on property be it HP or US. Im sure all would agree.

[post="299724"][/post]​

So in other words, every HP F/A hired after your last F/A was hired is quite simply "furlough fodder". You want to know about fences? I guess if any more furloughs ever come, they will ALL come from PHX, afterwhich they will be replaced from the top by those "young" philly ladies.

As a furloughed employee myself, I think you U folks have a pretty F'uped understanding of "fair" :blink:

 

[firstamendment]

Busdrver....when one of the f/a's, with 32 yrs seniority, arrogantly told me she was soooo happy that in the near future she would only have to commute to PHX it was all I could do to not reply "dream on, girl....we're building those fences high".

[post="299747"][/post]​

That's fine, but the ones who will suffer will be the f/a's of PHX. I promise you there will be NO growth in the PHX base and any growth out of PHX would then be covered by the east coast bases. Why? Those tall fences will prevent adding f/a's to that base. Be careful what you ask for. All this posturing just might come back to kick you in the butt. But what do I know? I'm just a typical entitled US Airways 19 year f/a who seeks to see the total destruction of the AWA rank. (sarcasm) <_<

 

[Whatnow?]

So in other words, every HP F/A hired after your last F/A was hired is quite simply "furlough fodder". You want to know about fences? I guess if any more furloughs ever come, they will ALL come from PHX, afterwhich they will be replaced from the top by those "young" philly ladies.

As a furloughed employee myself, I think you U folks have a pretty F'uped understanding of "fair" :blink:

[post="299831"][/post]​

It's called seniority....everybody comes to the table with what they have.....nobody loses anything and nobody gains anything! FAIR IS FAIR....what is soo hard to understand about that? Once you change the bylaws of our AFA contracts you are setting yourself up for a MAJOR disaster down the road when another merger comes accross the table! Leave well enough alone and be GRATEFUL there is a promising chance that both of these airlines have a fighting chance of survival!

 

[Busdrvr]

It's called seniority....everybody comes to the table with what they have.....nobody loses anything and nobody gains anything! FAIR IS FAIR....what is soo hard to understand about that? Once you change the bylaws of our AFA contracts you are setting yourself up for a MAJOR disaster down the road when another merger comes accross the table! Leave well enough alone and be GRATEFUL there is a promising chance that both of these airlines have a fighting chance of survival!

[post="299923"][/post]​

It's called a JOB.....ALL of the AWA folks came to the table with one. Many of U did not. Your seniority and $8 will get you a cup of Joe at the local Starbucks. Fair is FAIR. they chose an airline, for whatever reason, that still has a need for all it's employees. They shouldn't be forced to pay for a poor decision by Wolf to overhire during the late 90's.

AWA was profitable when this deal was announced. I personally think the notion they wouldn't survive without it is dubious at best. JetBlu is smaller (or at leat was), and SWA seemed to be profitable when they were that size. And it's not like the combined company is going to be the worlds largest. YOU (or U) should be grateful, the AWA employees should be afraid......very afraid.

 

[Whatnow?]

It's called a JOB.....ALL of the AWA folks came to the table with one. Many of U did not. Your seniority and $8 will get you a cup of Joe at the local Starbucks. Fair is FAIR. they chose an airline, for whatever reason, that still has a need for all it's employees. They shouldn't be forced to pay for a poor decision by Wolf to overhire during the late 90's.

HUH? And US employees are bringing nothing! What!?! Gimme a break.....the US F/A's have been through all of this many times before....and have always sided on the FAIR side of giving EVERYBODY the seniority that is RIGHTFULLY earned depending on YOUR years of service at YOUR Airline. How is that unfair? Because US employees have been led by imbesols they should be put below AWA employees.....oh that's rich and that seems fair! NOT! You people need to get a grip on reality......don't feel sorry for the AWA F/A's this was all presented to them years ago when THEY chose to join AFA! Hello......maybe then they should have done something about it! :down:

 

[skd]

Keep in mind that seniority only counts at USAirways if you are a blockholder.

 

[firstamendment]

I just finished reading on azcentral.com of a 1 year...yes folks 1 year f/a complaining of how unfair doh is and how she will suffer because she is a single parent of a small child. GIVE ME A FRICKIN BREAK!! This is the kind of BS I'm speaking of. Quit and go to SWA. They are hiring and they have a base in PHX. What? Not senior enough? HELLO!! WAKE UP JUNIOR SMUT!! One year is farrrrrrr from paying your dues. Talk of entitlement. We at US are ALWAYS being blasted for being entitled. Well, this takes the cake. Critics, explain it and justify it ALL you want. My ears are closed. THIS kind of entitlement is why we US Airways f/as are pissed. :angry: :angry:

Many at AWA feel we at US should be put on the bottom to please you? With rumors of another merger, what will we do if say Alaska or Frontier merges with us? Staple the US f/a's down further because we are still the most senior group? You people who advocate getting rid of DOH are the scum of the earth at worse and highly ignorant at best!! STUPID, STUPID, STUPID PEOPLE!!! :down: :down:

 

[ebwgs]

Hey firstamendment I can surely understand your frustration, but tone down the "junior smut" and "stupid" name calling. All it does is further inflame and does nothing to promote understanding. I too believe in DOH, and I believe it will ultimately prevail in this merger. I understand the fear and frustration of the HP folks. They're in unchartered waters: throughout their history they've been known as an upstart, as the only remaining upstart post-derugulation, as a regional to a national to a major carrier to now, as being on the precipice of being the largest low cost carrier in the world. From my days there, HP has always wanted to be a major player. Now that's it's happening so fast they don't quite know how to handle it. I understand that.

I think their union leadership is practicing the worst kind of politics. In signing on with AFA in and endorsing all of the constitutional bylaws when they felt it was in their best interests, only to want to reject certain sections of it when they feel it's contrary to their interests, to me signals a major credibility problem whose chickens will come home to roost once the dust has settled on this merger. Can you imagine what kind of country we'd be living in if we tried to selectively enforce those parts of the constitution that we liked, and then turned a blind eye to the parts of the constitution that we didn't like? Imagine if we didn't adhere to the notion that "All men are created equal?" At one time in our history, some of our laws belied the principles set forth in the Constitution and the Declaration of Independence, but it took courage from the people and leaders of conscience to see the forest for the trees and to understand that fairness, although we are still striving for it, is a just and worthy goal, and that, to maintain the long term strength of a great nation we must dutifully adhere to those principles. For their union leadership to turn their backs on a document--and the principles therein--that they so vociferously endorsed out of political expediency is at best misinformed, and at worst disingenous.

The only way to not impact anyone's seniority in this merger, is to not have a merger. Well, we know that it's going to happen. So given the reality of the inevitablity of this transaction, the truth of it's effect is that people will be impacted. Some better, some worse than others. That's the real deal here. And there may be more consolidation ahead. One thing is for sure: to try to navigate the rough waters of industry consolidation without the compass of DOH is begging for a rendesvouz with uncertainty and ultimately disaster. That is a fact that many, though not all, at HP may not be willing to recognize right now. But if the spector of further consolidation rears it's ugly head, then those leaders who expediently fought against DOH will rue the day when their misquided efforts come back to bite them, and every other US flight attendant on the ass.

 

[skd]

Actually, Southwest is no longer hiring for flight attendants.

 

[firstamendment]

Hey firstamendment I can surely understand your frustration, but tone down the "junior smut" and "stupid" name calling. All it does is further inflame and does nothing to promote understanding.

[post="300122"][/post]​

Inflammatory comments started a loooong time ago as every single time anyone at US Airways defends their position, some jerk either from another airline or someone with VERY few years comes on and rants about how all of us at US should be damn thankful we have a job and should just shut the hell up. So I will NOT apologize until there is a change of tone towards us. I have had it. I have sat back and read and kept my mouth shut. NO MORE!! And it is insulting and sickening to hear someone with a child whine about her doh, considering SHE is the one who decided to accept a job where she knew A. senority rules and/or B. knew having a child with this job as a single parent would be difficult. Perhaps stupid is too kind a word. :blink:

 

[EyeInTheSky]

There are flight attendants with 24 years here in PIT that are single parents and having a hell of a time. The door does swing both ways.