Flight Attendant Schedulers

[LiveInAHotel]

chrisprings,

Don't become pro-company and fall into the trap. Stay informed, stay unified, stay strong, because UNITY PAYS!

operaations, is one of those pro-company employees who enjoys the speciAAl sauce AA serves to its non-union workers i.e. schedulers. operaations knows very well things will never change between f/a's and schedulers. The damage is way to deep to dig out from.

 

[L1011Ret]

Frankly, I think being a crew scheduler could be a very taxing job. Any position in which you have to tell others things they do not want to hear or do not want to do requires special abilities. Having a dialogue is a great idea. Give them a hand for doing something very difficult.

 

[Flyboy4u]

I received an option II trip from Miss Treasure..she thanked me for my help the week before. I really wans't doing her a favor that night it was AA I did a favor fon. ...

Thanks for continuing to take Option II trips. Do you have any clue how many of us are on furlough? You may not want to be a member of a union but you have no choice as a F/A. Stop being so selfish and pickup trips from other fellow F/A's so we can get our job back. <_<

 

[jimntx]

I received an option II trip from Miss Treasure..she thanked me for my help the week before. I really wans't doing her a favor that night it was AA I did a favor fon. ...

Thanks for continuing to take Option II trips. Do you have any clue how many of us are on furlough? You may not want to be a member of a union but you have no choice as a F/A. Stop being so selfish and pickup trips from other fellow F/A's so we can get our job back. <_<

Flyboy4u, your assumption about what chisprings wrote is ironic in the context of my original post where I asked everyone to give operaations the benefit of the doubt. You assume that the story is recent. The truth is that it could have happened 10 years ago.

I'm not saying it did; I don't know. But, one of the reasons that the situation never seems to get any better is that it only takes one incident for a flight attendant to dine out on that incident for the rest of his/her career. (Or, one incident of a flight attendant deliberately misconnecting at DFW for a scheduler to start his/her lament of "ALL flight attendants are lazy/deceitful/fill in the blank.")

Quite frankly, I've been guilty in the past of repeating my own "grossly unfair, cavalier treatment by a scheduler" story and conveniently leaving out the part about how long ago it happened for fear that most people might say, "Don't you think it's time to get over it and move on?"

In any relationship counseling--marriage, work, you name it--one of the FIRST rules the counselor will lay down is STICK TO THE SUBJECT AT HAND and STAY IN THE PRESENT when discussing or arguing about anything. Neither side is allowed to talk about what happened in the past or between people other than the people present in the discussion or argument. In other words, you can't counter any statement with "Well, I accept that operaations means well, but back in 1986, Homer, the devil scheduler, made me..."

I still say that statements such as, "I'd like to see things change, but they are never going to change," are just baloney. What you really mean when you make statements such as that is "I'm going to guarantee that things will never change by dredging up the past at every opportunity."

"Behold this flight attendant of sorrows. He/she was despise-ed [by scheduling]. Is there no sorrow like unto his/her sorrow?" It's just really tiresome.

While warning others not to fall into a company trap, you are doing the company's bidding. The company thinks it has a vested interest in maintaining an adversarial relationship between the schedulers and the flight attendants. The truth of the matter is that the continuous sniping between work groups--it's not just schedulers vs. flight attendants--distracts us all from the real crisis...Saving the company and thereby saving our jobs (or, in my case, saving the company so that there will be a job for me to come back to).

Now you can moan from now until doomsday about your mistreatment at the hands of [fill in the blank]. The truth is that no one else in the unemployment line with you is going to give a continental damn. It's like the pedestrian who got run over by the drunk driver. The pedestrian had the right of way, but he's just as dead as if he didn't.

 

[Flyboy4u]

Thanks Jim for your grossley overexhaggerated response...You are correct that he/she may have picked up option II trips way in the past but I hardly doubt it. Why? Because Option II has rarely ever been open for the length of time that it has since the July Furloughs. Also, I know for a fact there are F/A's out there picking up Option II trips. I also know of F/A's flying upwards of 160 hours a month. THats what I call selfish..Also, you are so quick to judge me. Until you have walked through my shoes I have every right to voice my opinion concerning selfish F/A's. As far as schedulers are concerned, I have NO COMPLAINTS. I knew what was expected of me when I took this job. It seems many F/A's complaining now are the ones who forgot what their job entailed and scheduling is part of that job. These are the very F/A's who have been thrown back on to reserve and are disgusted with the RPA. All I have to say to them is be thankful you have a job and shut up and do it.
Jim, If you think things are actually going to get better and the RIF between schedulers will go away, then all I have to say to you is WAKE UP! I agree with LiVE that it will always exist especially now. So go ahead and continue your preaching like things are going t change and we must all support each other, but remember you, like me, is standing without a job. To those on the line who think things are horrible, Then quit and get out of the way so those who want to come back are able to do so. For those who feel they must fly those hours to make a living, Save me your sob story becasue until you are in my shoes no tears should be shed!


What Unity

 

[jimntx]

Thanks Jim for your grossley overexhaggerated response...You are correct that he/she may have picked up option II trips way in the past but I hardly doubt it. Why? Because Option II has rarely ever been open for the length of time that it has since the July Furloughs. Also, I know for a fact there are F/A's out there picking up Option II trips. I also know of F/A's flying upwards of 160 hours a month. THats what I call selfish..Also, you are so quick to judge me. Until you have walked through my shoes I have every right to voice my opinion concerning selfish F/A's.
[snip]
Jim, If you think things are actually going to get better and the RIF between schedulers will go away, then all I have to say to you is WAKE UP! I agree with LiVE that it will always exist especially now. So go ahead and continue your preaching like things are going t change and we must all support each other, but remember you, like me, is standing without a job. To those on the line who think things are horrible, Then quit and get out of the way so those who want to come back are able to do so. For those who feel they must fly those hours to make a living, Save me your sob story becasue until you are in my shoes no tears should be shed!


What Unity

Oh, boo-frickin-hoo. I AM in your shoes. And, talk about "grossly over-exaggerated responses", I don't know when you were flying, but from 07SEP00 until 02JUL03--when I was flying--Option II was open just about every month at some time or another. Granted, it may be open earlier in the month now, but it was open quite often at DFW.

You know for a fact that a flight attendant flying Option II is "just being selfish." For all you know, that flight attendant may have no other choice than Option II or bankruptcy. See also your rant about the "sob story" of flight attendants who are flying Option II to make a living. As you said, don't judge until you have been in the other person's shoes.

And, get off the cross, we need the wood. I was not judging you. I was making a simple observation about the irony of your statement. As I said, I don't know whether chisprings story is recent or ancient, and neither do you.


Have a nice day. Oh, by the way, there are fleeting, ephemeral moments in each and every day when, it is, in fact, NOT about you. Try to be aware of them.

 

[operaations]

I w0ont get into that arguement but chisprings story has to be at least 6 years old Treasure has not been with the crew schedule for over 6 years

 

[Garfield1966]

Doesn't the computer recognize when someone is legal or illegal ?

I've got no complaints from pilot crew skeds. I say that only because my exposure is limited due to being a line holder. My experience has been good.

For the most part yes "if" there is a seq. The one thing that comes to mind is a monitored flight for a reserve at the ATO. If VMC sends us a message that flight XX needs a number X if it goes over 150, we just have that one leg. After the FA goes on the flight, we send a message to VMC to build the rest of the seq. There are times when TARS (the system that we use to plot reserves) does not have the ability to look at 30/7, 7D ... etc. So we have nothing to test you on. For the most part everything works out but there are times, as pointed out on this board that it fails.

 

[Garfield1966]

Thanks Jim for your grossley overexhaggerated response...You are correct that he/she may have picked up option II trips way in the past but I hardly doubt it. Why? Because Option II has rarely ever been open for the length of time that it has since the July Furloughs. Also, I know for a fact there are F/A's out there picking up Option II trips. I also know of F/A's flying upwards of 160 hours a month. THats what I call selfish..Also, you are so quick to judge me. Until you have walked through my shoes I have every right to voice my opinion concerning selfish F/A's. As far as schedulers are concerned, I have NO COMPLAINTS. I knew what was expected of me when I took this job. It seems many F/A's complaining now are the ones who forgot what their job entailed and scheduling is part of that job. These are the very F/A's who have been thrown back on to reserve and are disgusted with the RPA. All I have to say to them is be thankful you have a job and shut up and do it.
Jim, If you think things are actually going to get better and the RIF between schedulers will go away, then all I have to say to you is WAKE UP! I agree with LiVE that it will always exist especially now. So go ahead and continue your preaching like things are going t change and we must all support each other, but remember you, like me, is standing without a job. To those on the line who think things are horrible, Then quit and get out of the way so those who want to come back are able to do so. For those who feel they must fly those hours to make a living, Save me your sob story becasue until you are in my shoes no tears should be shed!


What Unity

Teasure left Crew skd close to 4 years ago.

 

[jimntx]

Doesn't the computer recognize when someone is legal or illegal ?

I've got no complaints from pilot crew skeds. I say that only because my exposure is limited due to being a line holder. My experience has been good.

For the most part yes "if" there is a seq. The one thing that comes to mind is a monitored flight for a reserve at the ATO. If VMC sends us a message that flight XX needs a number X if it goes over 150, we just have that one leg. After the FA goes on the flight, we send a message to VMC to build the rest of the seq. There are times when TARS (the system that we use to plot reserves) does not have the ability to look at 30/7, 7D ... etc. So we have nothing to test you on. For the most part everything works out but there are times, as pointed out on this board that it fails.

Then Garfield, let me add another suggestion to my list of ways to improve relations between Scheduling and the flight attendants.

If the computer can not tell you the legality and the f/a tells you that they are illegal for an overnight, then Scheduling should do a little research before sending the flight attendant out. When I get to some place like Tulsa after telling Scheduling that I have a 7-day legality problem and being sent anyway, it doesn't make me want to add you (and you know I don't mean you, personally) to my Christmas card list to be told, "You have a 7-day legality problem. You will have to stay in Tulsa until day after tomorrow."

 

[chisprings]

My option II trip I was talking about was sometime in the late 90's. However, life goes on for those of us still flying. If option II is open - that is my right to accept the trip. If option II was open on a continuous basis, I would argue we would def. be in the mode for recalling furloughed f/a's. That is simply not the case - and option II is rarely open. If it is open - and I need the money - I will take it. I have to make up for pay cuts. Taking trip's from other f/a's simply allows those who never want to fly to keep on holding to a seniority number - and that contributes to you on furlough much more than the availability of option II. I am sorry that there are any f/a's on furlough. I hope things improve for everybody. I understand that furlough must be a painful experience - but I would caution you not to get a chip on your shoulder. If you miss it here so much - you will come back with that chip and nobody will want to fly with you. Try to find a career that might be more rewarding while you are gone - because it appears that this job is going downhill.

 

[mjk]

Don't become pro-company and fall into the trap. Stay informed, stay unified, stay strong, because UNITY PAYS!

So if you're not "pro-company", that must make you "anti-company"??? :huh:

Perhaps you could learn a little from jimntx, IMHO he's pro-company and pro-union at the same time. (Never mind the fact that he's furloughed.)

You on the other hand would probably call him a sellout.

operaations, is one of those pro-company employees who enjoys the speciAAl sauce AA serves to its non-union workers i.e. schedulers.

If by wanting AA to succeed, so that he can keep his job and support his family, that makes ops a pro-company kool-aid drinker, then so be it. He's no AA homer, I can tell you that.

Special sauce? Perhaps that's the 1.5% raise we're getting in May. Woo-Hoo!!! It sure pays to be darlings of upper management!!

operaations knows very well things will never change between f/a's and schedulers. The damage is way to deep to dig out from.

By starting this thread, he's already proved you wrong.

Quit being such a freaking hater hotel, why not try to give some positive suggestions like some others have.

Otherwise start the "LiveinaHotel's anti-company, we've been getting it in the behind for decades, pity party" thread.

 

[Garfield1966]

Doesn't the computer recognize when someone is legal or illegal ?

I've got no complaints from pilot crew skeds. I say that only because my exposure is limited due to being a line holder. My experience has been good.

For the most part yes "if" there is a seq. The one thing that comes to mind is a monitored flight for a reserve at the ATO. If VMC sends us a message that flight XX needs a number X if it goes over 150, we just have that one leg. After the FA goes on the flight, we send a message to VMC to build the rest of the seq. There are times when TARS (the system that we use to plot reserves) does not have the ability to look at 30/7, 7D ... etc. So we have nothing to test you on. For the most part everything works out but there are times, as pointed out on this board that it fails.

Then Garfield, let me add another suggestion to my list of ways to improve relations between Scheduling and the flight attendants.

If the computer can not tell you the legality and the f/a tells you that they are illegal for an overnight, then Scheduling should do a little research before sending the flight attendant out. When I get to some place like Tulsa after telling Scheduling that I have a 7-day legality problem and being sent anyway, it doesn't make me want to add you (and you know I don't mean you, personally) to my Christmas card list to be told, "You have a 7-day legality problem. You will have to stay in Tulsa until day after tomorrow."

I know someone said not to rehash past problems but since this was brought up lets see what we can do with it.

Jim,

Were you legal for the one leg to Tulsa or were you not legal for SBY in the first place?

TARS is programmed to look for 7D on the first day based on the SI time for the SBY. SO I am assuming you were legal for SBY but just barely. For the sake of argument I will assume you were legal for the one leg to Tulsa, if not we can address that after you respond. First of all I understand your frustration and not wanting to spend any more time in Tulsa than required. How ever, assuming you were the only one legal at the time to take that leg (I know in DFW you were not but for the sake of argument) to Tulsa we as schedulers had one of two options. 1. Fly you to Tulsa over night you and fly you back after your 7 day problem was over or 2. Find Hotel girl and reassign her. Now as much as I would love to reassign her and piss her off, if I have a reserve that is legal for what I need to him/her to do then I have to use the reserve before I piss off a line holder. I assume that there were other reserves on SBY that were legal and my guess is the scheduler figured you did not know what you were talking about and sent you.

 

[jimntx]

Were you legal for the one leg to Tulsa or were you not legal for SBY in the first place?

TARS is programmed to look for 7D on the first day based on the SI time for the SBY. SO I am assuming you were legal for SBY but just barely. For the sake of argument I will assume you were legal for the one leg to Tulsa, if not we can address that after you respond. First of all I understand your frustration and not wanting to spend any more time in Tulsa than required. How ever, assuming you were the only one legal at the time to take that leg (I know in DFW you were not but for the sake of argument) to Tulsa we as schedulers had one of two options. 1. Fly you to Tulsa over night you and fly you back after your 7 day problem was over or 2. Find Hotel girl and reassign her. Now as much as I would love to reassign her and piss her off, if I have a reserve that is legal for what I need to him/her to do then I have to use the reserve before I piss off a line holder. I assume that there were other reserves on SBY that were legal and my guess is the scheduler figured you did not know what you were talking about and sent you.

Were you legal for the one leg to Tulsa or were you not legal for SBY in the first place?

Technically, yes. I've related this story before, but basically it is...
1. I was assigned standby from 1715 to 2315 on the last day of a 6-day stretch of reserve. I was used every single day in the first five days; so, the standby was the 6th straight day on duty. It was assigned as a "punishment"--how do I know? It appeared on my HI1 over 48 hours prior to the scheduled report time. When I was assigned a turn on the 5th day, I called scheduling and even talked with the senior on duty about the fact that I would be legal to sit a late standby like that, but I might not be legal to actually fly anywhere.
2. They put me on that 2230 flight to Tulsa. When I got there, there was no hotel and no transportation arranged for me. For that matter, there was no sequence in the computer. According to the computer, I was still sitting standby in Dallas. When I called scheduling I was told I would have to stay in Tulsa for 36 hours because of my 7-day legality!
3. I ended up waiting at the lovely Tulsa airport for over a hour--it was almost 0100 before I got to the hotel--because the hotel desk wouldn't get me a room because my HI1 said I was in Dallas, and someone took their own sweet time building a sequence for me. It was not a bad weather night or OSO in any airport that I know of.
4. It's old news. I got over it. And, the particular scheduler that I'm fairly sure was responsible for it is no longer with the company.

My point was just that some people in Scheduling have been known to send people out knowing that they were illegal by not entering a sequence until the plane has left the ground. Then, it's oops, I guess they'll have to stay in TUL or wherever until they are legal. It happened to me more than once and I know it happened to friends of mine. It was just a suggestion for the future.

 

[Flyboy4u]

OK Jim.....


Back to my point about those selfish AA F/A's....I just talked to a 13 year MIA based F/A currently on leave due to return to in July. She has 3 kids...ages 3, 7, and 13. She plans on bidding nothing but turns, when she returns to the line in July, and dropping them.....If thats not selfish then I don't know what is.....Not to mention, Many of her colleagues in the same situation plan on doing the exact same thing.....This is why we remain without a job. Another F/A told me the same thing but he is currently flying however he just started a new company but plans on dropping his schedule to fly only 36 hours a month...This is CRAZY>>>> This system AA has of allowing them to do this is unbelieveable.... Again, Answer why this is allowed? Please dont tell be its their right either? Give me a break!