firings in LGA

[Rogallo]

Back to the topic of sleeping on the job.
 
I wonder if these we're the same guys who made Hard Copy years ago? Remember the LGA 7?
 
I believe they had the defense that they had slept along side Romano back in the day!!

 

[La Li Lu Le Lo]

Now you're pulling the daddy card-really?  Not gonna go down that road.

Fine I have worked a job (glass plant) where the shift (8 hours) rotated every single week. 
 
I only used my father because he did it for almost 40 years. I only did it for 2. So you are stuck on nights.... cry me a river.

 

[Slopoke]

Holy crap, we have people making some assumptions that don’t have any hard info to back up those assumptions. Nowhere in any of the posts of this thread have I read, that the guys caught sleeping were dumping their workload on the junior guys. The one post by an AMT from that station, stated that the guys caught sleeping were hard working individuals. So how can you assume that they were coasting and letting the junior people do all of the work? Do we really know what the guys that were caught sleeping that night did in terms of workload? For all we know, they could have done an A-ck with tires and brakes and cleared the FMR. Maybe they humped butt and didn’t take any breaks to get their plane ready to go in the morning. I know of quite a few mechanics that regardless of the workload, work straight trough until all of the work is done and take an extended break at the end. Maybe they really humped butt the night before and the crew chief gave them a lighter workload so as not to burn them out.
 
Now on the other hand. If the people that were caught sleeping constantly dumped work on the junior guys, then they deserved the bad Karma. But then again, doesn’t the crew chief assign the work? The statement from AANYER regarding the junior employee that allegedly dropped a dime on those caught sleeping, would lead me to believe he did not have a good work ethic. “complained at each and every assignment that he received, complained to management about why he was being rotated”.
 
So, until someone who is in the know sheds more light on the matter, I will assume the people were, hard working individuals with good work ethic and were just doing the wrong thing at the wrong time.

 

[Kev3188]

Holy crap, we have people making some assumptions that don’t have any hard info to back up those assumptions.

You beat me to it.


As for the idea that AMT's are the only ones working death shift? I'm on the ramp, and very few people I know *haven't* done it. Nothing says fun like being outside at 0300 when it's -10...

I like the idea of a cascading work load/week; wish mine was like that!

 

[La Li Lu Le Lo]

So you took the job at AA not knowing the pay rate or the top out time?

You were "victimized"?

What did you get out of it? A good lesson that you are still whining about.

You are such an idiot.
 
That was to demonstrate GEN Y thinking and why they don't apply any worth to traditional UNION values. That was not my personal point of view.
 

This is how the newer generation thinks
 
Considering that long term careers are becoming a thing of the past what in the world makes you think I am willing to "pay dues" to make your life easier when I am earning half the pay (with a 9 year top out) just to have American Airlines kick me to the curb when they are done using me up while you stay on the clock to victimize the next wave of new hires? What do I get out of it?
 
The concept of paying your dues is about to go the way of the dinosaur. The younger generation having no expectations (and in some cases want) of lifelong employment with a single employer have no reason to put up with it. Why should they? From their perspective you can take that "paying your dues" philosophy and shove it up your backside. They could care less.
 
You are living in the past.

 It does not matter how you or I think it should be. I am in my late 30's. I am not the typical age of someone that would start a career in the airline industry. Gen Y is the generation A&P's are most likely going to have to deal with in their future. Most A&P's at AA are on far side of their careers correct? The more current A&P's that slide out and the more Gen Y's that slide in the more the culture is going to change to their way of thinking.
 
 
 
 
 

 

[La Li Lu Le Lo]

So how can you assume that they were coasting and letting the junior people do all of the work? 

I can assume that because that is all I have seen over 12 years of working for American Airlines. 
 
I have worked docks time and time again day shift had not even touched the aircraft. Naturally I want to think well of my coworkers so I go talk to the dock crew chief (after getting screwed over several times) to see if maybe there was a reason (the aircraft was on jacks, they had to test engines, illumination checks, X-rays, whatever) turns out they just did not do their work because they didn't have to and management did not give a damn. They were all to happy to coast on someone else's labor and draw a free pay check. Their sense of "seniority entitlement" was appalling. 
 
There is paying dues (working off shifts, being forced to work holidays, getting less desirable vacation times, working less desirable work assignments) then there is letting someone walk all over you.
 
There is a big difference.
 

The one post by an AMT from that station, stated that the guys caught sleeping were hard working individuals. 

It shows. 
 
You have AANYER come on here and try to paint this guy as a lazy whiner that felt entitled to privilege (the new guy is not here to give his side of the story), but then again, HE is not the one that got sleeping (6) is he? If you ask me AANYER is probably running the same scam. He does not give a damn about fair, the only thing he cares about is keeping the status quo and watching out for his buddies. UNION my ass.
 

So, until someone who is in the know sheds more light on the matter, I will assume the people were, hard working individuals with good work ethic and were just doing the wrong thing at the wrong time.

Yeah, 6 at a time. Get real.

 

[blue collar]

You are such an idiot.
 
That was to demonstrate GEN Y thinking and why they don't apply any worth to traditional UNION values. That was not my personal point of view.
 
 It does not matter how you or I think it should be. I am in my late 30's. I am not the typical age of someone that would start a career in the airline industry. Gen Y is the generation A&P's are most likely going to have to deal with in their future. Most A&P's at AA are on far side of their careers correct? The more current A&P's that slide out and the more Gen Y's that slide in the more the culture is going to change to their way of thinking.
 
 
 
 
 

You speak for gen y? I'm in my mid 30s, as are a lot of my co workers, and I don't share those views. Neither do the co workers that I surround myself with. You must not have your finger on the pulse of gen y.

 

[Slopoke]

I can assume that because that is all I have seen over 12 years of working for American Airlines. 
 
I have worked docks time and time again day shift had not even touched the aircraft. Naturally I want to think well of my coworkers so I go talk to the dock crew chief (after getting screwed over several times) to see if maybe there was a reason (the aircraft was on jacks, they had to test engines, illumination checks, X-rays, whatever) turns out they just did not do their work because they didn't have to and management did not give a damn. They were all to happy to coast on someone else's labor and draw a free pay check. Their sense of "seniority entitlement" was appalling. 
 

 
I'm an AMT with over 28 years with AA. All of the people that I know that are considered hard workers put out, wheather it be junior or senior. Just because a person has a lot of seniority does not mean he or she is a slug. AANYER stated that those individuals that were caught were hard workers, so who are you to contradict him? You don't know the people involved so you can't jump to conclusions or stereotype the people involved. If they were "nesting", meaning shoes off, pillows, blankets, lights turned off, that is asking for trouble. Like I stated in my earlier post, I don't know the particulars in this event, so I will keep and open mind and not rush to judge. You apparantly are close minded and will stereotype and rush to judge. Your quote above shows this. If this was the wild west, you would probably want to lynch them all.

 

[La Li Lu Le Lo]

You speak for gen y? I'm in my mid 30s, as are a lot of my co workers, and I don't share those views. Neither do the co workers that I surround myself with. You must not have your finger on the pulse of gen y.

Gen Y starts about 1985.  So a Gen Y would be about 29ish or younger. If you and your coworkers are mid 30's you are Gen X, same as me.
 
From what I have observed Gen Y has a very different attitude about work and careers than the generations that proceeded them.
 
I will take what you say into consideration. I have this to ask however, how long have you and your coworkers worked for American Airlines? Not specific dates just general windows please.

 

[Vortilon]

Fine I have worked a job (glass plant) where the shift (8 hours) rotated every single week. 
 
I only used my father because he did it for almost 40 years. I only did it for 2. So you are stuck on nights.... cry me a river.
 

 
Cry you a river?  Who said anything about being stuck on nights?  reread the post.
 
As long as you keep mentioning your pops 40 years of perfect attendance on night shift and others.  What did he get out of it?  Were his sick days returned to him at 1/16th of their value like AA does? 
I hope he wasn't one of those types that went to work while sick, and spread the virus or bacteria around for everybody else to enjoy.

 

[AANYER]

eoleson,
 
I have seen your post and you appear to be pretty intelligent, please don't stick your neck out on this issue.  We have a pretty good idea who this junior employee is and he and his small knit group are disgruntled employees.  The management knows it as well, but they themselves have been thrown to the wolves on the issue.  We don't have to hide or protect the employees who are going through this hearing, they are smart, intelligent and are well liked.  These guys are specialist who never take short cuts.  Without naming names, I can tell you that American Airlines maintenance and engineering staff in Tulsa specifically route broken and damage Aircraft to these particular employees to ensure that they are fixed and place back in service after "no fix no fly MEL's".  We've had Aircraft flying around with problems that only these particular specialist would touch.  We simply don't have that many great technicians like these around anymore.  If they are gone, it is American and Americans' management that looses.
 
 
I don't want to waste my time and intelligence on "La LI LU Le Lo" and whoever else is clueless on this issue.  Also, please note that the "in trouble" employees categorically, has the lowest overtime hours at the entire station.  However, the junior employee that did this stands around each and every morning salivating and asking for OT even before management has had the chance to call.  I want to be the best person and team player that I can be, however, you guys are making it tough to keep it all inside.  I not only have to protect the employees who are in trouble.  But I also have to protect the junior employee that did this, from himself.  There are many things that we simply can not disgust on this forum because management reads it.  As I said before, I'm am fully aware of all the crews and the third shift and it's not as this individual has indicated.  They were several other ridiculous alligations that were unfounded.  He used everything under the sun to encourage corporate security to show up.  As a matter of fact, he is still calling corporate security, we were informed of this.
 
To sum it up.  This is a jealous angry junior employee that would stop at nothing to ensure that his fellow teammates are as miserable and uncomfortable because of their own work arrangements and misforgivings.  This will not make them better people and it will certainly not make them wealthier.  

 

[LD3]

You know La Li, non union people have been known to sleep on the job also....

 

[La Li Lu Le Lo]

I'm an AMT with over 28 years with AA. 

Are you trying to use your seniority to validate what you are about to say?
 

All of the people that I know that are considered hard workers put out, wheather it be junior or senior. 

That is true to an extent. Where I worked however you had about 10 percent that were "hard workers" about 50 that were average (they tend to follow the pace of the least productive person, they will work hard with certain groups and do nothing with others) and about 30 percent that were absolutely worthless and about another 10 percent that tried really hard but they were just incompetent. 
 
I will say this, where I worked (TULE) aircraft went out on second shift. At the end of the aircraft cycle American Airlines does not give a damn who did what, all they know is they want that aircraft ready to go on time. Now since it goes out on 2nd shift who do you think it fell on to get the aircraft clean? Don't think day shift did not use that to their advantage. I am not going to sit here and tell you that all day shift were slugs, but there was a definite tendency. 
 
Believe it or don't. 
 

AANYER stated that those individuals that were caught were hard workers, so who are you to contradict him?

Who are you to defend him? I assume the man can speak for himself. We are not talking about 1 or 2 guys here.... we are talking about 6 individuals. Hard workers don't get busted for sleeping on the job, and they damn sure don't get busted 6 at a time.
 

You don't know the people involved so you can't jump to conclusions or stereotype the people involved.

Logic would suggest if they caught 6 at a time that this was probably a normal occurrence.
 

 If they were "nesting", meaning shoes off, pillows, blankets, lights turned off, that is asking for trouble. 

I guess I should just assume they were not doing this every night and that it was a total fluke to catch 6 of them at one time...... Do you even realize how stupid you sound?
 

I don't know the particulars in this event, so I will keep and open mind and not rush to judge. You apparantly are close minded and will stereotype and rush to judge. 

I think that way because I have seen this show before. I have seen it many many times.  You know when you watch Titanic 100 times the ship still sinks. I could buy that if it were 1 or 2 guys but the more people that get caught the more evident it is what is going on. 
 
I can tell you are a good person and that you want to see the best in people. You don't think like most people because you tend to see the potential in someone and not what they actually are. It has been my experience that people that take advantage of others find people like you tempting targets.
 

Your quote above shows this. If this was the wild west, you would probably want to lynch them all.

I think they have been pulling this scam for a long time. They have gotten away with it for a long time. Management has looked the other way because they don't want to deal with the headache. I think this young man got sick of their B.S.  and forced (pulled) management into it and their scam backfired. Like I said, I have seen this show before.
 
Do you know what they used to do to military soldiers who got caught sleeping on guard duty?

 

[Slopoke]

La Li Lu Le Lo. You worked the docks. Come out to a Class I station and see how stuff really works.

 

[AANYER]

To all,
 
The way we run the B-Ck teams at LGA are as follows:
 
The are six teams on the B-Ck Aircraft and the work is metered out based on the level of the Check.  The six teams are as follows: Avionics, Engines, Exterior, Interior, Docking and Lubrification.
 
These teams are broken down by centers of excellence.  So, each team would have an employee or two who knows the task and are familiar with the Aircraft and can assist those junior team members when the needed it.  Our B-Ck particularly was requested by all.  I have a list to prove it.  I often ask these employees what assignments I can give them that would help them in their work progression. We nurtured these guys and took them in as family when they came here from out of state.  We bought food from the best restaurants and fed them. We felt their pain and understood that they wanted special start times in order to get to work because they work out of state. They often show up late and still do.  However, I cover and ask management to give them breaks.  So you know what they say, be careful of the dog that you feed, he will also bite if given a chance.
 
 
La Li Lu Le Lo, you are totally off base on this issue.  Please talk about something else that you actually have concrete information on.  Fact, there were not six employees that were terminated at LGA.