F/A transition agreement reached

[Zarah]

Give me a break.

The attitude that the furloughed FAs should just suck it up as far as 7 weeks of training is disgusting. Why should we be jumping up and down at this opportunity? We did our 6 weeks of training already at US Airways. Yah, Yah, Yah, it is on separate certs right now, but soon it will be one company. So, we are being asked to suck it up and do 7 weeks of additional training to work for what will ultimately be the exact same company and getting attitude for not liking it? <roll eyes>

I am amazed at how heartless some people can be. Try walking in my shoes before you have the nerve to tell me how I feel. Sorry, but you have not walked in my shoes if you went to training for a different company over the course of your career. Not some unknown merger down the road. My shoes are walking the path of the here and now and lead to the exact same company. You cannot tell me you wouldn’t be screaming bloody murder if they made each and everyone AW FA go through the 6 week unpaid training at US East when the company is completely merged.

As for the argument of the length of training, sorry, they could have invested the money to come up with an abbreviated training that would be approved by the FAA. They had plenty of time to accomplish this, but elected not to. They have money to dish out to the big guys, but not to invest in the FA group who has been beaten up, used, abused, and tossed aside in some cases twice. It sucks to be kicked yet once again.

I want my job back, but there is a limit as to what I can do to get it. Relocation is not an option, 7 weeks of training when I have a 10-month-old baby is not an option, maintaining two households is not an option. This just doesn’t work for me.

This agreement will work for some and not for others. Simple as that.

There is however, no reason for the attitude that we should just suck it up.

/rant off.

 

[proudf/a]

Give me a break.

The attitude that the furloughed FAs should just suck it up as far as 7 weeks of training is disgusting. Why should we be jumping up and down at this opportunity? We did our 6 weeks of training already at US Airways. Yah, Yah, Yah, it is on separate certs right now, but soon it will be one company. So, we are being asked to suck it up and do 7 weeks of additional training to work for what will ultimately be the exact same company and getting attitude for not liking it? <roll eyes>

I am amazed at how heartless some people can be. Try walking in my shoes before you have the nerve to tell me how I feel. Sorry, but you have not walked in my shoes if you went to training for a different company over the course of your career. Not some unknown merger down the road. My shoes are walking the path of the here and now and lead to the exact same company. You cannot tell me you wouldn’t be screaming bloody murder if they made each and everyone AW FA go through the 6 week unpaid training at US East when the company is completely merged.

As for the argument of the length of training, sorry, they could have invested the money to come up with an abbreviated training that would be approved by the FAA. They had plenty of time to accomplish this, but elected not to. They have money to dish out to the big guys, but not to invest in the FA group who has been beaten up, used, abused, and tossed aside in some cases twice. It sucks to be kicked yet once again.

I want my job back, but there is a limit as to what I can do to get it. Relocation is not an option, 7 weeks of training when I have a 10-month-old baby is not an option, maintaining two households is not an option. This just doesn’t work for me.

This agreement will work for some and not for others. Simple as that.

There is however, no reason for the attitude that we should just suck it up.

/rant off.

You are right, you have ever reason to feel this way. Its a shame that you may have to decide to abandon your career choice, because of these conditions. These conditions were made this way in the hopes that most will feel this same way. The west, so that they can ease the blow of NO fence. The company so that they can hire off the street for pennies on the dollar. I am not quite sure what the East gained from this pitiful deal, but I am sure they have an agenda for selling out their own members. Enjoy your baby, he/she will be much more rewarding then the aggreviation of this deal.

 

[barbeetantrums]

I am not quite sure what the East gained from this pitiful deal, but I am sure they have an agenda for selling out their own members.

Westies are saying the same thing. They believe they will be sold out and the Easties will get the goods. It is like a parallel universe. Reminds me of the "Mirror, Mirror" episode of the original Star Trek series.

The lowly rank-and-file aren't exactly enthralled with this merger here, either.

 

[proudf/a]

Westies are saying the same thing. They believe they will be sold out and the Easties will get the goods. It is like a parallel universe. Reminds me of the "Mirror, Mirror" episode of the original Star Trek series.

The lowly rank-and-file aren't exactly enthralled with this merger here, either.

I do not see anything in this transition agreement that benefits the East side. If the West thinks its the fence issue, they couldnt be more wrong. Yes we have nearly 5000 active f/a's, but trust me, you wont see 10% of that making a mad dash for PHX. A few who want to live there, the few who already live and commute from there, the few that already commute from the west coast, thats about it.

 

[l8rd8r]

Ok, why would they insist on 7 weeks training? I know people who have been off for three years and did training in one week. If you really don't want people back than you make it damn hard for them. Who's paying for the flight out there? The east union should grieve this or the furloughed F/A's should consider a class action. Seriously. If they can train in one week there is no reason why they couldn't. The big but....you are being offered a job at a new company. I'm so sorry. Its not fair.

 

[desertgal]

I do not see anything in this transition agreement that benefits the East side.

barbeetantrums is right.
Many FAs on the west side feel they have been 'sold out' by Parker after his refusal to bargain in good faith, and refusal to agree to a reasonable fence that BOTH mec's agreed to. He is now being called a "Friendly Franke", and most now see him as just another mgmnt suit out to line his own pockets.

No one is saying that Easties should be thrilled at this offer.
The fact is, West needs to hire, and WILL hire early this Spring. We are not 'recalling' anyone, we have no one on furlough.
If NO consideration had been given to East furloughs, can you imagine the uproar? I think everyone agrees it is only fair that the jobs first be offered to East FAs.
They don't have to take it if they don't want it. It does not affect their original recall rights.

Each person's perception is a reality.
If an Eastie feels this deal is a slap in their face, then it is, and thats valid, and they shouldn't be told what they feel is wrong.
If a Westie feels this is a slap in the face, then it is to them also, and thats valid and true.

I'm not getting my panties in a wad over this; I'm worried about NEGOTIATING a SINGLE AGREEMENT, and how Doogie is chuckling to himself cuz he has us exactly where he wants us, fighting amongst ourselves. We will be weak when the time comes for solidarity.
DON'T BUY INTO IT.

 

[hulagirl]

So everyone over here is still cryin' that their corner of hell is worse? Once you all stop thinking that YOU have had it so much worse than everyone else, you will be a lot happier. The furloughees have a choice, take it or leave it. Like it or not, it is what it is....and it will be like this for the rest of your flying careers over here. We make a choice to be happy.....or to complain about every little thing. Do it, or get off the pot.

 

[Whatnow?]

Why hire? Why bring back the furloughees? If they are trying to save money, why not let 200 or so transfer from US/East to US/West? US/East is overstaffed by at least that many if not more....hence another buyout coming this Spring. Save the 10,000 dollars per each F/A in the buyout and give us all what we want and need. There would be a few days of transitional training for the East F/A's to go West but it would be a heck of a lot cheaper! And if there is no fence what's the issue? B)

 

[desertgal]

Why hire? Why bring back the furloughees? If they are trying to save money, why not let 200 or so transfer from US/East to US/West?

Two seperate certificates, two seperarte airlines, two seperate employee groups with seperate contracts.
No 'transfers' until the cert is combined and the training and procedures are aligned.

 

[Whatnow?]

Understand logistics, differences, safety procedures, etc.,. Seems as though that's all a lot of tangled paperwork....eventually this is going to happen why not speed up the process with this new "transition agreement".

 

[desertgal]

Understand logistics, differences, safety procedures, etc.,. Seems as though that's all a lot of tangled paperwork....eventually this is going to happen why not speed up the process with this new "transition agreement".

The Transition Agrement is only a very small piece of the puzzle.
Consider the FA ops manuals. They need to be identical, everyone needs to be trained and proficient on the same safety and service procedures.
Consider the Pilot manual, same thing.
Seperate procedures need to be looked at, the 'best' one chosen, or a new one created, and EVERYONE trained.
There's Operations, too. And Maintenance procedures. Everything needs to be the same, and then be approved by the FAA. Until then, the certs will remain seperate.
Mgmnt is moving to get this done asap, on this one point, I am certain.

 

[N903AW]

Give me a break.

The attitude that the furloughed FAs should just suck it up as far as 7 weeks of training is disgusting. Why should we be jumping up and down at this opportunity?

I am amazed at how heartless some people can be. This agreement will work for some and not for others. Simple as that.

There is however, no reason for the attitude that we should just suck it up.

Zarah, I would like to apologize if that is how my post came across to you because it was not intended that way. I do realize that this is not an ideal agreement (for either side). We have no control over this decision except for our own personal decision on whether to accept it or not.

I was trying to be sincere with my comments and again apologize if it was not perceived that way.

People who know me on the West side, know that I have a good character and would never maliciously or intentionally try to make someone feel bad in any situation.

 

[sharkstooth]

Where O where is the US/East MEC on this?

All that scary talent in PHL that was going to "Lead" the US F/A's so much better than Teddy did. The silence is deafening. Where is the "Gang of Three"?

Paging Mike, Laura & Terry pull you head out and lead your people. Show them you can actually organize a one car funeral.

BJ,

Off your meds again, I see.

What brought such comments, out of the blue? Do you understand that the PHL chairperson is one of six, that the others you named have no voice? Or you are just trying to sling fertilizer, hoping something will stick?

Now, tell us how a local council is supposed to even have access to do something "better" than former MEC chair, Teddy? A better relationship would be to compare yourself with a blimp, the unvarying drone of the ducted fan conveying more meaning than your blather.

 

[hpflygirl]

When I transferred into inflight from a field station after nearly 10 years of service with HP I was treated as any other new hire when it came to pay and lodging during training. I received the standard $25. per day and nothing more. But I wanted to fly, so I cashed out my vacation time when I did the transfer and used that money to get by. I was not a PHX resident either. I lived in ABQ so I not only had my regular living expenses in ABQ to take care of, I had to pay to stay in PHX as well. After training I still commuted while on reserves. Another nightmare for another thread. I did transfer in before the contract was signed, so I kept my seniority for pay (I've been topped out for awhile now), vacation, etc., but I bid with my class.

I understand the frustration of being a long term employee of a company and being treated as a "newbie". I'm not saying it's right by any means, but management is not treating you any differently than they have treated us over the years....and it is sad.

As for the lodging situation in PHX for those who decide to opt for the 8wks of training, I'm sure there are some of us here in PHX that have an extra bedroom we'd be willing to rent out for a reasonable rate. It might be a good way for some of us to get to know one another.

 

[l8rd8r]

"As for the lodging situation in PHX for those who decide to opt for the 8wks of training, I'm sure there are some of us here in PHX that have an extra bedroom we'd be willing to rent out for a reasonable rate. It might be a good way for some of us to get to know one another"
Fly, I couldn't agree with you more. Not only could we help out with room expenses we could offer up uniforms that no longer fit (due to our dieting of course)and help off set expenses. I'm certain with the new uniforms coming many of us could give up a piece or two. Let's get this party started and help transition our furloughees. Westies are Besties!!!!!