Egypt Looking for Change?

[dapoes]

Careful for what they wish for. They just might get it. Universally, democracy is being exalted. Everywhere one turns, one hears of its virtues: how democracy ensures human rights, fosters prosperity and shepherds in modernity. Yet democracy represents nothing more than the tyranny of the majority. In other words, contrary to the ideals of western liberalism, democracy does not ensure that the smallest minority, the individual is protected.

In the vast majority of circumstances, people free to choose their government get the government they desire. In Russia, the people have chosen again and again to elect KGB criminals. In Gaza, the people have chosen to elect either Hamas or Fatah, terrorist parties in perpetual war. Democracy does not a free society ensure.

Democracy is merely a system of election. it is not inherently good as its results are entirely predicated on the voters themselves. Freedom-loving peoples will generally establish a political system to protect freedom. Those who prefer strict rule will devise a political order that squelches it.

So just imagine now a state composed of people who have never known freedom, who lack a liberal western European heritage or any demonstrated proclivity towards its values, whose predominant religion demands a world incompatible with free society. And you are confident this romantic experiment in democracy is going to end well?

 

[777 fixer]

Say what??



secret police- They're called FBI in this country.

http://homelandsecurityus.com/archives/2659

http://www.aclu.org/spy-files

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2005/10/23/AR2005102301352.html

Did you read those links? None of them even talk about the President Obama, and one of them makes claims that they don't bother to back up with any hard evidence. Just as none of them show that if you say something someone in power does not like secret police will show up on your doorstep and you will disappear into the night.

If you paid attention one of the things mentioned in the Washington Post article was the Patriot Act. Who signed that into law? In fact the article was dated 2005, Obama was just a Senator. The ACLU link talks about abuses of power after 9-11. Who was president then? So I guess that means GWB was a tyrant.

You might want to try and google NKVD, Stasi, Gestapo, MSS or the PIDE and then tell me if the FBI is just like them.

 

[777 fixer]

Example of what a tyrant is

A tyrant who won the 2009 Nobel Peace Prize
and then holds a State Dinner
for the Tyrant who keeps
the 2010 winner in jail​

Good job of proving my point.

tyrant: a : an absolute ruler unrestrained by law or constitution

I don't think any president in the history of the USA fits that definition.

 

[dapoes]

Good job of proving my point.

tyrant: a : an absolute ruler unrestrained by law or constitution

I don't think any president in the history of the USA fits that definition.

Come on, you are wound way too tight over this. Seriously.

 

[777 fixer]

Come on, you are wound way too tight over this. Seriously.

I take that as an admission on your part that it was a stupid thing to say.

 

[delldude]

Did you read those links? None of them even talk about the President Obama, and one of them makes claims that they don't bother to back up with any hard evidence. Just as none of them show that if you say something someone in power does not like secret police will show up on your doorstep and you will disappear into the night.

If you paid attention one of the things mentioned in the Washington Post article was the Patriot Act. Who signed that into law? In fact the article was dated 2005, Obama was just a Senator. The ACLU link talks about abuses of power after 9-11. Who was president then? So I guess that means GWB was a tyrant.

You might want to try and google NKVD, Stasi, Gestapo, MSS or the PIDE and then tell me if the FBI is just like them.

The first link talks of the Tea Party and when did that come about....Duh........the reason?
Big Government and spending and waste....what was the response by big government??
Snooping.......You forget Napolitano's public statements about Chrisitians, patriots and gun owners? You going to tell me the government absolutely positively never ever has done any such thing ?? C'mon, you are smarter than that.

Doesn't matter if they talk about Obama or not....its about government snooping on citizens much like all those nice groups you mention. Although we don't drag citizens in and torture them outright, DOJ,FBI and others just run you through court and leave you penniless. Ever hear of accepting a plea on a lessor charge even though you know you are innocent? Because they won't stop. So, in our 'civilized' society its the same just with a different label and tactic.

You do know when we torture, much like in the airline business, they vendor it out now.....keeps that nasty stuff off your hands....

 

[777 fixer]

The first link talks of the Tea Party and when did that come about....Duh........the reason?

That first link that makes an accustion yet provides no hard evidence?

 

[dapoes]

I take that as an admission on your part that it was a stupid thing to say.

No

 

[777 fixer]

The first link talks of the Tea Party and when did that come about....Duh........the reason?
Big Government and spending and waste....what was the response by big government??
Snooping.......You forget Napolitano's public statements about Chrisitians, patriots and gun owners? You going to tell me the government absolutely positively never ever has done any such thing ?? C'mon, you are smarter than that.

Doesn't matter if they talk about Obama or not....its about government snooping on citizens much like all those nice groups you mention. Although we don't drag citizens in and torture them outright, DOJ,FBI and others just run you through court and leave you penniless. Ever hear of accepting a plea on a lessor charge even though you know you are innocent? Because they won't stop. So, in our 'civilized' society its the same just with a different label and tactic.

You do know when we torture, much like in the airline business, they vendor it out now.....keeps that nasty stuff off your hands....

All I want to know is if you agree with the remark about Obama beinga tyrant.

Is there abuse of power in the government, yes there is. But to try and portray the FBI as some sort of sinister secret police is stretching it a bit.

 

[777 fixer]

No

Then what makes him a tyrant?

 

[delldude]

All I want to know is if you agree with the remark about Obama beinga tyrant.

Is there abuse of power in the government, yes there is. But to try and portray the FBI as some sort of sinister secret police is stretching it a bit.

I would say not yet......dictator light maybe....if progressives would have kept both houses and America hadn't woke up to further intrusions into liberty and freedom then I could see it happening.
You have to be able to see the end arounds this administration does on the Legislative and Constitutional processes I hope.
Then you'll say they all do...but that doesn't make it ok.
The closest things we had to tyrants who operated without regard to the Constitution was Woodie Wilson and FDR. Look it up.
Good parallels between the chosen one and Woodie.

 

[eolesen]

I suggest y'all review how long/short the actual Iranian revolution was, folks.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Timeline_of_the_Iranian_Islamic_revolution

Anyone bookending what's going on in Egypt is an idiot... it's still a pretty fragile situation until there's a government in place. And even there, I won't be convinced for a while...

 

[Ms Tree]

Who is 'book ending' this? The over throw was step one in a long process. I have yet to hear anyone of any credibility saying that this is a done deal.

 

[delldude]

Who is 'book ending' this? The over throw was step one in a long process. I have yet to hear anyone of any credibility saying that this is a done deal.

You are aware it was all planned ahead in vivid detail don't you?

And those other countries are included.

 

[Ms Tree]

You are aware it was all planned ahead in vivid detail don't you?

And those other countries are included.

Clarify please.