EAST MEC SETTING THEIR PILOTS UP FOR FAILURE

[AWA320]

Sheesh...Yessir...it's all just going to instantly work out into one big happy bargaining unit for a shiny new contract.

Just more "Shove It" rhetoric that does NOTHING for ANYBODY.

How can you even make a valid arguement?? Your "SHOVE IT" mantra?? That was your mec's position with us all along!! You willing chose this path. Everybody told your MEC that a third party decision was a crap shoot yet you did it anyway. We have listened for two years while your MEC has told us nothing but shove it. You showed us NO respect, NO sense of fairness NO sense of equality!!! We bent over backwards to support your stupid idea of space pos travel which held up negotiations all this time. We could have had a contract long ago but YOUR MEC could help but trip over themselves time and time again and now you want to blame us for their screw up's??

Shove it!! that's all we have had from you!!!

 

[SKY HIGH]

You know what, I'm 40 I can get a job with CAL, Alaska, SWA with 20yrs left in this career but your 50yr olds plus are the ones who will have the worst time and all with no pension and minimal savings!!! Go back and reread that award again and show us how you got hurt...

sky high states: Reminds me of the "reasoning" behind the American Airlines stapling of TWA Flight Attendants. We saved you, yadda, yadda, yadda. Then 9-11 occurs and reveals what ultimately happens to your (stapled) seniority.
This is right on track with other mergers in aviation history. Pan Am and National. Delta and Western. Northwest and Republic.

THIS DECISION/ANIMOSITY will last for years. :down: :down: :down:


only stating opinions.

 

[AWA320]

sky high states: Reminds me of the "reasoning" behind the American Airlines stapling of TWA Flight Attendants. We saved you, yadda, yadda, yadda. Then 9-11 occurs and reveals what ultimately happens to your (stapled) seniority.
This is right on track with other mergers in aviation history. Pan Am and National. Delta and Western. Northwest and Republic.

THIS DECISION/ANIMOSITY will last for years. :down: :down: :down:
only stating opinions.

Misplaced anger Sky high!! Don't get mad at the other pilot group for putting on their case!! Don't be made at the union for doing what they are supposed to do DEFEND the final and binding award!! Don't even be mad at the company for not getting in the middle!! If you must be mad be mad at those who lied and misled you for the past two years...

 

[SKY HIGH]

Misplaced anger Sky high!!

sky high states: NOT AT ALL, if you were informed, you'd KNOW I got .....<drum roll>......Date of Hire.




only stating opinions

 

[AWA320]

sky high states: NOT AT ALL, if you were informed, you'd KNOW I got .....<drum roll>......Date of Hire.


only stating opinions

Good, very happy for you

 

[SKY HIGH]

Good, very happy for you

You were arguing that I had "misplaced anger", when in reality I have a "subjective view" on this issue. I'm not a pilot.



only stating opinions

 

[kubotapilot]

AWA320 et al...

I would strongly suggest that you plan on changing carriers as I don't see how LCC can continue beyond the next two years in anywhere near its present state save for maybe an additional merger where LCC will be absorbed ???

Even if the seniority award stands (which it probably will), do you honestly believe this place will function as a viable business entity in a combined operation ?

For those of you that do, please step back from your fantasy and get a reality check that a majority of East employees already have and are prepared (hopefully) for.

If you are a pilot employed at LCC you would be extremely foolhardy to not have an alternative "career" in place to subsidize your flying hobby !

Best of luck to all of you !

 

[safety stud]

Glad to hear that all the east pilots have paid off those pesky mortages on their homes and no longer owe on the kids education.

Yes, you see in the east, we have a better understanding of the harsh realities of the airline industy. We know when it is better to fight for what WE believe in...

I feel better now seeing as how were are headed to the unemployment line together!!

Misery loves company... wouldn't you say!!!

You know what, I'm 40 I can get a job with CAL, Alaska, SWA with 20yrs left in this career but your 50yr olds plus are the ones who will have the worst time and all with no pension and minimal savings!!!

Hey, if you can get a job with someone else, by all means, don't let the door hit you in the a$$. PBGC... and as for savings... what do you know about savings... savings can be just as simple as saving seniority...get it...

So lets all hold hands east and west and whatch the place burn to the ground...

I think you have anger issues...

Sound stupid??

Well, they are YOUR words...

So does your arguement!!

That's the nice part of arguing...There is always two sides to every story...

Go back and reread that award again and show us how you got hurt...

The east/west award has implications for all. Don't pretend people on either side won't be affected...alot of people are hurt by this award...EAST and WEST...

Just my opinion...

 

[prechilill]

Even if the seniority award stands (which it probably will), do you honestly believe this place will function as a viable business entity in a combined operation ?

The east pilots have indicated they would rather see this company fail rather than "suffer the injustices" of the arbitration award if the list stands (reference quite a few posts all over this web board).

 

[Junebug172]

"I've yet to see any proposals from AWA brothers/sisters on these boards"

What "proposals" are you looking for and why from this board? None of us here are on or were a part of the MC.

The proposals came and were discarded during negotiations and med/arb. That was time to look at proposals - not now and not on these boards.

So you'll have to accept that your only recourse is to avoid a combined operation by maintaining a LOA 93 quality of life and crappier pay scales than the West.

:huh:

 

[CV580ETOPS]

Sigh...nope, wasn't my doing on any/all of your experiences. I'm no fan of ever being a jerk to anyone jumpseating. There's evidently no shortage of serious jerks on either side of our groups.

I'm, perhaps hopelessly, trying to figure some way out of this nightmare that would prevent all out "warfare" between our groups.

PS: I don't even use a flight bag that could even handle stickers..it's fabric

exB17: "Don't start a war if you can't afford to lose it"

Understand that there's an enormous amount of sentiment out east that there's little left to "lose" by trying anything/everything.

"To say there needs to be a solution implies there is a problem."

Heavy sigh this time...I suggest that you take a trip out east to see/hear/etc.

As an interested outside observer with close ties to both USAir and AWA and frequent flier miles on both,it is safe to say that USAir has had a problem for years.It just took a baseball bat between the eyes in the form of the Nicolau
award to get everyone to sit up and take notice.I don't know what the answer is to be honest with you. But burning the house down and "handing the ashes over to the west" certainly isn't the answer.From reading some of the exchanges on this webboard,it seems to me your union leadership tried to pulled a fast one on both the AWA Union folks and the Arbitrator by calling for something that wasn't allowed in the ALPA by laws, pushed the issue to the extreme, and got their collective heads handed to them on a platter with absolutley no recourse available to you in the courts.What we're you guys thinking???

 

[prechilill]

From reading some of the exchanges on this webboard,it seems to me your union leadership tried to pulled a fast one on both the AWA Union folks and the Arbitrator by calling for something that wasn't allowed in the ALPA by laws, pushed the issue to the extreme, and got their collective heads handed to them on a platter with absolutley no recourse available to you in the courts.

That pretty much sums it up.

 

[EastUS]

What we're you guys thinking???

Cue up Animal House after the "road trip" which destroyed Flounder's brother's car, as alpa places it's consoling arm around all: "Face it Flounder...you f--ked up...you trusted us!"

 

[hp_fa]

In general, and in hindsight, here's what should have happened.

1. The parties negotiate diligently and strive to agree on all issues they can agree upon. This includes any conditional agreements based on what the arbitrator may decide on the issues being submitted for arbitration.

2. They turn any and all outstanding issues over to arbitration.

3. They live with the result.

 

[N965VJ]

2a. Slug it out on ICBs.